The Left and their bizarre love affair with Islam

Darla said:
I have only recently become friends with a Muslim, he is from Pakistan. He's a genius. Anyway, he recently surprised me by mentioning that he doesn't drink just before we were to attend a business social function. And he stated matter-of-factly that it was because he was religious. It's interesting being exposed to this, because he is hilarious, not at all uptight, and I curse like a truck driver around him and it doesn't seem to bother him at all. I have no idea what his views on women are, but I have yet to pick up a speck of sexism from him, so...I just leave it at that. I love being exposed to new, diverse people. Of course I've known Muslims in the past, but this is the first real relationship I can say I've had with a Muslim. (I stress this is a friendly business relationship of some depth, but business only). I would be the first one to tell him to get f'd if he started any sexist religious bullshit. I don't put up with it from anyone. But it's not come up at all. I deal with more sexist bullshit from Italian guys I know, dead serious.
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Exactly, they are people, too, as diverse as you and I, their religion ranges from mystics to Sharia zealots, just as all religions. I have a girlfriend who wears the veil and another who doesn't.
 
Rana said:
It has to be that because hating people for something they might do is ridiculous. Education is what brought the West out of the dark ages, we need to support programs that promote education in these backwards countries!
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Education is what it's all about. People who spend their time trying to end FGM say that it's the only thing that can work to stop it. You can't just persuade people that it's wrong, without a foundation of education leading up to that.

We've had our own things in the U.S. People forget - it wasn't that long ago that we had slavery, and there are still people alive today who lived through the civil rights movement. Some of the atrocities in the south were horrific, and most were done (of course) with Christianity & the cross as a backdrop.
 
Rana said:
Exactly, they are people, too, as diverse as you and I, their religion ranges from mystics to Sharia zealots, just as all religions. I have a girlfriend who wears the veil and another who doesn't.
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Yeah my brother has a close Muslim friend who does drink. It's like some Catholics don't eat meat on Friday, though no one in my family has ever practiced that.

The veil...I have never had a Muslim friend who was a woman. I can't say how I would react to that. There is a whole feminist school of thought, really it's the majority feminist view by far, that this is just another choice. Eh...I am not so tolerant, but then no one asks my permission, or has to.
 
Rana said:
FGM, like make circumcision practiced in the USA is a culture thing that because we in the USA don't practice it, perceive it as mutilation and abhor the practice.

"Many women believe that FGM is necessary to ensure acceptance by their community; they are unaware that FGM is not practised in most of the world.".

This is what I often find, outside cultures looking in have problems with others cultural practices, our own of women mutilating their bodies with plastic surgery and breast implants for acceptance.

I do not agree with fmg, but it is cultural and women in these cultures practice this willingly. It is hard or us to perceive, but for them it is part of their lives.
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Are you suggesting that male circumcision is on par with FGM, physically speaking? If so, you truly are a deranged lunatic. While I personally oppose male circumcision, it does offer some medical benefits and causes very little permanent nerve damage. FGM, on the other hand, is sheer barbarism.

The lengths you and Christiefan will go to in order to defend savagery are simply mind boggling.

"and women in these cultures practice this willingly."

Yeah, tell that to the seven or eight year old who was held down while someone used a sharp rock to mangle their genitals.

You truly are a sick individual.
 
The most amusing thing on this thread are the Feminazis doings backflips trying to justify a religion that condones raping, mutilating and killing women.

"Cultural differences"

Bwahahahahahahaa
 
Rana said:
It has to be that because hating people for something they might do is ridiculous. Education is what brought the West out of the dark ages, we need to support programs that promote education in these backwards countries!
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I thought it wasn't our place to try to change other cultures. Are you saying your beliefs are morally superior to thirty and that they must be educated in the error of their ways?

Seems very jingoistic if you ask me
 
Thing1 said:
Education is what it's all about. People who spend their time trying to end FGM say that it's the only thing that can work to stop it. You can't just persuade people that it's wrong, without a foundation of education leading up to that.

We've had our own things in the U.S. People forget - it wasn't that long ago that we had slavery, and there are still people alive today who lived through the civil rights movement. Some of the atrocities in the south were horrific, and most were done (of course) with Christianity & the cross as a backdrop.
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Exactly, women who grow up in these cultures do not realize they have a choice, the comment I posted, they do it to fit in.
 
Stargazer said:
The most amusing thing on this thread are the Feminazis doings backflips trying to justify a religion that condones raping, mutilating and killing women.

"Cultural differences"

Bwahahahahahahaa
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It is a mental illness. There really isn't any alternative explanation.
 
Rana said:
Exactly, women who grow up in these cultures do not realize they have a choice, the comment I posted, they do it to fit in.
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They have to go through their own civil rights movement, as America did throughout the 20th century for both women & minorities. And it's not like we're "done" - it's still a work in progress.

I was pretty heartened by the outcry over the rape in India. Though that isn't considered a Muslim country, it doesn't matter; they still need to be brought into the 21st century when it comes to women's rights. What we saw is definitely the start of something bigger, and with a more lasting impact (which unfortunately needed a horrific incident as a catalyst).
 
Rana said:
FGM, like make circumcision practiced in the USA is a culture thing that because we in the USA don't practice it, perceive it as mutilation and abhor the practice.

"Many women believe that FGM is necessary to ensure acceptance by their community; they are unaware that FGM is not practised in most of the world.".

This is what I often find, outside cultures looking in have problems with others cultural practices, our own of women mutilating their bodies with plastic surgery and breast implants for acceptance.

I do not agree with fmg, but it is cultural and women in these cultures practice this willingly. It is hard or us to perceive, but for them it is part of their lives.
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Many say that Muslim women take the veil, or the Hijab, willingly. I don't think I've seen it claimed they take the Burka willingly, but who knows.

I resist this idea, because IMO, they are the product of a culture that tells them this what they must do. I feel the idea of free choice, or willingness, becomes very sketchy at that point. Again, this is a difference I have with certain other feminists of my acquaintance. At times it has become heated.

The problem with all of this is, no matter what, the change has to come from within. So it really doesn't matter much what I believe. There's no doubt that where women are educated, freedom from many things becomes possible though.
 
Thing1 said:
They have to go through their own civil rights movement, as America did throughout the 20th century for both women & minorities. And it's not like we're "done" - it's still a work in progress.

I was pretty heartened by the outcry over the rape in India. Though that isn't considered a Muslim country, it doesn't matter; they still need to be brought into the 21st century when it comes to women's rights. What we saw is definitely the start of something bigger, and with a more lasting impact (which unfortunately needed a horrific incident as a catalyst).
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So you think they should accept our culture? Are you saying our culture is morally superior to theirs? If so, on what basis?
 
Thing1 said:
They have to go through their own civil rights movement, as America did throughout the 20th century for both women & minorities. And it's not like we're "done" - it's still a work in progress.

I was pretty heartened by the outcry over the rape in India. Though that isn't considered a Muslim country, it doesn't matter; they still need to be brought into the 21st century when it comes to women's rights. What we saw is definitely the start of something bigger, and with a more lasting impact (which unfortunately needed a horrific incident as a catalyst).
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Exactly! No one came here and freed our slaves, or came here and forced us to stop burning black people alive an d hanging them in the Jim Crowe south!

Conservatives are so full of shit, this is what enrages me about them! Open a history book and you will find there is pretty much nothing being done anywhere that we didn't do to native americans, and then black men, and oh, black women, forget about it, ourselves! Including not very long ago, even in the 1960's, using mass rape as a tool of terror! So give me a break.
 
Melos said:
Are you suggesting that male circumcision is on par with FGM, physically speaking? If so, you truly are a deranged lunatic. While I personally oppose male circumcision, it does offer some medical benefits and causes very little permanent nerve damage. FGM, on the other hand, is sheer barbarism.

The lengths you and Christiefan will go to in order to defend savagery are simply mind boggling.

"and women in these cultures practice this willingly."

Yeah, tell that to the seven or eight year old who was held down while someone used a sharp rock to mangle their genitals.

You truly are a sick individual.
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There are those that believe male circumcision is just as barbarous. I have never stated the position you are assigning to me.
 
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