Until our leaders admit the true nature of Islamic extremes, we will never defeat it

[cancel2 2022]

Melanie Phillips used to a left wing writer on the Guardian until she could no longer agree with much of its agenda. AS she quite rightly points out Islam has never gone through a Reformation like Christianity and is still stuck in the eye for eye era.

Ever since the spectre of Islamic terrorism in the West first manifested itself, Britain has had its head stuck firmly in the sand. After both 9/11 and the 7/7 London transport bombings, the Labour government promised to take measures to defend the country against further such attacks. It defined the problem, however, merely as terrorism, failing to understand that the real issue was the extremist ideas which led to such violence.

Accordingly, it poured money into Muslim community groups, many of which turned out to be dangerously extreme. When David Cameron came to power, his Government raised hopes of a more realistic approach when it pledged to counter extremist ideas rather than just violence. This approach, too, has failed. The Government still has no coherent strategy for countering Islamist radicalisation.

Read more: http://www.dailymail.co.uk/debate/a...slamic-extremism-defeat-it.html#ixzz2UUhZ5ZIw

 

[iolo]

Melanie Phillips is just a tedious old Nazi. The nature of 'Islamic extremism' is to hit back at those they see as responsible for the mass-murder of Muslims. We should give them Bliar and Bush when we withdraw from the countries we have attacked and colonised. It is just as stupid to kill ordinary 'Christians', though, as to support 'Israel' or rant about Muslims.

 

[Conservative]

Melanie Phillips used to a left wing writer on the Guardian until she could no longer agree with much of its agenda. AS she quite rightly points out Islam has never gone through a Reformation like Christianity and is still stuck in the eye for eye era.

Ever since the spectre of Islamic terrorism in the West first manifested itself, Britain has had its head stuck firmly in the sand. After both 9/11 and the 7/7 London transport bombings, the Labour government promised to take measures to defend the country against further such attacks. It defined the problem, however, merely as terrorism, failing to understand that the real issue was the extremist ideas which led to such violence.

Accordingly, it poured money into Muslim community groups, many of which turned out to be dangerously extreme. When David Cameron came to power, his Government raised hopes of a more realistic approach when it pledged to counter extremist ideas rather than just violence. This approach, too, has failed. The Government still has no coherent strategy for countering Islamist radicalisation.

Read more: http://www.dailymail.co.uk/debate/a...slamic-extremism-defeat-it.html#ixzz2UUhZ5ZIw


http://www.dailymail.co.uk/debate/a...-true-nature-Islamic-extremism-defeat-it.html

Now the sons of Satan have defiled war memorials.


http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/art...rch-Downing-Street-tensions-rise-country.html

 

[Mott the Hoople]

Melanie Phillips used to a left wing writer on the Guardian until she could no longer agree with much of its agenda. AS she quite rightly points out Islam has never gone through a Reformation like Christianity and is still stuck in the eye for eye era.

Ever since the spectre of Islamic terrorism in the West first manifested itself, Britain has had its head stuck firmly in the sand. After both 9/11 and the 7/7 London transport bombings, the Labour government promised to take measures to defend the country against further such attacks. It defined the problem, however, merely as terrorism, failing to understand that the real issue was the extremist ideas which led to such violence.

Accordingly, it poured money into Muslim community groups, many of which turned out to be dangerously extreme. When David Cameron came to power, his Government raised hopes of a more realistic approach when it pledged to counter extremist ideas rather than just violence. This approach, too, has failed. The Government still has no coherent strategy for countering Islamist radicalisation.

Read more: http://www.dailymail.co.uk/debate/a...slamic-extremism-defeat-it.html#ixzz2UUhZ5ZIw

Who is this article intendted for Tom? Most of the right wingers on here are barely literate and their solution to any foreign policy is to "Kill brown people" and as such, if they are your intended audience, you've pretty much wasted your time.

The problem with most Islamic countries is the same problem you have in most of the third world. Ancient fuedal societies stuck in the middle ages with populations that, by and large, don't want to change their social structures. That has left them weak and open to dominance, oppresion and gross exploitation by the west. Most despise their weakness and hate the west for exploiting their weaknesses. In reality it's the frustration within segments of their population at their societies inability to modernize and deal with the industrialized west that is the cause of their extremism.

So what can we in the west do? Not much other than to encourage modernization in the third world. That's hard to do when most of the third world does not share our western values. That's a shame cause in most of these third world nations their elite classes exploit their general population with far more ruthlessness than the European colonialist did (and that's saying a lot). Thailand and the Philippines would be an excellent example. Scratch their modern surface and underneath they are still very much midevil fuedal societies in which the elite few are staggering wealthy and the majority of the population are poor and the elite don't govern from impersonal institutions which rely on integrity and a utilitarian philosophy to benefit all but care only for preserving their priveleges at the cost of the many within their nations.

Eventually these third world nations will have their own comparable renaisance/reformation and revolt from the tyranny of the oligarchs who keep their nations in a midevil fuedal state. Until then and considering that the west is all to willing to exploit their weakness we will remain an object of their frustration.

 

[Conservative]

Are you saying this is OK?

 

[cancel2 2022]

Who is this article intendted for Tom? Most of the right wingers on here are barely literate and their solution to any foreign policy is to "Kill brown people" and as such, if they are your intended audience, you've pretty much wasted your time.

The problem with most Islamic countries is the same problem you have in most of the third world. Ancient fuedal societies stuck in the middle ages with populations that, by and large, don't want to change their social structures. That has left them weak and open to dominance, oppresion and gross exploitation by the west. Most despise their weakness and hate the west for exploiting their weaknesses. In reality it's the frustration within segments of their population at their societies inability to modernize and deal with the industrialized west that is the cause of their extremism.

So what can we in the west do? Not much other than to encourage modernization in the third world. That's hard to do when most of the third world does not share our western values. That's a shame cause in most of these third world nations their elite classes exploit their general population with far more ruthlessness than the European colonialist did (and that's saying a lot). Thailand and the Philippines would be an excellent example. Scratch their modern surface and underneath they are still very much midevil fuedal societies in which the elite few are staggering wealthy and the majority of the population are poor and the elite don't govern from impersonal institutions which rely on integrity and a utilitarian philosophy to benefit all but care only for preserving their priveleges at the cost of the many within their nations.

Eventually these third world nations will have their own comparable renaisance/reformation and revolt from the tyranny of the oligarchs who keep their nations in a midevil fuedal state. Until then and considering that the west is all to willing to exploit their weakness we will remain an object of their frustration.

Yes, I am well aware that there is a fair proportion of knuckledraggers on here. As for Thailand, it is changing rapidly and there is a very large middle class these days with many of them sending their children off to UK and US universities. I can see it with my oldest son's Thai pals especially the women. There is still a great North South divide though, although that is changing as well.

Returning to the article, she is talking about Islam in the West as well, unfortunately most of the world's major sects are still based in 7th century Koranic teachings and are just like brimstone and fire preachers in the US quoting the Old Testament as gospel, literally. Where is the New Testament version of the Koran?

 

[cancel2 2022]

Melanie Phillips is just a tedious old Nazi. The nature of 'Islamic extremism' is to hit back at those they see as responsible for the mass-murder of Muslims. We should give them Bliar and Bush when we withdraw from the countries we have attacked and colonised. It is just as stupid to kill ordinary 'Christians', though, as to support 'Israel' or rant about Muslims.

Certainly in modern times, Muslims win hands down when it comes to killing Muslims.

 

[Airstrip One]

Funny thing is that Bush was in his first year of office, and promising not to get us into any more wars in the Muslim world, which apparently offended the extremists, because they attacked us.

 

[Socrtease]

There is no moderating voice in Islam. The US has a moderate Muslim population, and that can ONLY be credited to immediate proximity to western culture. Moderate Muslims like the people who live in Dearborne would be killed in Iran, Saudi Arabia and Iraq. They would not be seen as moderate, they would be seen heretics. Moderate Muslims in the middle east are those that believe in quickly cutting the heads off captives rather than torturing them and parading them on TV.

 

[Socrtease]

Funny thing is that Bush was in his first year of office, and promising not to get us into any more wars in the Muslim world, which apparently offended the extremists, because they attacked us.

This might mean something if he had not IMMEDIATELY gotten us into a war with a country that had nothing to do with 9-11.

 

[Airstrip One]

This might mean something if he had not IMMEDIATELY gotten us into a war with a country that had nothing to do with 9-11.

Like Afghanistan?

 

[iolo]

Certainly in modern times, Muslims win hands down when it comes to killing Muslims.

Rubbish. Bush and Bliar killed vast numbers. The USA had a million murdered in Indonesia, for a start, and has gone on from there, onwards and upwards. And why, please, do you feel Muslims killing Muslims is any of your business anyway? Stay home and feed your chickens

 

[Airstrip One]

I wouldn't much care except that they always manage to find the time to stop and kill non-Muslims as well...

 

[cancel2 2022]

Rubbish. Bush and Bliar killed vast numbers. The USA had a million murdered in Indonesia, for a start, and has gone on from there, onwards and upwards. And why, please, do you feel Muslims killing Muslims is any of your business anyway? Stay home and feed your chickens

Suharto came into power by deposing Sukarno and promising to rid the country of Communists. He was a brutal man but then there was a very good chance that Indonesia could have gone the same way as Cambodia, Vietnam and Laos. He was most brutal towards East Timor but the population is overwhelmingly Catholic not Muslim.

 

[canceled.2021.1]

Melanie Phillips used to a left wing writer on the Guardian until she could no longer agree with much of its agenda. AS she quite rightly points out Islam has never gone through a Reformation like Christianity and is still stuck in the eye for eye era.

Ever since the spectre of Islamic terrorism in the West first manifested itself, Britain has had its head stuck firmly in the sand. After both 9/11 and the 7/7 London transport bombings, the Labour government promised to take measures to defend the country against further such attacks. It defined the problem, however, merely as terrorism, failing to understand that the real issue was the extremist ideas which led to such violence.

Accordingly, it poured money into Muslim community groups, many of which turned out to be dangerously extreme. When David Cameron came to power, his Government raised hopes of a more realistic approach when it pledged to counter extremist ideas rather than just violence. This approach, too, has failed. The Government still has no coherent strategy for countering Islamist radicalisation.

Read more: http://www.dailymail.co.uk/debate/a...slamic-extremism-defeat-it.html#ixzz2UUhZ5ZIw

Just a couple of clarifications.

1) Islam has been at war with the West long before 9/11
3) Years of constant political correctness keeps the Brits from facing their reality. It unfortunately will most probably be too late when they do
4) Some lefties share the same anti western hatred that muslims do, so they are simpatico

Britain had a good run, but like all nations it is doomed to fail. Britain lost its way after WWII. If it makes you feel any better the US is close on their heels.

 

[canceled.2021.1]

Who is this article intendted for Tom? Most of the right wingers on here are barely literate and their solution to any foreign policy is to "Kill brown people" and as such, if they are your intended audience, you've pretty much wasted your time.

The problem with most Islamic countries is the same problem you have in most of the third world. Ancient fuedal societies stuck in the middle ages with populations that, by and large, don't want to change their social structures. That has left them weak and open to dominance, oppresion and gross exploitation by the west. Most despise their weakness and hate the west for exploiting their weaknesses. In reality it's the frustration within segments of their population at their societies inability to modernize and deal with the industrialized west that is the cause of their extremism.

So what can we in the west do? Not much other than to encourage modernization in the third world. That's hard to do when most of the third world does not share our western values. That's a shame cause in most of these third world nations their elite classes exploit their general population with far more ruthlessness than the European colonialist did (and that's saying a lot). Thailand and the Philippines would be an excellent example. Scratch their modern surface and underneath they are still very much midevil fuedal societies in which the elite few are staggering wealthy and the majority of the population are poor and the elite don't govern from impersonal institutions which rely on integrity and a utilitarian philosophy to benefit all but care only for preserving their priveleges at the cost of the many within their nations.

Eventually these third world nations will have their own comparable renaisance/reformation and revolt from the tyranny of the oligarchs who keep their nations in a midevil fuedal state. Until then and considering that the west is all to willing to exploit their weakness we will remain an object of their frustration.

There are lots of third world countries out there that aren't resorting to terrorism. Your premise is flawed. Of course like all political correct lefties, you will go out of your way to see the obvious. You like to see the poor Muslimes as "underdogs" so you can't see them for who and what they are. That is why you cheer the Arabs who attack Israel on a constant basis. You even buy into their propaganda that they are "Palestinian" when there is no such nationality. They are Arabs who have not been allowed back to Jordan etc.

Don't worry when the Caliphate comes, I am sure they will spare you

 

[canceled.2021.1]

There is no moderating voice in Islam. The US has a moderate Muslim population, and that can ONLY be credited to immediate proximity to western culture. Moderate Muslims like the people who live in Dearborne would be killed in Iran, Saudi Arabia and Iraq. They would not be seen as moderate, they would be seen heretics. Moderate Muslims in the middle east are those that believe in quickly cutting the heads off captives rather than torturing them and parading them on TV.

The fact that people claim there are "moderate" Muslimes, is indicative of the fact that Islum is a violent, vile religion.

Yeah, yeah, yeah, we know the Crusades happened a long time ago. Lots of anti American types claim this, yet are so ignorant they don't know the Crusades were in response to radical Islum. I also invite people to research Jefferson and the Barbary Pirates. This isn't anything new with the vile religion. It must be defeated, but alas you have the wus liberals who couldn't fight their way out of a paper bag and the idiot pseudo libertarian Gary Johnson butt fuckers who just don't get it. In the end, we are just fucked.

 

[iolo]

I wouldn't much care except that they always manage to find the time to stop and kill non-Muslims as well...

Only the ones invading their countries, stealing their oil and encouraging civil wars. Try to give it up and find honest work!

 

[iolo]

Certainly in modern times, Muslims win hands down when it comes to killing Muslims.

Because your imperialist occupiers encourage them to, to help the Nazis occupying Palestine and to make money for your masters, the oil-robbers especially, by murdering those who might bring you to justice.

 

[Mott the Hoople]

Yes, I am well aware that there is a fair proportion of knuckledraggers on here. As for Thailand, it is changing rapidly and there is a very large middle class these days with many of them sending their children off to UK and US universities. I can see it with my oldest son's Thai pals especially the women. There is still a great North South divide though, although that is changing as well.

Returning to the article, she is talking about Islam in the West as well, unfortunately most of the world's major sects are still based in 7th century Koranic teachings and are just like brimstone and fire preachers in the US quoting the Old Testament as gospel, literally. Where is the New Testament version of the Koran?

I think you (err the author) are looking at the wrong source for modernization to occur in third world nations in the ME. I think before any of that occurs they must revolt against the feudal social structuret that prevents their modenization. Will some sort of Islamic reformation be part of that? I think that's inevitable but that effect and not the cause of a revolt to change their social structures. The same is true in SE Asia, though I agree there is an expanding middle class in these nations and that the growing middle classes may eventually force a change in their existing social structures I think my observation is correct that if you scratch the surface of modernity they are still very much a feudal society ruled by a handful of oligarch who only care about protecting their priveleges and are not concerned about the best interest of the masses.