It's not true.
The Will of the People
- Thread starter ThatOwlWoman
- Start date
It's not true.
ThatOwlWoman
Leftist Vermin
No, we moved up here after that. You're right -- it's sickening.
It wasn't the state legislature that overturned it, it was the federal courts that ruled Prop 8 was unconstitutional.
If you want to hang a pair of bear arms over your fireplace, go right ahead. But just know that bears are quite grumpy.
They did defend the Constitution that provides for an electoral college to choose the president. Most western democracies are parliamentary systems that do not have a national vote for the prime minister. What has the other party done to change the situation?
cawacko
Well-known member
Actually both Prop 187 and Prop 8 were passed by the will of the people in ballot measures and overturned by the courts, not the legislature.
cawacko
Well-known member
Maybe I'm missing the point here but what were we doing fighting the Cold War if not to defend western liberal democracy? Were Republicans trying to turn the U.S. communist?
The Republican Party does not genuinely give a shit about the Electoral College on principal, unless it allows them to win. In 2000, when pre-election polling pointed to a possibility that Al Gore might win the EC, while losing the popular vote, the Bush campaign was preparing to challenge the legitimacy of the election.
Combine that with the fact that Republicans have gerrymandered election results, commited widespread acts of electoral fraud, suppressed voting, and done everything in the power to just make voting a hassle.
And that is exactly why Soviet leaders told Ronald Reagan to get fucked when he tried to lecture them about the superiority of western democracy. Even though the Soviets lied about a lot of things, there was more than a kernel of truth in their claim that American conservative leaders do not give a shit about democracy, and seek to game the system to thwart the will of the people.
Repub gerrymandering makes most Repub seats safe. My district was a poster boy of a dead district for Dems.
ThatOwlWoman
Leftist Vermin
Ditto for us in MO as well. We lived in a suburb of STL that used to be Congressional District #3, represented by Russ Carnahan. His father was a gov. of MO and his mother a Senator. Once we were assimilated by the (R) Borg though, the whole area was redrawn and we were blessed with Todd "Legitimate Rape" Akin and more recently by Ann "Cannot Meet in Person With My Scary Constituents Unless They are Conservatives" Wagner. From the Wikipedia article on him:
"Dramatic losses in population in St. Louis in the 2010 Census contributed to Missouri losing a Congressional seat effective 2013. In the remapping of the state's congressional districts, Carnahan's district was dismantled. The bulk of the district, including Carnahan's home, was drawn into Missouri's 1st congressional district."
We really need to get rid of that gerrymandering crap.
The Repubs will be on board if the election looks bad for them. The next census and the next gerrymandering happens after the 2020 election. The reds will suddenly want to reasonable.
I was responding to a poster who claimed Republicans did not support western democracy and alluded to the 2016 election in which the popular vote winner did not become president; thus, not really "democratic." I was just pointing out that most western democracies do not have a "democratically elected" (popular vote winner) chief executive.
Gerrymandering by both parties makes most congressional districts safe (except for about forty). Today, gerrymandering has less to do with safe districts than the sorting process in which most people live around people like themselves. Central cities are made up largely of Democrats (creating "wasted" Democratic votes) and suburbs and smaller town Republicans.
cawacko
Well-known member
Gotcha. I read Cypress’ post where he said we didn’t stand up for liberal democracy and I was thinking that’s what the Cold War was about
Althea
Althea told me...........
It's not true. Prop 8 was a ballot initiative aimed at getting the Right Wing loons to the polls. It passed, after the SC had ruled that same sex marriage was legal. The state legislature actually voted to change the language so that same sex couples couldn't refer to themselves as 'married', even though it remained legal in California
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You are basically claiming the two parties will do anything to win-I agree. Democrats controlled Congress from 1932-1994 with a couple of exceptions. During that time they gerrymandered to maintain control. They even refused to redistrict for many years to prevent political power from shifting to the urban areas until the Supreme Court decisions of the 1960s.
I grew up in a one-party Democratic state that used the worst kind of tactics to control the convention process until the reforms following the 1968 Democratic convention. Neither side has the moral high ground no matter how much liberals try to paint that picture.
cawacko
Well-known member
On a percent basis blacks and Hispanics voted the highest for Prop 8. Guess they fit into your “right wing loons” category
Althea
Althea told me...........
Edited to correct the chronology