What if Obamacare is voted down by the Supreme Court?

Derp Derp said:
Name me just one other nation with a universal health insurance mandate that has rampantly gone around requiring it's citizens to purchase a wide range of goods and services at the governments dictates? Name one.
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This is not a retort, does not address my argument, and there are many things the U.S. does that other nations do not, so using that barometer is fallacious. Other 1st world nations don't have the obesity problem we do. We could easily institute a mandate to buy healthier food.

I'll even make it easier for you. Name one nation with a universal health care mandate that requires it's citizens to purchase any goods and services other than health and auto insurance? Name just one!
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see above. not a retort. different cultures, different society's, different diets, different health issues.

Also, answer me this. Tell me how many modern industrialized nations that have implemented a universal mandate have rescinded or discarded it and gone back to a market driven systems? Name just one.
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there are plenty of unwashed masses. I will give you that. The world is full of proles. Of course the 95% enjoys being subsidized by the other 5%.

Congrats on your argumentum ad populum, any more logical fallacies you want to throw in my direction?
 
Cynic said:
for the record I am against being forced to buy auto insurance as well.
I think you should buy auto insurance to protect yourself from being sued. If you crash into someone and don't have insurance, they can sue you for your assets.

and this argument has already been used. you aren't forced to buy auto insurance if you don't drive. you WILL be forced to buy health insurance even if you are a early 20's healthy male. not even the same thing.
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Except you're not always going to be a 20 something healthy male! Eventually you'll get sick or injured and then we'll have to pay for you. Do you currently carry health insurance?
 
Cynic said:
if you actually look at the stats for hospital costs of a healthy male in their 20's, it's staggeringly non-existent. For all intents and purposes, there are significant areas of our society that don't use healthcare. Why the FUCK should I be forced to subsidize the great unwashed masses?

and we already have medicare for old people so don't use the whole "you'll be old one day so you should still pay in now"
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You're not. We're subsidizing you. That's the problem.
 
Cynic said:
if you actually look at the stats for hospital costs of a healthy male in their 20's, it's staggeringly non-existent. For all intents and purposes, there are significant areas of our society that don't use healthcare. Why the FUCK should I be forced to subsidize the great unwashed masses?

and we already have medicare for old people so don't use the whole "you'll be old one day so you should still pay in now"
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The same can be said for a healthy male in his 40's. Which is why I stay with catastrophic coverage and a high deductible. My HSA investments cover my yearly out of pocket.
 
Derp Derp said:
Except you're not always going to be a 20 something healthy male! Eventually you'll get sick or injured and then we'll have to pay for you. Do you currently carry health insurance?
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Has he ever used the emergency room and did he pay his bill? How many healthy, young males/females use the emergency room and don't pay?
 
Cynic said:
This is not a retort, does not address my argument, and there are many things the U.S. does that other nations do not, so using that barometer is fallacious. Other 1st world nations don't have the obesity problem we do. We could easily institute a mandate to buy healthier food.



see above. not a retort. different cultures, different society's, different diets, different health issues.



there are plenty of unwashed masses. I will give you that. The world is full of proles. Of course the 95% enjoys being subsidized by the other 5%.

Congrats on your argumentum ad populum, any more logical fallacies you want to throw in my direction?
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That's because their rhetorical questions Grind. You can't or you won't answer those questions because not one nation who has adopted a universal mandate has ever discarded it nor have they ever required their citizens to buy a wide range of products or services at the governments behest. That makes complete hash of your argument which is incredibly stupid "Well were Americans and were different and were special so even though the rest of the world has figured out how to solve this problem were not going to do it that way, derp, derp."
 
LOL @ this thread turning into how old people subsidize the young with re: to healthcare. absolutely hilarious.
 
Derp Derp said:
Thank you Rana. That's my point and that's a significant driver in health care cost is paying for the uninsured.
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Really... you think healthy uninsured young people using the emergency room and not paying for it is a significant driver in health care costs?

Ya wanna link us up to that data sport?
 
How about this as a compromise. When the whole law is thrown out, let's pass a mandate that requires States to guarantee universal access to health coverage by 2020. Each State would have to figure out how to make that happen. Some would go single-payer, others would go for a market solution. Each would ultimately determine what works best for them.
 
Derp Derp said:
Because if he gets hurt or has a serious illness we'll end up picking up the bill. That's why.
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People his age use the emergency room more than any other age group. 16% of people his age have chronic conditions. People his age don't see a regular practitioners and preventable disease aren't prevented. People without insurance take more ick leave which affects others.
 
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