The philosophy of freedom

[Uncensored2008]

I’m talking about YOUR possessions, you fucking idiot. Not your heirs. If you’re lucky, half the shit you “own” will go into the dumpster or end up at Good Will.

I know fucktards like you, and especially your cult leader Trump, need shit for personal validation. It’s your right!

Take a look at the Pale Blue Dot, shitstain, and try to reflect on what that means. It means that you and all that shit you think you have a right to is not even as significant as a wart on a gnats ass.

Such an angry little vermin.

I guess you learned nothing from the Tao.

Liberty and freedom are only relevant to this world. What happens when one leaves is irrelevant to the concept of freedom. Ownership of one's property - the right to be secure in one's possessions and papers is the foundation of all freedom.

The concentration of rights is in property - land and house. Personal property is contained therein and of less importance to the concept of liberty. Still, to be free one must not be subject to the state marching in and taking personal property either.

You, as a collectivist totalitarian view all things, particularly people, as the rightful property of the state. The state is supreme and all things must serve the almighty state.

I said at the outset that the fascist democrat party is anathema to liberty - you fully illustrate the truth of that statement.

 

[NiftyNiblick]

this is fact, but the other part of that problem is that most people refuse to recognize the freedom of others. freedom of speech USED to be that one could say whatever idea they needed to and everyone else would support their right to say it, not agree with it, but defend that persons right to say it. Nowadays, someone says something that offends a large group of people, they are cancelled and their livelihood destroyed.

these days it seems freedom is a four letter word

It seems that the right isn't doing much to protect the freedom of child-bearing age women.

You guys are so full of shit, STY, that we can smell you over the fucking internet.

 

[Dutch Uncle]

It seems that the right isn't doing much to protect the freedom of child-bearing age women.

You guys are so full of shit, STY, that we can smell you over the fucking internet.

Those are the guys you don't want to hand the reins of a "smooth and very efficient" government to control. There's a reason the Founders wanted the Federal government to be inefficient.

 

[Uncensored2008]

The free speech bullshit. That’s what is spewed on your right wing conspiracy sites. Complete and utter horse shit.

Freedom of speech is a "conspiracy theory."

ROFL

Just when I though you couldn't get any dumber..

Cypress, do you agree with your comrade that "freedom of speech is a conspiracy theory"?

 

[domer76]

Freedom of speech is a "conspiracy theory."

ROFL

Just when I though you couldn't get any dumber..

Cypress, do you agree with your comrade that "freedom of speech is a conspiracy theory"?

WHOOSH! Completely over your head, dumbshit.

I said that you idiots claiming Trump was merely invoking his freedom of speech when he was actually trying to use the power of his office to coerce others to break the law is from your conspiracy sites.

But, you’re too fucking stupid to understand simple English.

 

[Uncensored2008]

Bhagavad-Gita is a short little book that can be easily read in an afternoon, and it is effortless to acquire an annotated and footnoted copy of it in which scholarly experts can explain the content to you in contemporary English.

You are probably thinking of the Mahabharata, which is an enormous tome.




About 2500 plus or minus. But you made two separate points. One about a classical Hindu text.

And one about property and freedom, which you may believe was your own original thought, but came down to you from Locke by cultural osmosis.

Again with the straw man.

Stick to what I wrote.

From your own OP

About 1000 B.C., the Indian Upanishads and Bhagavad Gita set forth a dual idea of freedom defined in two senses.Both meanings are contained in the word swaraj. Philosophers conceived of swaraj in a strict political sense of rule over one’s own land.

That isn't Locke - even though your argument depends on making it be Locke.

 

[Cypress]

this is fact, but the other part of that problem is that most people refuse to recognize the freedom of others. freedom of speech USED to be that one could say whatever idea they needed to and everyone else would support their right to say it, not agree with it, but defend that persons right to say it. Nowadays, someone says something that offends a large group of people, they are cancelled and their livelihood destroyed.

these days it seems freedom is a four letter word

Freedom is a slogan used on Rightwing social media and in Republican campaign commericals.

They have never done the hard work of reflecting on what it really means, like the sages and philosophers in the OP did.


Best I can tell, freedom means to Tucker Carlson and Sean Hannity to keep taxes and regulations at a rudimentary minimum on wealth, and just let the unrestrained free markets do their magic.

 

[Uncensored2008]

I think it's lack of political will and special interests, not US constitution, that prevents us from making progress on economic and social equality. There's nothing in the US constitution that prevents universal healthcare, international treaties on climate change, a living minimum wage law.

Sure there is - free elections.

But your Reich has put a stop to those.

People do not knowingly chose there own injury. There is nothing stopping you and dumber from donating all you have to the poor. (I suggest the United Way, the end recipients get nearly 3% of proceeds!) All you need is a cot in a shelter and bowl of rice each day.

Ah, but you Marxists never, EVER live up to what you demand of others.

"Charity begins in the pocket of your neighbor." - Marxist Maxim

 

[Cypress]

Again with the straw man.

Stick to what I wrote.

From your own OP

About 1000 B.C., the Indian Upanishads and Bhagavad Gita set forth a dual idea of freedom defined in two senses.Both meanings are contained in the word swaraj. Philosophers conceived of swaraj in a strict political sense of rule over one’s own land.

That isn't Locke - even though your argument depends on making it be Locke.

You claimed I couldn't have read the Bhagavad-Gita in it entirety, and I wouldn't be able to comprehend it if I tried because it's unreadable.

That claim can only be made by someone who doesn't know what they are talking about.

Bhagavad-Gita is a short little book that can be read in an afternoon, it's not particularly hard to comprehend and absorb, especially if one has a good annotated translation.

You can get Bhagavad-Gita from the public library as a small modest little e book, and I've heard their are airport gift shops in the world that sell little paperback versions of the Bhagavad-Gita.

I've read the Bhagavad-Gita

No you haven't.

You may have read parts of it, but not in it's entirety, as it is unreadable.

 

[Uncensored2008]

It's really funny that to your ear, The Buddha, Jesus, and the sage Vyasa sound like Marxists.

There you go again assigning to others positions they never stated.

Without fallacy, you would never approach logic.

Honestly, you're far worse than dumber. He actually is quite stupid. You don't have that excuse, you're just patently dishonest.

 

[Uncensored2008]

WHOOSH! Completely over your head, dumbshit.

I said that you idiots claiming Trump was merely invoking his freedom of speech when he was actually trying to use the power of his office to coerce others to break the law is from your conspiracy sites.

But, you’re too fucking stupid to understand simple English.

That is not what you wrote, dumber.

This thread is about the philosophical construct of freedom. I understand that you are merely a drone. You have been programmed in the 24/7 Hate to focus all you are on hatred of Emmanuel Goldstein (keeps the lesser intellects from ever questioning the actions of the ruling caste,) and so there is no possibility of any subject other than your seething, burning hatred.

This is because you are in fact, quite stupid. You simply cannot operate beyond emotions fed to you by your Reich. Hate is a strong emotion that lesser creatures such as you respond to.

 

[Uncensored2008]

You claimed I couldn't have read the Bhagavad-Gita in it entirety, and I wouldn't be able to comprehend it if I tried because it's unreadable.

That claim can only be made by someone who doesn't know what they are talking about.

Bhagavad-Gita is a short little book that can be read in an afternoon, it's not particularly hard to comprehend and absorb, especially if one has a good annotated translation.

You can get Bhagavad-Gita from the public library as a small modest little e book, and I've heard their are airport gift shops in the world that sell little paperback versions of the Bhagavad-Gita.

You sure do all you can to avoid the central theme.

I take it you concede the point that the reference was not to Locke and that your straw man fallacy is merely disingenuous on your part.

Yes, I found the Bhagavad-Gita reminiscent of Vogon poetry.

Consider this,

After knowing the Truth, O Arjuna, you shall not again become deluded like this. By this knowledge you shall behold the entire creation first within Me, the Supreme Being, then within your own higher self and then see Me alone in everything. (4.35) Even if one is the most sinful of all sinners, one shall yet cross over the ocean of sin by the raft of Self-knowledge.

Then compare to,

Oh freddled gruntbuggly,Thy micturations are to me, (with big yawning)As plurdled gabbleblotchits, in midsummer morningOn a lurgid bee,That mordiously hath blurted out,Its earted jurtles, grumblingInto a rancid festering confectious organ squealer. [drowned out by moaning and screaming]
Which is which? Tough to distinguish...

 

[Cypress]

You sure do all you can to avoid the central theme.

I take it you concede the point that the reference was not to Locke and that your straw man fallacy is merely disingenuous on your part.

Yes, I found the Bhagavad-Gita reminiscent of Vogon poetry.

Consider this,

After knowing the Truth, O Arjuna, you shall not again become deluded like this. By this knowledge you shall behold the entire creation first within Me, the Supreme Being, then within your own higher self and then see Me alone in everything. (4.35) Even if one is the most sinful of all sinners, one shall yet cross over the ocean of sin by the raft of Self-knowledge.

Then compare to,

Oh freddled gruntbuggly,Thy micturations are to me, (with big yawning)As plurdled gabbleblotchits, in midsummer morningOn a lurgid bee,That mordiously hath blurted out,Its earted jurtles, grumblingInto a rancid festering confectious organ squealer. [drowned out by moaning and screaming]
Which is which? Tough to distinguish...

I like this one better.

Bhagavad-Gita, chapter 16
Fearlessness, purity of being, knowledge, generosity, discipline, sacrifice, sacred study, austerity, honesty, non-harm, truth, non-anger, letting go, peace, non-slander, kindness to living things, non-greed, gentleness, modesty, non-caprice, energy, forgiveness, resolve, cleanliness, non-aggression, non-arrogance -- those exist in one born to godly assets.

Maybe you got confused between Upanishads and Bhagavad-Gita.
I never wrote that I read Upanishads, which are a vast collection of Sanskit works. There might be 100 people in the United States who have read all the Upanishads.

I never asked or expected you to read the Bhagavad-Gita. It's not something one recommends to people.
I simply debunked your claim that i lied about reading it.

The problem with a Lockean or utilitarian definition of freedom is that it tends to underplay justice and equality.

 

[SmarterthanYou]

It seems that the right isn't doing much to protect the freedom of child-bearing age women.

what freedom would that be?

You guys are so full of shit, STY, that we can smell you over the fucking internet.

knee jerk reactionary comment by a hate filled lemming..........never saw that coming

 

[SmarterthanYou]

Freedom is a slogan used on Rightwing social media and in Republican campaign commericals.

and the left avoids the word at all costs

They have never done the hard work of reflecting on what it really means, like the sages and philosophers in the OP did.

that's probably true for most rightwingers.........their idea of freedom is as limited as the lefts idea of it. The framers of our Constitution wrote down and debated their ideas of freedom, then voted on it. It lasted less than 20 years when they realized that their power as political leaders really was restricted............so they brainwashed their supporters in to believing that they could use 'common sense' to ignore their restrictions.

Best I can tell, freedom means to Tucker Carlson and Sean Hannity to keep taxes and regulations at a rudimentary minimum on wealth, and just let the unrestrained free markets do their magic.

Like all government programs, they are poorly built, poorly run, and severely inefficient...........with that entire history as a guideline, people still think that the federal government is the only entity capable of managing the economy........brilliantly idiotic of them.

 

[domer76]

That is not what you wrote, dumber.

This thread is about the philosophical construct of freedom. I understand that you are merely a drone. You have been programmed in the 24/7 Hate to focus all you are on hatred of Emmanuel Goldstein (keeps the lesser intellects from ever questioning the actions of the ruling caste,) and so there is no possibility of any subject other than your seething, burning hatred.

This is because you are in fact, quite stupid. You simply cannot operate beyond emotions fed to you by your Reich. Hate is a strong emotion that lesser creatures such as you respond to.

That’s EXACTLY what I wrote. In response to your moronic post that 19 people are under indictment for speech. They’re not. They’re under indictment, especially Trump, for coercing people to break the law. And they did.

Your “speech” rhetoric comes from your right wing handlers, ie conspiracy sites.

 

[domer76]

I like this one better.



Maybe you got confused between Upanishads and Bhagavad-Gita.
I never wrote that I read Upanishads, which are a vast collection of Sanskit works. There might be 100 people in the United States who have read all the Upanishads.

I never asked or expected you to read the Bhagavad-Gita. It's not something one recommends to people.
I simply debunked your claim that i lied about reading it.

The problem with a Lockean or utilitarian definition of freedom is that it tends to underplay justice and equality.

“ Bhagavad-Gita, chapter 16
Fearlessness, purity of being, knowledge, generosity, discipline, sacrifice, sacred study, austerity, honesty, non-harm, truth, non-anger, letting go, peace, non-slander, kindness to living things, non-greed, gentleness, modesty, non-caprice, energy, forgiveness, resolve, cleanliness, non-aggression, non-arrogance -- those exist in one born to godly assets.”

Sounds like the Stoics, as well.

 

[domer76]

and the left avoids the word at all costs


that's probably true for most rightwingers.........their idea of freedom is as limited as the lefts idea of it. The framers of our Constitution wrote down and debated their ideas of freedom, then voted on it. It lasted less than 20 years when they realized that their power as political leaders really was restricted............so they brainwashed their supporters in to believing that they could use 'common sense' to ignore their restrictions.


Like all government programs, they are poorly built, poorly run, and severely inefficient...........with that entire history as a guideline, people still think that the federal government is the only entity capable of managing the economy........brilliantly idiotic of them.

I’ve worked in both the public and private sectors. The most poorly run are the corporations. By far.

 

[Uncensored2008]

I like this one better.



Maybe you got confused between Upanishads and Bhagavad-Gita.
I never wrote that I read Upanishads, which are a vast collection of Sanskit works. There might be 100 people in the United States who have read all the Upanishads.

I never asked or expected you to read the Bhagavad-Gita. It's not something one recommends to people.
I simply debunked your claim that i lied about reading it.

The problem with a Lockean or utilitarian definition of freedom is that it tends to underplay justice and equality.

Maybe you should read and respond to what I actually wrote.

I said the ENTIRE poem was unreadable. There are certainly parts that are fine.

And in all fairness, I have friends who are Indian that say in the original Hindi it flows well. Poetry often fails to translate well.

 

[SmarterthanYou]

I’ve worked in both the public and private sectors. The most poorly run are the corporations. By far.

a testament to your stupidity. a simple look at accounting proves that government run programs are the worst.