Just as I predicted. They don’t care that Trump is likely guilty of espionage. They’ll vote for him anyway.
The Question that Makes Cowards out of Leftists
- Thread starter IBDaMann
- Start date
Just as I predicted. They don’t care that Trump is likely guilty of espionage. They’ll vote for him anyway.
gfm7175
Mega MAGA
Now I did some research into it and it appears that I was taken for a fool due to my loathing of the guy (and knowing that he's a warmongerer who I could completely envision making such a statement). There's a lot of edited videos and quotes being propped up that make it look like he made those two comments together, but his comments were actually made separately within two different contexts.
But with regard to the "best money ever spent" comment, our money would get a lot more "bang for the buck" (for us) if it were actually used HERE to secure OUR border, and to repair OUR infrastructure, and benefit OUR people, instead of going overseas to another country's border, military, and corrupt authoritarian politicians who pocket chunks of it on the side. But yeah, I guess he's right that it's "best money ever spent" (for Ukraine).
IBDaMann
Well-known member
There's no real harm done; you're the one who is going to feel betrayed and as a result, you will better refine who you trust as a source. You nonetheless remain on the correct side of the fence. You performed your own independent research and did not blindly allow anyone to do your thinking for you ... even if you possibly jumped the gun on this item. You were still willing to acknowledge that you might have been a bit hasty and you adjusted your position accordingly, instead of making lame excuses for doubling down on stupid. You still come out with kudos.
I will agree with your sentiment about the benefits of spending money "domestically" and putting Americans first. You will get no argument from me against any of that.
However ... it is just my belief that you have been fed a large dose of mischaracterization about US support for Ukraine. I'm betting that you were told stories of the US handing over piles of cash to Ukraine oligarchs to buy vodka or something. I recommend that you treat those accounts and characterizations as you would any tabloid story of the space alien meeting with Obama.
The Ukraine situation is exceedingly complicated and touches on US security interests on many fronts. It is very much in every American's interest to have the US government assist in managing Russia's failure to achieve an economic hegemony in Europe. One very possible result is a collapse of Russia, and as bad a thing as that might be, we must allow that to happen before we allow Russia to attain such a position that Moscow runs Europe and much of the global economy via coercion. It's not just Ukraine at stake here. US national interests are heavily involved and the US is paying only a trivial price, i.e. providing intelligence and some conventional munitions. The Ukranian army is getting all the tanks and equipment they need from the Russian military. US support for Ukraine is a nothing-burger ... *and* there is very little going on there beyond the Ukraine army wiping up the floor with the remaining Russian squatters who are now simply digging into purely defensive positions. There really isn't any more invasion, just Ukraine and Russia leveraging the situation for political spin ... which has led to everyone simply applying their own political spin ... and you end up getting a myriad of different stories that are all streaming in from fantasy land.
Again, I believe that your life would be simpler and clearer if you were to simply ignore the nothing-burger of the Ukraine situation, and when you do hear a story/characterization/account related to it, let your first thought be one of suspicion "what spin am I being handed now?"
... and just go after Graham for actual things he's done/said.
gfm7175
Mega MAGA
When it comes to Ukraine, I really don't trust what anyone says about any of it. There's too much propaganda involved from all sides. I'm mostly coming from a general position of being sick and tired of all the endless foreign wars, and all the money that goes into them, rather than addressing the plethora of domestic issues (border/trafficking/invasion of illegals, poor infrastructure conditions (e.g. road/rail), etc etc... "clean up your own room first before trying to clean up the rest of the world".
IBDaMann
Well-known member
A healthy attitude.
Another healthy attitude for you to have. Remember, there is no side that feels as though it can ever issue too much propaganda.
Another healthy attitude ... up until the option is to have a civil war instead.
Remember, wars are going to happen in the world. They are beyond our control. The question "we" (the Marxist "we") need to ask ourselves is how will any given war(s) and the propagating politics affect us here at home? You have to admit, it's one thing to claim to support Ukraine in its fight to repel Russian invaders, and another thing entirely to consider a Russian hegemony in Europe, especially when you see how Russia plays hardball with other countries the moment Russia perceives it has some sort of advantage.
All this is to say that a war is just the visible symptoms of deeper international politics going on. When you inevitably see the next of the endless foreign wars, ignore the war at first. Learn about the political situation under the hood first. Then determine your position on the war, to include what the US should do, and how it should support if that is the correct thing.
Regarding the overhyped nothing-burger in Ukraine, I would direct your attention to the US' support for the Ukraine army, which is a limited supply of high-tech rockets. These particular rockets are a sort of "trump card" that allow Ukraine to selectively take out key targets ... but they only have a limited supply so they have to use them wisely. One rocket is sort of a guaranteed elimination of whatever they select, so if they waste one on a jeep, they won't have it to take out the heavy bomber when it is sent in. This alone is preventing Russia from steamrolling in with any expensive/irreplaceable systems that they can't afford to lose because they know that Ukraine will be more than happy to take them out. As Russia stalls for time in totally defensive positions, Ukraine keeps picking them off one by one. There is only one ending for the situation in Ukraine and Russia will not be on the happy-ending side ... so there is no reason you need to be worrying about it at all.
You are absolutely in the right. Afghanistan was my big complaint. The amount of money spent there just to "give it away" still bothers me. That was a lot of money. But the Ukraine isn't really a cause for concern. The amount of money we are spending there is negligible. As least I have some good news for you on that front.
gfm7175
Mega MAGA
Dutch? Is that you?
Dutch Uncle
* Tertia Optio * Defend the Constitution
Several already did, Sybil. If you weren't such a deluded nutbag talking to yourself, maybe you'd see they did.
It's so sad his socks are arguing with each other now. Of course his question was answered, but for him, it was a rhetorical question that doesn't beg an answer. He isn't sophisticated enough to understand the nuance.
Dutch Uncle
* Tertia Optio * Defend the Constitution
I rather enjoy it when he has talks with his socks. His demeanor changes when he's talking to himself. It's the only time he's calm. Still nuts, but calm.
Right? That's what's funny about it. But he takes the time to parse his own post and reply to it. Which has backfired on him. It's like Clark Kent wearing glasses. Yeah, we recognize you Superman.
IBDaMann
Well-known member
The question, remains without an honest answer from any leftists. Yes, the question has been dishonestly answered many times, and EVADED entirely even more.
But it pleases me to no end to watch the internet's two stupidest morons waste time with each other. I'll let you get your tongue back up Terry's ass now.
gfm7175
Mega MAGA
Where? I've been following this thread very closely and I haven't come across a single instance of that ever occurring.
Dutch Uncle
* Tertia Optio * Defend the Constitution
gfm7175
Mega MAGA
Can't point out where, eh? You COULD just admit that it has yet to happen, but that would require you to be honest.No worries, Sybil.
Dutch Uncle
* Tertia Optio * Defend the Constitution
Would it matter, Sybil? You fervently believe that Into the Night and IBDaMann are just good friends for over a decade. I think you are all three the same person.
Why does it matter to you that I believe this to be true? Is it because you fear others will see the same view?
gfm7175
Mega MAGA
I enjoy mocking it because it's blatant nonsense.
