Cancel 2018. 3
<-- sched 2, MJ sched 1
nah. the country has always had double standards. compared to the 18th and 19th centuries, we have far less double standards now. try prosecuting a white male land owner back then....
the hell that the government can put you through, just because they can
- Thread starter SmarterthanYou
- Start date
nah. the country has always had double standards. compared to the 18th and 19th centuries, we have far less double standards now. try prosecuting a white male land owner back then....
SmarterthanYou
rebel
is it any different than prosecuting a white ATF head now? or disciplining a US attorney for withholding exculpatory evidence?
Cancel 2018. 3
<-- sched 2, MJ sched 1
based on my reading of that time period, i would say it is different. i don't think now it is about color as much as power and money. see charles rangle. the government does not often prosecute itself. i believe that has never changed.
SmarterthanYou
rebel
yet we have lots of people, both government and non government give a lot of talk about 'holding them to a higher standard'. is that kind of talk that palatable to most?
Cancel 2018. 3
<-- sched 2, MJ sched 1
what specific action(s) do you propose to change it? prosecutors have discretion whether to prosecute. should we take away that discretion?
SmarterthanYou
rebel
we have grand juries, maybe we should. when we put people in charge, with a heavy responsibility, and they refuse to live up to it, we take that out of their hands.
Cancel 2018. 3
<-- sched 2, MJ sched 1
maybe. i don't know if i want that kind of discretion in the hands of a grand jury. the grand jury plays an important role, but i don't think they should have the final say. they can't negotiate with the accused for example.
SmarterthanYou
rebel
civilian oversight then? or at least remove absolute immunity.
Cancel 2018. 3
<-- sched 2, MJ sched 1
i can get on board with that. as to the absolute immunity, the laws are actually changing how much immunity they can get. slowly, but still changing. the change is most notable in federal law.
i wish you good luck, but i think that you are being foolish
SmarterthanYou
rebel
that may be, especially when i'm dealing with a society that cares less about the rule of law and more about their own ideas and sensitivities.
but how could I believe in and fight for freedom if I conformed to submission?
SmarterthanYou
rebel
more government targeting it's citizens for retribution or fun
http://www.americandailyherald.com/.../in-memoriam-andrew-wordes-enemy-of-the-state
Not surprisingly, the mainstream media has very little to say about this suicide, other than they've decided to call a single neighbor who sided with the city over Mr. Wordes and tell us that he 'alienated neighbors along the way'.
http://www.foxnews.com/us/2012/03/2...-chicken-man-may-have-blown-up-home-to-avoid/
at some point, people, you will have to wake up or be ground under the boot of uncle sam.
http://www.americandailyherald.com/.../in-memoriam-andrew-wordes-enemy-of-the-state
CHRONOLOGY OF EVENTS
* December 2008: Roswell Zoning Department issues a warning for the chickens on his property. (At that time, the City of Roswell’s Code of Ordinances said “On less than two acres you MAY NOT have livestock except for poultry and swine.”) The City decided to issue a citation anyway. Mayor Wood attempts to step in and stop the city, but the city moves forward. Both parties head to court.
* Spring 2009: Mr. Wordes hires former Georgia Governor Roy Barnes to represent him against the city. Both parties presented their cases to Judge Maurice Hilliard who issued a dismissal of the case against the Chicken Man.
* Summer 2009: The Roswell City Council rewrites the law, without a ‘grandfather clause’, to make all but 6 chickens on a property illegal–directly targeting and affecting Mr. Wordes. The law further states that the ‘legal’ chickens must remain in a permanent enclosure.**
(**Mr. Wordes property sits on a flood plain. 3-4 feet of water rises on his property when it storms. Because of this, the city would not issue a permit for a permanent enclosure, therefore making it ‘illegal’ for him to have his birds. This is important because after the storms and flooding in September 2009, with a 6 foot storm surge of Storm Water the sewer backed causing 4 feet of Storm Water and SEWAGE in the basement of his home. In order to save his home AND his chickens, Mr. Wordes borrowed a Bobcat to move the dirt around. He was subsequently issued citations for too many chickens, grading of property without a permit and too many cars on his property. The City also would not submit requests for FEMA funds for the property. The property has flooded several times since this initial flood.)
* Additionally...
* The City of Roswell contacted Mr. Wordes mortgage holder, an elderly woman who has held his mortgage for the entirety of his 16 years in his home. With the threat of liens, citations and grievances, the City pressures Wordes’ mortgage broker into SELLING the note to another broker for 50 cents on the dollar. The current mortgage broker is attempting to foreclose on Mr. Wordes home.
* Mr. Wordes reports to court for his citations after the flood. Judge Hilliard again rules in his favor stating that he is ‘grandfathered in’ to the new law, but must complete 180 hours of community service for the illegal grading and the excessive number of cars on his property. Unbeknown to him, his sentence of Community service also requested him to be on probation which he was unaware of and immediately requested that he be allowed to pay the fine.
* Mr. Wordes is harassed by the Roswell Police Department as well. He is pulled over more times than we can count, thrown in jail on multiple occasions, and given a number of petty citations. It’s common for multiple police cars to sit at the end of Mr. Wordes street and ‘wait’.
* The City of Roswell files Zoning violation for having a Nuisance property and he is appointed a Public Defender of course to be paid for by The City of Roswell. His court appointed counsel states in court that the ordinance is vague and the city will likely lose again.
* Roswell later additionally files a 55-page civil suit against Mr. Wordes in an attempt to take his property from him again charging him with having a Nuisance property. This is the first civil suit to attempt to take a man’s property in the history of Roswell. This civil suit was filed in attempt to deny Mr. Wordes his right to a public defender, as he can no longer afford to pay for representation. Fortunately because of Mr. Wordes involvement with Georgia Carry, they have provided legal representation for him.
* The City lists Mr. Wordes home on the ‘Roswell 2030 Plan’ as a green space and parks area, publicly announcing and solidifying their effort to take his property. (View the plan here http://www.roswellgov.com/DocumentView.aspx?DID=1552 –the road you’re looking for is Alpine Drive. Can you believe this? He is still the lawful owner of his property but the City has a 20-year-plan to dissolve that. Note that Mr. Wordes has offered to SELL his property to the City, but they have declined. Instead, they want to take the long and painful route of forcing him into foreclosure so the property can be purchased at a reduced price. This would also prevent Roswell from having to face pending lawsuit for damages, "inverse condemnation" and taking of his property, and the many civil rights and due process suits which would follow.
* July 2011: Mr. Wordes leaves his home to attend a political rally. When he returns home, he finds that all of his chickens have been let out and feed is all over the ground. The next day, his birds begin to die. Mr. Wordes realizes that someone has poisoned his birds. Over the course of the next few days, Mr. Wordes loses 1/3 of his livestock, including 45 baby turkeys (10 of which belonged to Roswell Mayor Jere Wood), 25 chicks and 6 adult birds. I spoke with Mr. Wordes personally and he claims there is no doubt in his mind who was behind the poisoning. He alleges that it was his next door neighbor who has rallied with the city through this entire process. You see, Mr. Wordes has a very private backyard that is surrounded by woods. From the street, however, it would appear that people were home because there were a couple of cars parked in the driveway. Unfortunately, Mr. Wordes posted on his Facebook page that he would be attending this political rally. Mr. Wordes has indications that lead him to believe that his neighbor monitors the page through other names (via his neighbors own personal website that has a page dedicated to ‘The Chicken Man’). Mr. Wordes alleges that this neighbor is the only one that would 1) know the seclusion of the property, 2) have access to the property in addition to knowing where everything is and 3) have a motive to commit such an atrocity. A police report has been filed, but is not moving forward at this point due to the lack of proof. The birds were taken to two different forensic labs to determine the source of poisoning but the necropsies have not yet returned. In the meantime, this has become an economic hardship on Mr. Wordes since he cannot sell the eggs from his hens since the poisoning.
* Mr. Wordes is due in court August 10 at 2:30pm (a specially scheduled hearing on a day the court is not usually in session). The hearing is public at the Roswell Municipal Court. He will be arguing a probation violation for missing a ‘check-in’ over the time his birds had been poisoned. At that hearing Mr Wordes is taken into custody and ordered to serve the remainder of his probation for a trumped up zoning violation amounting to 99 days in jail.
* Roswell of course invited the press and issued a press release stating Mr Wordes house is vacant and the RPD will be keeping an eye on things. Of course within hours, began the three month long ransacking and looting of his home. Everything of value was stolen or destroyed including a large collection of firearms, weapons and ammunition that in the hands of criminals puts the entire community at risk.
Mr. Wordes was foreclosed on while he was in jail for 3 months (for a minor city zoning violation). When jailed the Roswell Police refused his access to his records, to contact his Bankruptcy attorney, was refused to attend a court ordered hearing held for the benefit of him and his creditors in United States Federal Bankruptcy Court and by doing so Roswell refused to allow Mr. Wordes to provide the Bankruptcy Trustee with documentation he had ordered him to provide. That information gave the Bankruptcy Trustee the right to HALT the foreclosure on his home of 16 years while still protecting the mortgage holder.
Roswell opened their court room and held court on an unscheduled day instead of waiting until the next week and made an announcemnt to the press stating his house would be vacant and Roswell Police would keep an eye on it. It was less than 24 hours before the City Chief, Dwain Orr and The City Manager Kay Love were informed in a meeting with a prominent citizen that Mr Wordes house had already been the scene of a burglary and looting and Mr Wordes had a extensive firearms collection. Their statement was that they were not going to do anything and thanks to Roswell there is a large cache of weapons and ammo in the hands of criminals.
* December 2008: Roswell Zoning Department issues a warning for the chickens on his property. (At that time, the City of Roswell’s Code of Ordinances said “On less than two acres you MAY NOT have livestock except for poultry and swine.”) The City decided to issue a citation anyway. Mayor Wood attempts to step in and stop the city, but the city moves forward. Both parties head to court.
* Spring 2009: Mr. Wordes hires former Georgia Governor Roy Barnes to represent him against the city. Both parties presented their cases to Judge Maurice Hilliard who issued a dismissal of the case against the Chicken Man.
* Summer 2009: The Roswell City Council rewrites the law, without a ‘grandfather clause’, to make all but 6 chickens on a property illegal–directly targeting and affecting Mr. Wordes. The law further states that the ‘legal’ chickens must remain in a permanent enclosure.**
(**Mr. Wordes property sits on a flood plain. 3-4 feet of water rises on his property when it storms. Because of this, the city would not issue a permit for a permanent enclosure, therefore making it ‘illegal’ for him to have his birds. This is important because after the storms and flooding in September 2009, with a 6 foot storm surge of Storm Water the sewer backed causing 4 feet of Storm Water and SEWAGE in the basement of his home. In order to save his home AND his chickens, Mr. Wordes borrowed a Bobcat to move the dirt around. He was subsequently issued citations for too many chickens, grading of property without a permit and too many cars on his property. The City also would not submit requests for FEMA funds for the property. The property has flooded several times since this initial flood.)
* Additionally...
* The City of Roswell contacted Mr. Wordes mortgage holder, an elderly woman who has held his mortgage for the entirety of his 16 years in his home. With the threat of liens, citations and grievances, the City pressures Wordes’ mortgage broker into SELLING the note to another broker for 50 cents on the dollar. The current mortgage broker is attempting to foreclose on Mr. Wordes home.
* Mr. Wordes reports to court for his citations after the flood. Judge Hilliard again rules in his favor stating that he is ‘grandfathered in’ to the new law, but must complete 180 hours of community service for the illegal grading and the excessive number of cars on his property. Unbeknown to him, his sentence of Community service also requested him to be on probation which he was unaware of and immediately requested that he be allowed to pay the fine.
* Mr. Wordes is harassed by the Roswell Police Department as well. He is pulled over more times than we can count, thrown in jail on multiple occasions, and given a number of petty citations. It’s common for multiple police cars to sit at the end of Mr. Wordes street and ‘wait’.
* The City of Roswell files Zoning violation for having a Nuisance property and he is appointed a Public Defender of course to be paid for by The City of Roswell. His court appointed counsel states in court that the ordinance is vague and the city will likely lose again.
* Roswell later additionally files a 55-page civil suit against Mr. Wordes in an attempt to take his property from him again charging him with having a Nuisance property. This is the first civil suit to attempt to take a man’s property in the history of Roswell. This civil suit was filed in attempt to deny Mr. Wordes his right to a public defender, as he can no longer afford to pay for representation. Fortunately because of Mr. Wordes involvement with Georgia Carry, they have provided legal representation for him.
* The City lists Mr. Wordes home on the ‘Roswell 2030 Plan’ as a green space and parks area, publicly announcing and solidifying their effort to take his property. (View the plan here http://www.roswellgov.com/DocumentView.aspx?DID=1552 –the road you’re looking for is Alpine Drive. Can you believe this? He is still the lawful owner of his property but the City has a 20-year-plan to dissolve that. Note that Mr. Wordes has offered to SELL his property to the City, but they have declined. Instead, they want to take the long and painful route of forcing him into foreclosure so the property can be purchased at a reduced price. This would also prevent Roswell from having to face pending lawsuit for damages, "inverse condemnation" and taking of his property, and the many civil rights and due process suits which would follow.
* July 2011: Mr. Wordes leaves his home to attend a political rally. When he returns home, he finds that all of his chickens have been let out and feed is all over the ground. The next day, his birds begin to die. Mr. Wordes realizes that someone has poisoned his birds. Over the course of the next few days, Mr. Wordes loses 1/3 of his livestock, including 45 baby turkeys (10 of which belonged to Roswell Mayor Jere Wood), 25 chicks and 6 adult birds. I spoke with Mr. Wordes personally and he claims there is no doubt in his mind who was behind the poisoning. He alleges that it was his next door neighbor who has rallied with the city through this entire process. You see, Mr. Wordes has a very private backyard that is surrounded by woods. From the street, however, it would appear that people were home because there were a couple of cars parked in the driveway. Unfortunately, Mr. Wordes posted on his Facebook page that he would be attending this political rally. Mr. Wordes has indications that lead him to believe that his neighbor monitors the page through other names (via his neighbors own personal website that has a page dedicated to ‘The Chicken Man’). Mr. Wordes alleges that this neighbor is the only one that would 1) know the seclusion of the property, 2) have access to the property in addition to knowing where everything is and 3) have a motive to commit such an atrocity. A police report has been filed, but is not moving forward at this point due to the lack of proof. The birds were taken to two different forensic labs to determine the source of poisoning but the necropsies have not yet returned. In the meantime, this has become an economic hardship on Mr. Wordes since he cannot sell the eggs from his hens since the poisoning.
* Mr. Wordes is due in court August 10 at 2:30pm (a specially scheduled hearing on a day the court is not usually in session). The hearing is public at the Roswell Municipal Court. He will be arguing a probation violation for missing a ‘check-in’ over the time his birds had been poisoned. At that hearing Mr Wordes is taken into custody and ordered to serve the remainder of his probation for a trumped up zoning violation amounting to 99 days in jail.
* Roswell of course invited the press and issued a press release stating Mr Wordes house is vacant and the RPD will be keeping an eye on things. Of course within hours, began the three month long ransacking and looting of his home. Everything of value was stolen or destroyed including a large collection of firearms, weapons and ammunition that in the hands of criminals puts the entire community at risk.
Mr. Wordes was foreclosed on while he was in jail for 3 months (for a minor city zoning violation). When jailed the Roswell Police refused his access to his records, to contact his Bankruptcy attorney, was refused to attend a court ordered hearing held for the benefit of him and his creditors in United States Federal Bankruptcy Court and by doing so Roswell refused to allow Mr. Wordes to provide the Bankruptcy Trustee with documentation he had ordered him to provide. That information gave the Bankruptcy Trustee the right to HALT the foreclosure on his home of 16 years while still protecting the mortgage holder.
Roswell opened their court room and held court on an unscheduled day instead of waiting until the next week and made an announcemnt to the press stating his house would be vacant and Roswell Police would keep an eye on it. It was less than 24 hours before the City Chief, Dwain Orr and The City Manager Kay Love were informed in a meeting with a prominent citizen that Mr Wordes house had already been the scene of a burglary and looting and Mr Wordes had a extensive firearms collection. Their statement was that they were not going to do anything and thanks to Roswell there is a large cache of weapons and ammo in the hands of criminals.
Not surprisingly, the mainstream media has very little to say about this suicide, other than they've decided to call a single neighbor who sided with the city over Mr. Wordes and tell us that he 'alienated neighbors along the way'.
http://www.foxnews.com/us/2012/03/2...-chicken-man-may-have-blown-up-home-to-avoid/
at some point, people, you will have to wake up or be ground under the boot of uncle sam.
SmarterthanYou
rebel
Update to the Reese trial:
the jury has been handed the case. the governments case has been completely torn apart and shown to be a fabrication from start to finish.
http://www.lunatpp.org/reese-trial-goes-to-the-jury/
the jury has been handed the case. the governments case has been completely torn apart and shown to be a fabrication from start to finish.
http://www.lunatpp.org/reese-trial-goes-to-the-jury/
SmarterthanYou
rebel
what a dickhead you are. they were convicted of false statements on federal firearms forms, which most likely means that they abbreviated the state instead of spelling it out completely.
Yeah...right. They got off because the prosecution witness was scum. When and if they get released in four to six years they'll be facing new laws preventing them from being illegal gun dealers. And to think you said there were no straw purchases!
SmarterthanYou
rebel
they weren't convicted of straw purchases or selling to prohibited persons because the government entrapped them and outright lied to the jury.
Cool. Send them a post card in the slammer and let them know how much you care. They'll read it every day, over and over, for four to six years. In between her trysts with Sue the Dyke and his with Big Tyrone.
Karma!
SmarterthanYou
rebel
defendants ask for new trial, reveals prosecutor misconduct for not turning over evidence to the defense.
What started as a motion to release a former New Mexico gun dealer and his son from jail until their sentencing date for federal gun form convictions will turn into a request for a new trial, a source close to the case and courtroom observer of yesterday’s hearing in the United States District Court in Las Cruces, N.M., has informed Gun Rights Examiner. Another report, filed today by consistently informed and reliable chroniclers of the case, documents due process violations via information withheld from the defense, and reveals a key government witness against the family is himself under investigation.
http://www.wnd.com/2012/11/being-thankful-for-less-pain/
http://www.examiner.com/article/records-don-t-back-witness-for-the-prosecution-reese-gun-case
http://www.examiner.com/article/timeline-appears-to-conflict-with-agent-s-testimony-reese-case
In a further action suggesting serious government misconduct, the source claims “The prosecution filed papers with the Court a couple of weeks ago and asked the Court to keep them "’sealed from the defense.’
“That did not happen,” the source continued. “When the defense attorneys got the papers is when the decision to file a motion for a new trial was done. “The Judge [Robert C. Brack] ordered the attorneys to file the motion by Dec. 28, and the prosecution to answer so the motion will be heard the week of Jan. 14, 2013.
“The Judge was not pleased with the information the prosecution provided him in this case,” the source revealed.
That may be an understatement. An observer for the Luna County Tea Party Patriots, the group that has been doing the most comprehensive eyewitness reporting on the ordeal of the Reese family since its inception, called the hearing developments “stunning” in a must-read report posted today.
“It was serious enough that the Chief of the Criminal Division of the US Attorney’s office from Albuquerque had to come down and explain things to Judge Brack and then apologize to the judge,” the report reveals.
“What [the judge] wanted to know is why the information contained in the sealed indictment, information that the prosecutor had before the trial was concluded, wasn’t turned over as ... evidence to the defense,” the report continues, explaining how the Supreme Court has ruled that violates a defendant’s 14th Amendment right to due process.
“[T]he Chief of the Criminal Division of the US Attorney’s Office for N.M. let it be known today that XXXXX in law enforcement, who testified in the Reese trial, is under investigation by XXXXXX,” the report revealed, redacting information due to “the probability that there is an ongoing active investigation involved," but nonetheless sharing that these revelations resulted in audible gasps from courtroom observers.
“At issue is his credibility as a prosecution witness against the Reeses,” the report concluded. “During the hearing today, Mr. Gorence [the defense attorney] stated that had the jury known this information the verdict many have resulted in acquittals on all counts.”
“The judge then left the bench, and the guys were taken back to jail (in their chains and shackles) to wait until mid-January for the judge to determine if they can be released prior to the date of the new trial,” Gun Rights Examiner’s source reported.
What started as a motion to release a former New Mexico gun dealer and his son from jail until their sentencing date for federal gun form convictions will turn into a request for a new trial, a source close to the case and courtroom observer of yesterday’s hearing in the United States District Court in Las Cruces, N.M., has informed Gun Rights Examiner. Another report, filed today by consistently informed and reliable chroniclers of the case, documents due process violations via information withheld from the defense, and reveals a key government witness against the family is himself under investigation.
http://www.wnd.com/2012/11/being-thankful-for-less-pain/
http://www.examiner.com/article/records-don-t-back-witness-for-the-prosecution-reese-gun-case
http://www.examiner.com/article/timeline-appears-to-conflict-with-agent-s-testimony-reese-case
In a further action suggesting serious government misconduct, the source claims “The prosecution filed papers with the Court a couple of weeks ago and asked the Court to keep them "’sealed from the defense.’
“That did not happen,” the source continued. “When the defense attorneys got the papers is when the decision to file a motion for a new trial was done. “The Judge [Robert C. Brack] ordered the attorneys to file the motion by Dec. 28, and the prosecution to answer so the motion will be heard the week of Jan. 14, 2013.
“The Judge was not pleased with the information the prosecution provided him in this case,” the source revealed.
That may be an understatement. An observer for the Luna County Tea Party Patriots, the group that has been doing the most comprehensive eyewitness reporting on the ordeal of the Reese family since its inception, called the hearing developments “stunning” in a must-read report posted today.
“It was serious enough that the Chief of the Criminal Division of the US Attorney’s office from Albuquerque had to come down and explain things to Judge Brack and then apologize to the judge,” the report reveals.
“What [the judge] wanted to know is why the information contained in the sealed indictment, information that the prosecutor had before the trial was concluded, wasn’t turned over as ... evidence to the defense,” the report continues, explaining how the Supreme Court has ruled that violates a defendant’s 14th Amendment right to due process.
“[T]he Chief of the Criminal Division of the US Attorney’s Office for N.M. let it be known today that XXXXX in law enforcement, who testified in the Reese trial, is under investigation by XXXXXX,” the report revealed, redacting information due to “the probability that there is an ongoing active investigation involved," but nonetheless sharing that these revelations resulted in audible gasps from courtroom observers.
“At issue is his credibility as a prosecution witness against the Reeses,” the report concluded. “During the hearing today, Mr. Gorence [the defense attorney] stated that had the jury known this information the verdict many have resulted in acquittals on all counts.”
“The judge then left the bench, and the guys were taken back to jail (in their chains and shackles) to wait until mid-January for the judge to determine if they can be released prior to the date of the new trial,” Gun Rights Examiner’s source reported.