Which charge against Chauvin and the 3 other cops will put them in prison?

[tsuke]

whatever the charge, add 15 years for civil rights violation, and that's federal time

Just as there are mitigating circumstances to lessen the penalty there are also aggravating circumstances to increase them. Im sure some of them will apply.

 

[Nomad]

"I watched a video so I know all there is to know"

 

[Nomad]

Read it again. Premeditation doesn't have to mean "cooked up waaaaaaay in advance." That's why
I typed, "The whole thing became premeditated after 1 minute.

And, I think "creeps" is a pretty mild word to use on these 4 guys for what they did.

Explain how you have managed to determine what was in the minds of the officers without yet even having heard them speak or any of the evidence either for or against them?

I would be interested to know how you know certain things that common sense tells one cannot be known without an in depth examination of all the facts.

 

[Stretch]

Well, then you saw it as it was happening...video and audio.

 

[Stretch]

Explain how you have managed to determine what was in the minds of the officers without yet even having heard them speak or any of the evidence either for or against them?

I would be interested to know how you know certain things that common sense tells one cannot be known without an in depth examination of all the facts.

You saw it. You heard it. Chauvin kept taunting Floyd with "get up! get up!".
Chauvin knew he could not because he and the 3 others were on top of him. You heard it...right there in the video.

 

[Nomad]

Well, then you saw it as it was happening...video and audio.

A video is not necessarily the be all and end all proof in a situation like this one.
`
The video doesn't measure the amount of force or pressure being applied to Floyd's body.

If you look closely at the video where Floyd is saying he couldn't breathe, you can see him moving his head and neck while Chauvin's knee appears to relax a bit, allowing the movement to occur.

I'm not saying this totally exonerates him, but it does suggest he possibly wasn't acting as brutally or crushing Floyd's windpipe as has been suggested.

Point is, we still don't know enough to make the kinds of pronouncements everyone is making.

 

[Nomad]

You saw it. You heard it. Chauvin kept taunting Floyd with "get up! get up!".
Chauvin knew he could not because he and the 3 others were on top of him. You heard it...right there in the video.

When have the words "get up! get up!" ever killed anyone?

Remember, that is what this is all about, not what Chauvin said to him.

Had he said "you are going to die because I'm going to kill you right here", well then that would have been altogether different.

 

[Stretch]

A video is not necessarily the be all and end all proof in a situation like this one.
`
The video doesn't measure the amount of force or pressure being applied to Floyd's body.

If you look closely at the video where Floyd is saying he couldn't breathe, you can see him moving his head and neck while Chauvin's knee appears to relax a bit, allowing the movement to occur.

I'm not saying this totally exonerates him, but it does suggest he possibly wasn't acting as brutally or crushing Floyd's windpipe as has been suggested.

Point is, we still don't know enough to make the kinds of pronouncements everyone is making.

And, the 3 guys on his back?
Oxygen does not just come from your windpipe. It's all been explained earlier. He wasn't in the best shape anyway.
Any small constant pressure on arteries delivering oxygen in the blood to brain can be fatal. His rib cage couldn't
expand and contract from the weight of the other 3 cops, etc.

 

[Hawkeye10]

Do you think the 4 cops were unaware of Floyd's distress? Did they not know death can occur
with forced pressure to the back and neck? Maybe they weren't properly trained? They could claim
ignorance on the topic I suppose.
It's either that or they knew exactly what they were doing and didn't ease up even after he was deceased.
I'm just interested in what people think as to which charges will be brought.

(And, I'm not a proponent of ropes, electric chairs or lethal injections...just not a fan of the death penalty)

I think they lost situational awareness in large part because they were poorly trained.

I know that I demand a fair trial.

 

[Nordberg]

I don't think they planned on killing him, they just didn't care if it happened. They abuse people regularly. They have names for the people they abuse like the military had gooks, slants, Krauts and other names that takes away their humanity. Police forces are the next jobs for those we train to kill with impunity.

 

[Nomad]

And, the 3 guys on his back?
Oxygen does not just come from your windpipe. It's all been explained earlier. He wasn't in the best shape anyway.
Any small constant pressure on arteries delivering oxygen in the blood to brain can be fatal. His rib cage couldn't
expand and contract from the weight of the other 3 cops, etc.

Again, the video doesn't measure the amount of weight or pressure the other cops were exerting either.

It is not beyond the realm of imagination or possibility that they might have been holding him down but at the same time, supporting a portion of their own weight themselves.

Anyone who's ever wrestled with another person or held someone down should understand the physical dynamics that can go into such a situation.

All we see are images on a video, but we don't feel what any of the participants felt.

Too many things to be investigated and answered before passing all these judgements.

 

[Nomad]

I don't think they planned on killing him, they just didn't care if it happened. They abuse people regularly. They have names for the people they abuse like the military had gooks, slants, Krauts and other names that takes away their humanity. Police forces are the next jobs for those we train to kill with impunity.

That is certainly a reasonable possibility.

Or maybe they just didn't believe him.

One can imagine a cop out on the beat all day everyday probably hears every kind of attempt to scam them or get out of custody, etc, etc, etc imaginable.

Maybe Floyd was the third, fourth, fifth whatever, arrestee that day who moaned and groaned that they were sick or couldn't breathe, etc, etc.

I'm trying to put myself in their shoes.

 

[Nomad]

I think they lost situational awareness in large part because they were poorly trained.

I know that I demand a fair trial.

That could be.

I certainly agree with the second statement.

The defense will be interesting to hear.

I hope they televise it live like the Zimmerman trial.

 

[Stretch]

Again, the video doesn't measure the amount of weight or pressure the other cops were exerting either.

It is not beyond the realm of imagination or possibility that they might have been holding him down but at the same time, supporting a portion of their own weight themselves.

Anyone who's ever wrestled with another person or held someone down should understand the physical dynamics that can go into such a situation.

All we see are images on a video, but we don't feel what any of the participants felt.

Too many things to be investigated and answered before passing all these judgements.

Floyd felt plenty and was plenty vocal about his agony.

 

[Stretch]

That is certainly a reasonable possibility.

Or maybe they just didn't believe him.

One can imagine a cop out on the beat all day everyday probably hears every kind of attempt to scam them or get out of custody, etc, etc, etc imaginable.

Maybe Floyd was the third, fourth, fifth whatever, arrestee that day who moaned and groaned that they were sick or couldn't breathe, etc, etc.

I'm trying to put myself in their shoes.

Cops could've worried about the phony $20 bill later. He was cuffed on the ground with 4 guys sitting on him.

 

[Darth Omar]

the murder 3 or manslaughter charge will stick I think and the other 3 will get some sort of accessory charge.

If we actually charged them with only Murder 1 or murder 2 as AOC and some of the other libs wanted then they would have walked.

Exactly.

The prosecution could make a grave mistake if they aim too high on this. Criminal negligence resulting in death is manslaughter.

There’s not sufficient evidence to prove intent.

 

[Darth Omar]

That is certainly a reasonable possibility.

Or maybe they just didn't believe him.

One can imagine a cop out on the beat all day everyday probably hears every kind of attempt to scam them or get out of custody, etc, etc, etc imaginable.

Maybe Floyd was the third, fourth, fifth whatever, arrestee that day who moaned and groaned that they were sick or couldn't breathe, etc, etc.

I'm trying to put myself in their shoes.

Well, the defense team will be saying those exact sort of things and the jury’s going to hear them. And more. If the toxicology report says Floyd had something like meth or coke on board the defense will be all over it, saying the drugs made his heart go out.

Please, take the manslaughter and run with it.

 

[Nomad]

Floyd felt plenty and was plenty vocal about his agony.

That's what the video suggests and in hind sight, one can easily point to it and say they should've known. But cops deal with scammers and con artists all day long who say a lot of things to them, most of which are just a lot of slick bullshit.

If one puts oneself in their shoes, one might understand why they tend to be jaded and not believe what people being arrested say to them.

Cops could've worried about the phony $20 bill later. He was cuffed on the ground with 4 guys sitting on him.

I don't disagree with that, but as I suggested earlier, it's possible that in the course of a typical day arresting petty crooks, scammers and con artist types, they hear similar claims quite often. Maybe every second or third arrestee they deal with tries to get out of going straight to jail by complaining about chest pains or difficulty breathing, etc.

Maybe they just figured he was doing the same thing.

 

[Nomad]

Well, the defense team will be saying those exact sort of things and the jury’s going to hear them. And more. If the toxicology report says Floyd had something like meth or coke on board the defense will be all over it, saying the drugs made his heart go out.

Please, take the manslaughter and run with it.

The county ME report already shows he had fentanyl in his system and had recently used methamphetamine.

The defense is going to pound on that like John Henry vs a steam drill, lawd, lawd.


.

 

[Celticguy]

There are a couple things to factor in that we dont yet know. Toxicology report, what chemicals if any were in his blood. When did they notice that he had passed out or why didnt they ?