"Whose Freedom?"

Cypress

Well-known member
This book is an excellent critical look at the definition of “freedom” and “free will”. And how America’s traditional progressive interpretation of freedom, is being undermined by a reactionary concept of freedom. I could elaborate, but the following book reviewer articulates it much better. In short, the radical right is in the very process of redefining the very idea of freedom. What do they consider “freedom”? Briefly, what they want to conserve is the situation prior to the great expansion of traditional american ideas of freedom: before the great expansion of voting rights, civil rights legislation, public health and pensions, before worker and labor protections, before scientific discoveries contradicted religious dogma.

Don’t believe me? Google the “Constitution in Exile” and “Strict Constructionist” phrases. And then tell me these people don’t want to go back to 1792.

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Book Review: George Lakoff's "Whose Freedom?"

“Whose Freedom?”
The Battle Over America’s Most Important Idea
By George Lakoff

This book is about more than freedom in the political and patriotic sense. It is just as much about free will, about how we have begun to lose it and how to regain it. Parallel to the right-wing political machine is a right-wing mind machine.

Freedom’s just another word for ... well, completely different worldviews, according to George Lakoff’s new book, Whose Freedom?, and these differences are often unrecognized by progressives, making it nearly impossible to fight that right-wing mind machine the author dissects in detail in his newest book.

It is much scarier to think of Bush and others on the right as meaning what they say—as having a concept of "freedom" so alien to progressives that many progressives cannot even understand it, much less defend against it.

The renowned progressive linguist begins his analysis of the differences between conservative and progressive definitions of freedom with the assertion that until the rise of the modern right wing, there was indeed a near-universal acceptance of what freedom means to American citizens. He points to a history of slow but consistent expansion and inclusion of more categories of people legally empowered by the term, from the outlawing of slavery, to granting voting rights to African Americans and women, to FDR’s insistence that economic security is more than just a desirable condition for the exercise of rights. To be sure, progress has often been unsteady in practice and uneven in application, but the progressive trend is unmistakable from even the most cursory look at our past.

Though the history of our country is progressive overall, there have always been partial conservatives—financial, social, and religious. There have also always been pragmatists—partially progressive and partially conservative in various ways, but wanting things to work: our economy, our educational system, our public health system, our system of national parks. The radical conservatives are reducing the number of pragmatists.

How is this pool of pragmatists being shrunk? By consciously redefining what Americans mean when they use the term, "freedom," Lakoff maintains. He begins with looking at what he calls "simple freedom," the place where both conservatives and progressives ostensibly agree:

There is a simple understanding of freedom. Freedom is being able to do what you want to do, that is, being able to choose a goal, have access to that goal, pursue that goal without anyone purposely preventing you.... From this perspective, states are to be judged on the basis of how well they guarantee freedoms for all their citizens and provide as much freedom as possible, while restricting freedom as little as possible.

The definitional confusion—capitalized on by the right wing through repetition—begins with trying to give meaning to secondary characteristics of freedom. All of the crucial parts of simple freedom are left unspecified," Lakoff points out, and then asks, "What is to count as free will, ability, and interference?" It is largely on the battleground of free will that what he calls "contested" freedom begins. If I’m denied access to a quality education through an accident of birth, am I really able to exercise "free will?" If not only desirable connections, but information itself is unavailable, how "free" am I to take action on my own behalf and exercise my rights?

At this point, one runs up, of course, against the legendary "pull yourself up by your own bootstraps" school of thinking, which has increasingly insisted that Americans who can’t make it in this grand land have only themselves to blame (a perception that would be alien and surprising to the Greatest Generation, which came home from World War II and made use of the GI Bill to go to college, buy homes and use VA medical facilities to solidify the middle class). The recent conservative redefinition of freedom (often code-worded as "liberty") has succeeded in shifting the debate from public obligation to ensuring access in a competitive system, to private selection of who precisely is captured in notion of the "worthy poor" – who should shoulder the responsibility for failure in a "free" society. Lakoff points out that the nature of competition itself requires a large class of "losers" (the uninsured, the unemployed) to define the winners against.
On the face of it, Lakoff says, there is little logic to the "gotcha" vise created by the conjunction of free-market capitalists and Christian fundamentalists:

There is no objective reason why one’s views on abortion should have anything at all to do with one’s views on taxation, or on environmental regulations, or on owning guns, or on tort reform, or on torture. And yet radical conservatives tend to have the same views on all of these. And progressives tend to have the views opposite to those of radical conservatives on all these.

Lakoff blames an underlying authoritarian streak teased to the surface of American life with the rise of the Christian right; "morals" have entered the debate, and an increasingly narrow characterization of morality—fundamentalist Christian strict-father morality, specifically—has subtly undermined the more historically expansive and accepted notion of secular freedom.

So what’s the answer to reasserting control of the accepted definition of freedom? According to Lakoff, progressives need to school themselves in the often-resisted fact that pure rationality, explaining our policies and issues logically, simply isn’t enough.

Many progressives still abide by aspects of the rationalist myth, which results in destructive political consequences for progressives. For example, rationalism claims that, since everybody is rational, you just need to tell people the facts and they will reason to the same right conclusion. That’s just false, as we have learned from election after election. The facts alone will not set you free. If the frames that define common sense contradict the facts, the facts will be ignored.

Further, the author delivers the bad news that in his view, this rehabilitation of freedom as Americans have traditionally known it is not going to happen overnight and is not going to be satisfactorily addressed by our supposed progressive leaders.

Establishing the fundamental frames in public discourse takes patience and perseverance. It is a necessary investment in the future. This is probably not going to be done by major political leaders, who tend to want slogans that will work effectively right away. These frames need to be established instead by progressives across the country—whoever is speaking out on issues, especially those in the media. It is a necessary part of taking back freedom.

Connecting the emotional and visceral with the rational is of utmost importance in this battle, Lakoff maintains, and one that many progressives often resist, classifying framing and metaphor as a scurrilous bastard cousin of loathed marketing, manipulation, spin and sloganeering. They often assume that such emotional/rational linkage means sugar-coating words to be acceptable to the contested middle, but Lakoff is adamant that trying to appeal to the center is, in fact, one of the major problems with progressive strategy:

Conservatives know better. They don’t try to get more votes by moving to the left. Why? They understand that people in the center are biconceptuals, with strict morality governing certain aspects of their lives and nurturant morality governing other aspects. Which governs politics—strict or nurturant morality—can shift. It depends on which version of morality is activated for politics in this election. To activate your version of morality, you use the language of your moral system. That is, you talk to the center using the same language as you use with your base.

There is much, much more to this book than I’ve let on to here—examination of such words and notions as "responsibility," of the Bush administration’s use of "liberty" code words to its fundamentalist base, of the neurological road maps laid down by repetition, of the disputed territory of "freedom from" and "freedom to"—and I highly recommend progressives get hold of a copy pronto so we can begin discussing the many, many aspects of the book in targeted, subject-specific diaries. There is a great deal of fodder here, some of it familiar from Lakoff’s previous work, some of it delving deeper on subjects he’s addressed in passing and some of it new. As we move ahead in what I think of as a reclamation of terms and American ideas, there is work that can be done here, right here at Daily Kos, as we ponder our own deepest metaphors and beliefs and begin to apply the linguistic and conceptual lessons to our movement.




http://www.dailykos.com/storyonly/2007/5/20/112622/592
 
To some extent you are correct, to some you aren't. Things shouldn't be taken in absolutes. The difference you really are striking at is "negative" and "positive" liberty - think the government says it won't prevent you from doing, and things the government gives to you to allow you to do something.
 
WM is correct, this is describing a 'battle' that has raged in political philosophy since Berlin first coined the notion of positive and negative freedom, and before.

Lakoff is contributing nothing new to the debate, simply reaffirming the position of social Darwinism.

He might like to simply ignore the notion that will is innately not free, nor that the harm principle applies to negative freedom, but that doesn't mean that he should.

To impliment this, he would have to redesign, or eliminate, much of the social contract on which the notion of American society is designed. If all men are to be born equal in the face of the law, and the US is to be a social Darwinist society, then an innate contradiction occurs.

When brought before the courts, for example, a verdict in the favour of those who can afford legal representation is far more likely than one that cannot afford it.

The truth is that to form an viable society, it is important to create a mixture of negative and positive freedoms, positive freedoms (such as all men are equal) enshrined in the social contract, whilst the design of the social contract must incorporate maximum possible negative freedom.

Lakoff needs to chose what he thinks are the fundemental elements of US social culture, founding documents such as the constitution and bill of rights, or his notion of absolute negative freedom.
 
Lakoff is contributing nothing new to the debate, simply reaffirming the position of social Darwinism.



Lakoff is not promoting social darwinism. He's making the argument that THAT is the view of freedom by the radical right. That they're view of "freedom" is the "pull yourself up by your bootstraps" variety.
 
Lakoff is contributing nothing new to the debate, simply reaffirming the position of social Darwinism.



Lakoff is not promoting social darwinism. He's making the argument that THAT is the view of freedom by the radical right. That they're view of "freedom" is the "pull yourself up by your bootstraps" variety.
It is the "provide tools rather than give the end result" variety. This is another one of the places where people consistently twist words to make one side seem more "negative" than the other.

The "teach the man to fish" idea isn't "pull yourself up" part of it is actually helping another to learn.
 
Lakoff is not promoting social darwinism. He's making the argument that THAT is the view of freedom by the radical right. That they're view of "freedom" is the "pull yourself up by your bootstraps" variety.

Then my apologies to Lakoff.
 
damo, the radical right doesn't see it as a collective responsibility to provide the tools and environment to allow everybody equality of opportunity. They see it as the charitable duty of good-hearted individuals.

They don't see the point in using the mechanisms of government as a tool to expand freedom. That's why they have always fought against women's sufferage, civil rights legislation, and public health care.
 
It is the "provide tools rather than give the end result" variety. This is another one of the places where people consistently twist words to make one side seem more "negative" than the other.

As I said, a combination of both negative and positive liberty are essential to create a viable society, positive freedoms (such as all men are equal) enshrined in the social contract, whilst the design of the social contract must incorporate maximum possible negative freedom.
 
How true...kudos...!

It is the "provide tools rather than give the end result" variety. This is another one of the places where people consistently twist words to make one side seem more "negative" than the other.

The "teach the man to fish" idea isn't "pull yourself up" part of it is actually helping another to learn.


In other words...'Give your fellow man a hand up...not a hand out'
 
Ah. The motto of the self-satisfied well-to-do. Always comforting to find a justification for one's own arrogance, isn't it?
And an equally, pat-myself-on-the-back because I am so much more compassionate than the other guy, response from one of the self-same well-to-doers who thinks compassion is measured by the money you spend...

We can keep trading cliche responses, and fictitional categorizations... or we can realize that both sides have compassion, they just express it differently. We can agree to disagree, but to generalize and stereotype in such a manner is counterproductive. It begins to remind me of the "they're coming for our children" rhetoric of the past that divides and pretends that people in a different party are somehow of a different species devoid of human emotion.

The goal is the same, it is the path we argue about.
 
And an equally, pat-myself-on-the-back because I am so much more compassionate than the other guy, response from one of the self-same well-to-doers who thinks compassion is measured by the money you spend...

We can keep trading cliche responses, and fictitional categorizations... or we can realize that both sides have compassion, they just express it differently. We can agree to disagree, but to generalize and stereotype in such a manner is counterproductive. It begins to remind me of the "they're coming for our children" rhetoric of the past that divides and pretends that people in a different party are somehow of a different species devoid of human emotion.

The goal is the same, it is the path we argue about.
You're willing to stipulate that both sides have compassion, but are you willing to stipulate that neither side wants to breed dependency? Whatever your personal feelings on the matter, compassion is far less valued on your side than mine: it's not that much of a concession. :pke:
 
You're willing to stipulate that both sides have compassion, but are you willing to stipulate that neither side wants to breed dependency? Whatever your personal feelings on the matter, compassion is far less valued on your side than mine: it's not that much of a concession. :pke:
I would say that I already stipulated that with the remark that the goal was the same, just the path was different.

I would disagree that your path will get us there, and whether or not you want it to happen it often breeds dependancy. You would disagree that mine would get them there, and that it ignores need. Then we could get into whether or not one side or the other has "compassion".

The idea that your "side" values compassion more is the very type of remark I was speaking of, both sides express it differently.

I do not believe that the amount of money you spend on something is the measure of compassion.
 
I would say that I already stipulated that with the remark that the goal was the same, just the path was different.

I would disagree that your path will get us there, and whether or not you want it to happen it often breeds dependancy. You would disagree that mine would get them there, and that it ignores need. Then we could get into whether or not one side or the other has "compassion".

The idea that your "side" values compassion more is the very type of remark I was speaking of, both sides express it differently.

I do not believe that the amount of money you spend on something is the measure of compassion.
We can speculate on what people feel endlessly, but to little profit, in my view. It's better to look at what they say and do.

My side -- the side favoring more social services and less reliance on an unfettered market -- generally accuses those on the other side of lacking compassion. Your side -- favoring reliance on market forces and minimal social services -- accuses those on mine of breeding dependency.
 
We can speculate on what people feel endlessly, but to little profit, in my view. It's better to look at what they say and do.

My side -- the side favoring more social services and less reliance on an unfettered market -- generally accuses those on the other side of lacking compassion. Your side -- favoring reliance on market forces and minimal social services -- accuses those on mine of breeding dependency.
As I said, this relies on the stereotypes rather than the reality. Pretending one group has less compassion is propaganda to make the other feel superior. Whatever makes your game feel good I guess.

I believe that such accusations and reliance on over-simplified and inaccurate stereotypes simply helps to drive in that wedge all the more. No compassionate human wants to constantly be told they are "coming for our children" and other unfortunate divisive remarks.
 
As I said, this relies on the stereotypes rather than the reality. Pretending one group has less compassion is propaganda to make the other feel superior. Whatever makes your game feel good I guess.

I believe that such accusations and reliance on over-simplified and inaccurate stereotypes simply helps to drive in that wedge all the more. No compassionate human wants to constantly be told they are "coming for our children" and other unfortunate divisive remarks.
Fair enough. Neither does any intelligent person want to constantly be told they are "fostering dependency" or "promoting a sense of entitlement."
 
Excuse me...!

Ah. The motto of the self-satisfied well-to-do. Always comforting to find a justification for one's own arrogance, isn't it?


So it is arrogant to give someone a hand up?...But quite allright to carry them on welfare all their adult life and pass it on to their children! Sorry I just don't belive Socialism helps anyone...see the Soviet Republic for results!:pke:
 
So it is arrogant to give someone a hand up?...But quite allright to carry them on welfare all their adult life and pass it on to their children! Sorry I just don't belive Socialism helps anyone...see the Soviet Republic for results!:pke:

speaking of socialism and children. You think we should not have a public education system ?
 
Sorry I just don't belive Socialism helps anyone...see the Soviet Republic for results!

There is a fundamental difference between Communism and Socialism.

Socialism lays down certain positive freedoms, a right to education, healthcare, decent housing etc but doesn't eliminate negative freedoms in the manner Communism does.

In fact, Socialism is a 'helping hand', rather than a dependency system. It states that if you lay down the basics, for example education, people can learn and work their way out of poverty.

Socialism doesn't negate the idea of market forces, it simply states that certain elements of an individual's life are essential for them to thrive as human beings, and should be ring-fenced from market forces.

This is no different from the attitudes of many confessed capitalists on this board, who wish to ringfence the movement of labour from market forces.
 
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