45% of Doctors Would Consider Quitting

[Mott the Hoople]

Actually, this is not exactly correct... I agree that they can be suspect, but they can also be valuable pieces of information. The less respondents among the randomly selected group would increase the margin of error in the poll, and particularly on this one, "responses are still coming in" yet they published. However, it is a random selection of doctors, not "man on the street" and the validity can be mathematically figured in a case where there are a limited number of respondents.

http://journalism.wlu.edu/J203/polls.htm



Now, had they put it as an ad in a magazine or something (like an online poll that anybody could stumble upon) rather than selected people who were doctors randomly as they did it would be even more suspect and validity would be impossible.

You make some good points but it still weakens the scientific validity of the polls. The sample is still selecting itself, the doctors mostly likely to respond are the specialist who would be most negatively impacted economically. How do we know the generalist, who are in the most demand and have the most to gain by reform were adequately represented in this sampling.

I can tell you from my own personal experience that most generalist, internist, optomotrist, chiropractors, podiatrist have much to gain from reform as Insurance companies have selectively cut them out of the economic pie in favor of medical specialist who often are more invasive, less affective and certainly far more costly then more conservative treatment and modalities.

Many people, because of our present system and due to limited economic resource bizarrely find themselves in a position where often they could obtain less costly and more affective conservative treatment for their health issues but often have to go the route of more costly specialist because insurance won't cover the conservative treatment but will cover treatment from a specialist. Often they have to wait until an easily treatable chronic condition becomes an accute condition before then can obtain treatment because insurance won't cover the conservative care for chronic conditions but, again bizzarely, will cover the more costly and invasive specialist treatment for acute conditions.

 

[Mott the Hoople]

Get back to me when 45% of the doctors polled actually do quit because health care reform passed, and I'll admit I was wrong.

That's a good point. The only real conclusion that can be drawn, and not an inconsequetial one at that, is that the doctor's who responded would be unhappy with reform.

 

[DamnYankee]

That's a good point. The only real conclusion that can be drawn, and not an inconsequetial one at that, is that the doctor's who responded would be unhappy with reform.

Another is that some would quit, many would retire early and many more would choose another career path entirely.

 

[TuTu Monroe]

Another is that some would quit, many would retire early and many more would choose another career path entirely.

That's what the doctors are saying in my area.

 

[DamnYankee]

That's what the doctors are saying in my area.

My wife's in the medical profession and as a result we know a lot of doctors. Based on many conversations with these folks I'm sure that this is absolutely true. In fact there is a fourth option that several are considering: reducing their hours to limit their salaries and avoid the $250K Obama threshold and tax penalties. Many doctors can work three or four days per week, live a life with a lot less stress and with long weekends.

 

[Damocles]

You make some good points but it still weakens the scientific validity of the polls. The sample is still selecting itself, the doctors mostly likely to respond are the specialist who would be most negatively impacted economically. How do we know the generalist, who are in the most demand and have the most to gain by reform were adequately represented in this sampling.

I can tell you from my own personal experience that most generalist, internist, optomotrist, chiropractors, podiatrist have much to gain from reform as Insurance companies have selectively cut them out of the economic pie in favor of medical specialist who often are more invasive, less affective and certainly far more costly then more conservative treatment and modalities.

Many people, because of our present system and due to limited economic resource bizarrely find themselves in a position where often they could obtain less costly and more affective conservative treatment for their health issues but often have to go the route of more costly specialist because insurance won't cover the conservative treatment but will cover treatment from a specialist. Often they have to wait until an easily treatable chronic condition becomes an accute condition before then can obtain treatment because insurance won't cover the conservative care for chronic conditions but, again bizzarely, will cover the more costly and invasive specialist treatment for acute conditions.

As for the first part. If they "selected themselves" from a random selection of doctors the validity can still be figured with a plus/minus ratio applied. Much like people who refuse to answer on a phone survey.

The rest simply doesn't change anything that I posted previously.

 

[Cancel4]

That's what the doctors are saying in my area.

Name some. Since you're so close to them, I'm sure they won't mind at all.

 

[uscitizen]

Many doctors have stopped practicing due to being forced into defense medicine postures. It was the reason my mother strongly suggested I not enter the field of medicine.

It is foolish to ignore the fact that 71% answered in the negative when asked if they support this legislation and that many may leave the profession. When 1/6 of the economy is at stake it becomes important indeed.

some DR's need to operate in defensive mode because of their crappy work.
The meidcal field needs to better police it's own.

 

[Damocles]

some DR's need to operate in defensive mode because of their crappy work.
The meidcal field needs to better police it's own.

I agree with this, much like the "blue wall", there is a "stethoscope line" drawn.

 

[TuTu Monroe]

My wife's in the medical profession and as a result we know a lot of doctors. Based on many conversations with these folks I'm sure that this is absolutely true. In fact there is a fourth option that several are considering: reducing their hours to limit their salaries and avoid the $250K Obama threshold and tax penalties. Many doctors can work three or four days per week, live a life with a lot less stress and with long weekends.

Your wife is in an excellent field, but it's demanding. I loved it. I love a challenge and it was.

 

[uscitizen]

I have had 3 new DR's offices open in my small community in the last 8 months or so.
Signs in the front. Accepting new patients, no referral necessary.

 

[Taichiliberal]

Some doctors say they are going to "quit practicing" because of the cost of malpractice insurance, HMO policies, etc.

This has gone on for years.

How many actually follow through?

Look at it this way;

We need jobs in this country, and while young Americans are completing their medical education to fill the increased demand for heath care that reform will create, we will become the destination of choice for foreign-trained physicians.

Yep, and since this poll is in direct contradiction with the AMA, I'm not all that impressed or alarmed by it's results.

 

[DamnYankee]

I have had 3 new DR's offices open in my small community in the last 8 months or so.
Signs in the front. Accepting new patients, no referral necessary.

They are moving out of the big cities to start small practices with invariably lower pay...

 

[Taichiliberal]

Wow, you are all funny today. Unintentionally so, but funny nevertheless...

Anyway, I have never rejected unions as a whole, I think they have their place and time. I simply reject the union that is trying to force itself onto us as it has been less than useless for the people that work under its rather dubious "protection."

Hmmm, well you have a bunch docs who are going to quit/strike/whatever you want to call it because they can't have their way. This is EXACTLY the same thing that anti-union folk scream bloody murder about.

However, this isn't a "union", they didn't ban together and make an announcement, it was a poll. They answered individually, not as a group. This is like rejecting the "union-like" activities of "voters".

True enough. But do REALLY think that a doctor is going to quit practicing BEFORE reaching retirement age because of the anti-Obama bullshit? I mean, HMO's have NOT exactly been kind to doc's all these years, and you haven't had a slew of them quitting in protest, have you? Add to this that this poll is in contention with others, and it smells like just another anti-Obama "nobody tells me what to do" neocon mind fart that will disapate in a short time.

 

[Damocles]

True enough. But do REALLY think that a doctor is going to quit practicing BEFORE reaching retirement age because of the anti-Obama bullshit? I mean, HMO's have NOT exactly been kind to doc's all these years, and you haven't had a slew of them quitting in protest, have you? Add to this that this poll is in contention with others, and it smells like just another anti-Obama "nobody tells me what to do" neocon mind fart that will disapate in a short time.

I think it would depend on whether or not he believes he is ready for retirement already or if he believes he has a more fulfilling job lined up. Somebody with an MD can find jobs in other than in practice.

 

[uscitizen]

They are moving out of the big cities to start small practices with invariably lower pay...

I cannot fault anyone for leaving the big cities, no matter the reason.
Lower pay but lower standard of living. A nice 3 br rance on 3-5 acres here is still under 200K. Many older home avbailable for around under 100k.
They still make nice money here and are generally more appreciated than in the big city assembly line lifestyles.

 

[Taichiliberal]

I have had 3 new DR's offices open in my small community in the last 8 months or so.
Signs in the front. Accepting new patients, no referral necessary.

Cool! What do they charge?

 

[Taichiliberal]

Originally Posted by Taichiliberal
True enough. But do REALLY think that a doctor is going to quit practicing BEFORE reaching retirement age because of the anti-Obama bullshit? I mean, HMO's have NOT exactly been kind to doc's all these years, and you haven't had a slew of them quitting in protest, have you? Add to this that this poll is in contention with others, and it smells like just another anti-Obama "nobody tells me what to do" neocon mind fart that will disapate in a short time.

I think it would depend on whether or not he believes he is ready for retirement already or if he believes he has a more fulfilling job lined up. Somebody with an MD can find jobs in other than in practice.

So the passage of health care reform wouldn't be the determining factor if the doctor is going to retire or move on in the first place.

 

[uscitizen]

Cool! What do they charge?

I think an DR's visit is $75. Plus any extras, etc.
That is pretty typical GP charge for around here.
Not considering insurance of course.

 

[christiefan915]

Some doctors say they are going to "quit practicing" because of the cost of malpractice insurance, HMO policies, etc.

This has gone on for years.

How many actually follow through?

Look at it this way;

We need jobs in this country, and while young Americans are completing their medical education to fill the increased demand for heath care that reform will create, we will become the destination of choice for foreign-trained physicians.

Medical schools have more applicants than they can accept. It's laughable to think they all chose the profession because of money, and that they'd quit the profession because of money. Honestly, I don't want to be treated by any doctor who puts his wallet before patient welfare. Better those types get weeded out and leave the profession to the dedicated ones.