We now have solid proof that after Trump and Project 2025, the future of the GOP is Nazism

[QP!]

That’s fair, but that’s also kind of my point. Everyone thinks this time is the exception, that this moment is different, so the extreme language is justified. So George W. Bush wasn’t really a Nazi when people called him one, but Trump now is?

Each side keeps raising the rhetoric because they think their cause is righteous. At some point it just becomes about proving the other side is evil.

While i agree with you that the sports team type of shift in politics, where 'sides matter over substance and every player on the other team is bad and deserved the foul and every player on your team is good and should not get fouls, and that has lead to those on the left wrongly labeled communist, fascist, etc and those on the right wrongly labeled, Hitler, fascist, etc, you have to then be careful to then not say 'therefore nothing is communist, fascist, Hitler like, etc', which is the error i think you are doing.

There are pretty clear tests and elements of fascism and a history of nations we have seen in our lifetime who have tipped in to it and it is really quite unquestionable that this Trump admin is clearly fascist and trying to shift America from a democratic nation to a fascist one.

They openly brag about it talking about talking about the Orban success and following that blueprint of using government immense power to try and force law firms, Universities, the Press, Non Profits who fund and work with Democrats and protestors, all to capitulate to their world view or to force them to fight government where even if they are right and they win they will be severely harmed if not forced to shut down or jailed.

No one, who is not suffering the denial of a magat, who thought they perceived weaponization of government during the Biden term, could deny that what the Trump admin is doing now ARE the actual steps of authoritarian fascism. That is different than the team vs team hyperbole that proceeded it.

Do you agree?

 

[cawacko]

Or we can sit quiet, stay silent...and not disturb Trump's efforts to subvert our democracy and our Republic.

Toning down the rhetoric, in this instance, is like staying silent. What the other side is doing makes what this side is doing seem tame.

Okay, you cannot see that...and are convinced we should do otherwise.

I, and many of the people on my side of the fence, disagree with that.

In any case, I do not think the other side is evil, necessarily. It may simply be misguided. Many of the people who supported (or did not actively oppose) Hitler in mid 20th century Germany were NOT evil...they were misguided.

Whether you are not actively opposing Trump and his policies because you are evil or misguided...same result.

Frank, that’s a total strawman. No one here, especially me, is saying you have to be quiet.

If you can’t see the difference between speaking out against what you don’t like and calling everyone you disagree with a Nazi or fascist, I’m not sure what to tell you.

 

[Nordberg]

Nazi Germany went on for 12+ years. It started slow, and then built up speed. We will see where we are in 12 years, but we are not moving in a good direction. There are definitely those, like @Stone , who see Nazism as a template.

There are those like Trump who see the Nazi programs as a blueprint. Trump is using it clearly. He is not turning the Whitehouse into Mira Lago North because he intends to leave it someday. Presidents used to see it as the people's house. In Trump's mind, he owns it.
Trump has troops on the streets pounding on defenseless people, waiting until someone makes a big enough response that he can declare war on the people. As dictators do, they say only they can solve the problems. Give them all the power and trust them. That is the end of democracy.
We are nearly there.
Destroying democracy is Trump's only accomplishment. His economics is a disaster. He will add at least 5 trillion to the debt. His misuse of tariffs are jacking prices up for the people as he gleefully fires government workers. The super wealthy's wealth has gone up 28 times in the last 20 years. The people's wealth has gone down.
Trump shows you who he works for. It isn't the people.
He was gleeful when he said the shutdown gave him a chance to fire more workers. That did not bother the Trumpys.

 

[Walt]

i say this without hyperbole.

Kennedy seems to believe in a version of 'only the strong should survive' type evolution and that those with health issues should be left to fight it or die based on a more naturopath type fight.

If you listen to him he seems to think we have been making civilizations weaker by providing medicines and care that keeps people alive who otherwise would die, allowing those people to mate and weaken the gene pool whereas if they died and only the strong survived, society would get better and stronger.

And while there is some truth and science behind that view, it is a monstrous thing to try and implement, and i do think that is what he is doing now.

The sad part is we have to work together on healthcare. He cannot go it alone, and expect good results.

 

[QP!]

The sad part is we have to work together on healthcare. He cannot go it alone, and expect good results.

he does not want to work with us. He wants to force a societal cull of those he speaks of as weakening the gene pool and thus putting all of the rest of us at risk. He believes, long term that makes America stronger.

And while i agree with some of his underlying assumptions and the challenges i think society will face due to modern medicines ability to keep people alive so far beyond natural means, i also think his solution is a monstrous one.

For people like Kennedy, Covid was a warning shot of what we will see increasingly in society, which is a legit issue to deal with and i see no easy answer YET, but again, his method of trying to address is not the right one.

 

[christiefan915]

You’re right there’s been some ugly rhetoric toward immigrants, and it’s good to call that out. But comparing it to Nazi Germany is way over the top. Every country argues about immigration and border policy. What the Nazis did was mass, organized killing of millions of people. When people toss that comparison around, it cheapens what really happened and shuts down any real discussion.

And let’s be honest, Democrats and liberals use plenty of dehumanizing language toward people they don’t like. Glass houses here.

This is true but it was the end result. There were years of diminishing freedoms that led up to it.

 

[christiefan915]

You’re right there’s been some ugly rhetoric toward immigrants, and it’s good to call that out. But comparing it to Nazi Germany is way over the top. Every country argues about immigration and border policy. What the Nazis did was mass, organized killing of millions of people. When people toss that comparison around, it cheapens what really happened and shuts down any real discussion.

And let’s be honest, Democrats and liberals use plenty of dehumanizing language toward people they don’t like. Glass houses here.

trump's sending the NG into Democrat-run cities, has ICE grabbing people off the street and is charging his perceived enemies with "crimes," meaning the crime of disloyalty to him. This is how it starts.

 

[christiefan915]

We have history to thank for that. If we have Trump trying to cancel an election, then we have the first steps. He's tried to delegitimize elections, which shows what he might do if he could.

Doesn't he want to eliminate all mail-in voting?

 

[Jade Dragon]

Doesn't he want to eliminate all mail-in voting?

I think so, but luckily it's not up to his dumb ass self. The states run election processes.

 

[christiefan915]

I’m not stopping anyone from criticizing Trump or his policies. That doesn’t make America 1930s Germany.

Elections still happen, people still protest and Trump is ripped on national TV on a nightly basis. That’s not authoritarianism or Nazism. It’s democracy with a lot of noise.

I’m awake. In fact I do my best to stay out of echo chambers because that’s where this dehumanizing and toxic rhetoric flourishes.

The only election we've had so far is one primary. I'll wait and see.

 

[christiefan915]

Well Trump came out and said we could not have elections if we were at war, as we see he could be getting us into one.
And I can't see why not we have had them during every way we have been in, WWI, WWII, Korea, Vietnam, Iran, Iraq.
So why not now?

I read there's been talk about regime change in Venezuela.

 

[Phantasmal]

trump's sending the NG into Democrat-run cities, has ICE grabbing people off the street and is charging his perceived enemies with "crimes," meaning the crime of disloyalty to him. This is how it starts.

Building concentration camps, barring representatives from visiting detention centers, “disappearing” people, sending military troops into non violent protests, letting ICE arrest citizens, using tear gas on citizens, attacking the press…the list goes on.

 

[christiefan915]

Disagreed on all even though GW's Patriot Act was a move toward authoritarianism.

Did you support the Patriot Act when it first came out? I didn't. I understand the fear and why people did it, but I saw it as a dark path.

I didn't support it either, and wasn't it supposed to expire after a certain number of years, maybe 10?

 

[Dutch Uncle]

I didn't support it either, and wasn't it supposed to expire after a certain number of years, maybe 10?

Yes, but, IIRC, Obama did extend some parts of it, but most of it expired like Clinton's gun ban.

FWIW, I was also against invading and occupying Iraq for the same reasons as General Powell.

 

[Dutch Uncle]

Building concentration camps, barring representatives from visiting detention centers, “disappearing” people, sending military troops into non violent protests, letting ICE arrest citizens, using tear gas on citizens, attacking the press…the list goes on.

Prime Nobel Peace Prize material. Not!

 

[Walt]

There are those like Trump who see the Nazi programs as a blueprint. Trump is using it clearly. He is not turning the Whitehouse into Mira Lago North because he intends to leave it someday. Presidents used to see it as the people's house. In Trump's mind, he owns it.
Trump has troops on the streets pounding on defenseless people, waiting until someone makes a big enough response that he can declare war on the people. As dictators do, they say only they can solve the problems. Give them all the power and trust them. That is the end of democracy.
We are nearly there.
Destroying democracy is Trump's only accomplishment. His economics is a disaster. He will add at least 5 trillion to the debt. His misuse of tariffs are jacking prices up for the people as he gleefully fires government workers. The super wealthy's wealth has gone up 28 times in the last 20 years. The people's wealth has gone down.
Trump shows you who he works for. It isn't the people.
He was gleeful when he said the shutdown gave him a chance to fire more workers. That did not bother the Trumpys.

I am beginning to think one of the mistakes the Germans made was to keep things going. Hitler was taking personal control, but was not very competent, like trump. Had the Germans just stepped aside, and let him fail, they would have been better off. Instead, they worked hard to keep Germany going for the decade or so Hitler needed to ruin everything.

We might be better off to fail early.

 

[Earl]

Of course, it Depends.

 

[Walt]

he does not want to work with us. He wants to force a societal cull of those he speaks of as weakening the gene pool and thus putting all of the rest of us at risk. He believes, long term that makes America stronger.

And while i agree with some of his underlying assumptions and the challenges i think society will face due to modern medicines ability to keep people alive so far beyond natural means, i also think his solution is a monstrous one.

For people like Kennedy, Covid was a warning shot of what we will see increasingly in society, which is a legit issue to deal with and i see no easy answer YET, but again, his method of trying to address is not the right one.

I do worry that as we become an older society, more and more of our votes are going to older people who do not want change.

But the solution is not to kill a bunch of kids, like Kennedy wants.

 

[Dutch Uncle]

I read there's been talk about regime change in Venezuela.

Trump wants their oil at a discount.

 

[Dutch Uncle]

That’s fair, but that’s also kind of my point. Everyone thinks this time is the exception, that this moment is different, so the extreme language is justified. So George W. Bush wasn’t really a Nazi when people called him one, but Trump now is?

Each side keeps raising the rhetoric because they think their cause is righteous. At some point it just becomes about proving the other side is evil.

Why can't we call a spade a spade or a fucking Nazi pedophile a fucking Nazi pedophile? Are you too "woke"???