SCOTUS goes against EPA in a 5-4 ruling. We won’t have cheap eggs but we will have water with dookie particles in it! Thanks Trump..

[Into the Night]

I have no doubt you make your own water filters out of soda pop bottles and dirt, Terry.

The filter actually works, Sybil.
Fresh water treatment facilities use little more than a larger version of the same thing. The only real difference is the addition of chlorine.

 

[Into the Night]

Oh god I hate when clueless amateurs try to opine on issues their clueless about. I mean to say that safety is not a government responsibility is an asinine thing to say and that’s coming from someone who has seen people get killed in industrial accidents. Without these regulations which establish minimum standards of safety our roads wouldn’t be safe to live, the electrical appliances you use wouldn’t be safe, our roads and vehicles wouldn’t be safe, nor would your water be safe to drink or food safe to eat.

The government didn't write the electrical code, Mott. Why are you living in the middle of a road? That's very unsafe.
Water is perfectly safe to drink as long as it's properly treated. A government does not need to treat water. Many sources of water don't need treatment at all, such as well water.

Food is safe to eat without the government. Farmers have been doing it for thousands of years.

So let’s quickly dismiss your comment on hexavalent chromium.

Argument of the Stone fallacy.

The EPA Maximum Contaminant Level (MCL) for chromium is 100 ppb. That includes hexavalent chromium. Now keep in mind that’s the federal MCL and the States are lawfully permitted to have even stricter regulatory standards but not less strict.

The EPA does not treat water, Mott.

So please. Spare me the University of YouTube BS.

So you discard anything on the internet. That includes JPP and wherever you cut and pasted your BS from.

 

[Dutch Uncle]

You missed my point with your rant. It was safe enough before and lowering the standards didn't increase safety by anywhere close to enough to warrant the extra costs.

In the case of arsenic, I saw communities here in the Phoenix metro area have their water bill triple overnight because of that one. Generally, it was to remove 2 to 5 ppb. The EPA's cost estimates are, in my opinion for shit, and nothing you have to say on that is going to move that view.

Of course, you're also an expert on the long-term effects of arsenic in drinking water, Terry. Much more than the so-called "experts", amirite?

Arsenic

WHO fact sheet on arsenic provides key facts and information on sources of exposure, health effects, WHO response.

www.who.int

Long-term effects

The first symptoms of long-term exposure to high levels of inorganic arsenic (for example, through drinking-water and food) are usually observed in the skin, and include pigmentation changes, skin lesions and hard patches on the palms and soles of the feet (hyperkeratosis). These occur after a minimum exposure of approximately five years and may be a precursor to skin cancer.

In addition to skin cancer, long-term exposure to arsenic may also cause cancers of the bladder and lungs. The International Agency for Research on Cancer (IARC) has classified arsenic and arsenic compounds as carcinogenic to humans and has also stated that arsenic in drinking-water is carcinogenic to humans.

Other adverse health effects that may be associated with long-term ingestion of inorganic arsenic include developmental effects, diabetes, pulmonary disease and cardiovascular disease. Arsenic-induced myocardial infarction in particular can be a significant cause of excess mortality.

Arsenic is also associated with adverse pregnancy outcomes and infant mortality, with impacts on child health (1), and exposure in utero and in early childhood has been linked to increases in mortality in young adults due to multiple cancers, lung disease, heart attacks and kidney failure (2). Numerous studies have demonstrated negative impacts of arsenic exposure on cognitive development, intelligence and memory (3).

 

[Dutch Uncle]

You can't blame your problem on anybody else, Sybil.

^^^

 

[Dutch Uncle]

The filter actually works, Sybil.
Fresh water treatment facilities use little more than a larger version of the same thing. The only real difference is the addition of chlorine.

 

[Dutch Uncle]

The government didn't write the electrical code, Mott. Why are you living in the middle of a road? That's very unsafe.
Water is perfectly safe to drink as long as it's properly treated. A government does not need to treat water. Many sources of water don't need treatment at all, such as well water.

Food is safe to eat without the government. Farmers have been doing it for thousands of years.

Argument of the Stone fallacy.

The EPA does not treat water, Mott.

So you discard anything on the internet. That includes JPP and wherever you cut and pasted your BS from.

 

[Mott the Hoople]

You missed my point with your rant. It was safe enough before and lowering the standards didn't increase safety by anywhere close to enough to warrant the extra costs.

In the case of arsenic, I saw communities here in the Phoenix metro area have their water bill triple overnight because of that one. Generally, it was to remove 2 to 5 ppb. The EPA's cost estimates are, in my opinion for shit, and nothing you have to say on that is going to move that view.

And I call bullshit. Show me the documentary evidence of that. There isn’t anything I stated that can’t be backed up by doing a little research. Even if what you’re saying is true about the Phoenix area then it’s really just an indicator of how their POTW’s were already woefully obsolete as the technology used to remove arsenic and other heavy metal contaminants is a combination of adsorbtive media (like ferric hydroxide) and reverse osmosis filtration which were widely in use across the rest of the country well before the 10 ppb MCL for arsenic was put into place.

So that fact that your emotional response to being debunked on your opinions by cold hard fact from a professional who specializes in this field that you’re going to hold onto to your erroneous beliefs just further undermines your credibility.

Not to mention that the long list of verifiable facts I provided in my post was in no way intended to convince you of anything. My purpose of my post was for a qualified professional in this field with no partisan political beliefs on this issue to debunk bullshit being espoused by an uninformed amateur.

I honestly don’t care what you believe. I just provided objective non biased facts to demonstrate to the other readers of this sig that you don’t have a clue what you’re talking about.

 

[Mott the Hoople]

Federal government does not treat water supplies or enforce treating water supplies.
That is done by local and State governments.

I didn’t state that. I said that the Federal and State governments enforce the minimum standards for operating these POTW’s. I just agreed with that the actual operations of these facilities is performed at the local level.

 

[Into the Night]

And I call bullshit.

Argument of the Stone fallacy.

Show me the documentary evidence of that.

He already did. RQAA.

There isn’t anything I stated that can’t be backed up by doing a little research.

Research is not a proof or a Universal Truth.

Even if what you’re saying is true

It is.

about the Phoenix area then it’s really just an indicator of how their POTW’s were already woefully obsolete as the technology used to remove arsenic and other heavy metal contaminants is a combination of adsorbtive media (like ferric hydroxide) and reverse osmosis filtration which were widely in use across the rest of the country well before the 10 ppb MCL for arsenic was put into place.

Circular argument fallacy (fundamentalism). The ONLY reason the old allowable arsenic levels are 'obsolete' is because of arbitrary choice.

So that fact that your emotional response to being debunked on your opinions by cold hard fact from a professional who specializes in this field that you’re going to hold onto to your erroneous beliefs just further undermines your credibility.

What 'emotional response'??? 'Expert' worship. The history of safe levels of arsenic in drinking water is not a 'belief' or relgion. YOU are trying to make it one.

Not to mention that the long list of verifiable facts I provided in my post was in no way intended to convince you of anything. My purpose of my post was for a qualified professional in this field with no partisan political beliefs on this issue to debunk bullshit being espoused by an uninformed amateur.

'Expert' worship. You haven't debunked anything.

I honestly don’t care what you believe. I just provided objective non biased facts to demonstrate to the other readers of this sig that you don’t have a clue what you’re talking about.

No 'belief' here except YOURS. YOU are being the fundamentalist here. You provided nothing more than a circular argument fallacy.

 

[Into the Night]

I didn’t state that. I said that the Federal and State governments enforce the minimum standards for operating these POTW’s. I just agreed with that the actual operations of these facilities is performed at the local level.

The federal government does not treat water supplies. State and local governments do that.

 

[Mott the Hoople]

The federal government does not treat water supplies. State and local governments do that.

Are you completely dense? I already stated that of course the Feds or States don’t operate POTW’s or WWT’s unless they are operated in Federal or State owned facilities. The Federal and State governments do regulate them. Don’t you comprehend the difference?

I mean for god’s sake do you always argue with those who agree with you?

 

[Mott the Hoople]

Argument of the Stone fallacy.

He already did. RQAA.

Research is not a proof or a Universal Truth.

It is.

Circular argument fallacy (fundamentalism). The ONLY reason the old allowable arsenic levels are 'obsolete' is because of arbitrary choice.

What 'emotional response'??? 'Expert' worship. The history of safe levels of arsenic in drinking water is not a 'belief' or relgion. YOU are trying to make it one.

'Expert' worship. You haven't debunked anything.

No 'belief' here except YOURS. YOU are being the fundamentalist here. You provided nothing more than a circular argument fallacy.

Like fuck I did you blathering idiot. Jesus Christ did your Mom drop you on your head to many times when you were a kid?

 

[Into the Night]

Are you completely dense? I already stated that of course the Feds or States don’t operate POTW’s or WWT’s unless they are operated in Federal or State owned facilities.

What federal or State owned facilities?????

The Federal and State governments do regulate them.

The federal government is not State government, Hoopie.

Don’t you comprehend the difference?

Apparently YOU don't!!

I mean for god’s sake do you always argue with those who agree with you?

You aren't agreeing with me, Hoopie.

 

[Into the Night]

Like fuck I did you blathering idiot. Jesus Christ did your Mom drop you on your head to many times when you were a kid?

Random phrase. No apparent coherency. Mantra 1a. Lame.