6 Types of Atheists

tekkychick said:
oh, I would love it if everyone would reject religion. (Sorry, Steelplate! and Sorry, MM, whenever you are back online!) Oddly, in some countries with an established religion (i.e. England) the church is a lot less important than in our country, which didn't establish a religion. Would we have been better off establishing one that everyone then rejected? Hard to tell, of course.

But if we tell people they can't follow a religion, they'll fight back by following the religion. Kind of like telling your daughter not to date someone... doesn't work.

I think we have to take the slow route - convincing people that while religion may be personally important to them, it shouldn't cause them to judge others; shouldn't cause them to make laws that enshrine their beliefs in to law; and, for those that are religious, continue the trend our country currently has of a lot of young people embracing a god but NOT embracing an established church.

Don't know if it will work. Muslims, Mormons are spreading pretty fast. People for some reason want someone telling them what to do. I just don't think there is anything a collective "we" can do to kill religion; any attempt will strengthen it. We just need to continue to push for a society that embraces everyone without the religious prejudice baggage so that people are more like Steelplate (a total believer, but not a fanatic) and less like PMP.

As a feminist, you won't catch me defending traditional religions. But I also don't defend goddess-worship or Wiccans either (except when I want to piss off a conservative); they seem just as unlikely to me.

Please do NOT accept my position, Rose; as someone of the younger generation, I'm hopeful you will help your generation be more enlightened than mine...
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In defense of Mormons, they have like one attrocity on their historical record, and then some more mud based upon polygamy. People mostly dislike them because they come off as weird and produce an awkward society.
 
tekkychick said:
(As far as OneArmSword's comment, I vote we just ignore him)
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So my comment was put on the ballot was it? Who counts the votes? And who records the final verdict? My reply represented the feelings of millions of Christians . Even world famous scientists are coming to the conclusion that the universe was designed and not a happenstance.
 
Threedee said:
In defense of Mormons, they have like one attrocity on their historical record, and then some more mud based upon polygamy. People mostly dislike them because they come off as weird and produce an awkward society.
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Racism too; they've only just gotten over that, not sure it's really "true"

They subjugate women.

The "blood atonement" thing they have going on is pretty creepy.

Are they worse than any other religion? Probably not. I mentioned them because they are incredibly successful at expanding their religion (as are Muslims). And I have full faith that if they got enough power, they would be willing to put their religion into our laws.

Look at how they funded the battle for prop 8 (against marriage equality) in California.

As far as Romney... I've always said (to friends and family) that I have no problem with a Mormon being president as long as they weren't a good Mormon..... by which I mean fanatical. I don't think Romney was a fanatic.
 
Steelplate said:
Look at our conservative brethren as an example. They believe that Capitalism with no regulation or limits is the only answer. Socialists...or more accurately, Communists on the far left feel much the same.

But what makes a dynamic society is one that uses elements of both....the economic freedom of Capitalism tempered with the compassion of Socialism.
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But what makes a dynamic society is one that uses elements of both....the economic freedom of Capitalism tempered with the compassion of Socialism.
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No thanks, tens of millions dead bodies highlight that compassion as you call it. Stalin and Mao loved people like you. They called them "useful idiots". That were to be used and then cast aside....
 
Steelplate said:
Ummm...what does the USA's religious policies keep you from doing? Yes...some of the more conservative States have draconian abortion laws, some don't allow gays to get married....but there are no border restrictions...you can move to a more liberal state.

Look the bottom line is....in a free society, religion is part of that freedom...and yes, no matter what the ideology....even going beyond religion....you will have fanatics.

Look at our conservative brethren as an example. They believe that Capitalism with no regulation or limits is the only answer. Socialists...or more accurately, Communists on the far left feel much the same.

But what makes a dynamic society is one that uses elements of both....the economic freedom of Capitalism tempered with the compassion of Socialism.
Click to expand...

When you say "Move to a more liberal state" - only recently is it possible for gays/lesbians to move to a state that will allow them to marry. Why should they have to uproot their lives due to local religions biases? And a woman who needs an abortion can't just uproot her life and move to another state. Even going to another state for abortion means loss of days at work, money spent on travel, etc.

I agree with the passing of the blue laws and things like that the USA laws are getting less religiously biased. But there's still some left in them.

And yes, religion or no religion there will be fanatics; there will be authoritarians; etc. That is, sadly, human nature.

And in a shoutout to compassionate religious - some churches in our town have banded together and have started a shelter; they serve a meal and give people a place to stay the night. Along with some local homeless, this has been great for people who live elsewhere but have to report to court in town in the morning - no bus can get them here early enough in the morning, so they come the night before, use the program, and are able to report to court on time.

So yes, there are some awesome people of faith out there. I just hope they would be just as compassionate if they didn't believe. But the churches did give them a way to organize, and they are offering a valuable service to the community.

And I like the line "the economic freedom of Capitalism tempered with the compassion of Socialism."
 
tekkychick said:
My recommendation is to ignore OnearmSword. I'm fairly sure he/she came over from the other board just to harass people on on this board. I could be wrong, and of course do as you prefer; but I would recommend just not responding.
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Huh? :) I actually misread his response.
 
tekkychick said:
oh, I would love it if everyone would reject religion. (Sorry, Steelplate! and Sorry, MM, whenever you are back online!) Oddly, in some countries with an established religion (i.e. England) the church is a lot less important than in our country, which didn't establish a religion. Would we have been better off establishing one that everyone then rejected? Hard to tell, of course.

But if we tell people they can't follow a religion, they'll fight back by following the religion. Kind of like telling your daughter not to date someone... doesn't work.

I think we have to take the slow route - convincing people that while religion may be personally important to them, it shouldn't cause them to judge others; shouldn't cause them to make laws that enshrine their beliefs in to law; and, for those that are religious, continue the trend our country currently has of a lot of young people embracing a god but NOT embracing an established church.

Don't know if it will work. Muslims, Mormons are spreading pretty fast. People for some reason want someone telling them what to do. I just don't think there is anything a collective "we" can do to kill religion; any attempt will strengthen it. We just need to continue to push for a society that embraces everyone without the religious prejudice baggage so that people are more like Steelplate (a total believer, but not a fanatic) and less like PMP.

As a feminist, you won't catch me defending traditional religions. But I also don't defend goddess-worship or Wiccans either (except when I want to piss off a conservative); they seem just as unlikely to me.

Please do NOT accept my position, Rose; as someone of the younger generation, I'm hopeful you will help your generation be more enlightened than mine...
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Haha, you hit the nail on the head.

My critique of religion is a kind of petty, moralistic one. Its a kind of individualist view on the authoritative presumptions of the believers.

But you are right. This should not be forced on people. It should be done, much like anything of its kind, as a cultural shift. We should be vocal, prolific, involved in activism and civil discourse, and so on. And maybe then we can change the collective conciousness when it comes to faith and authority. In this way, Hitchens and Dawkins, were a positive force.

As for my generation? To plagarize Gramsci: I'm an optimist out of will, pessimist out of intelligence. Hopefully, I'll play a role in changing that fact. ;)
 
Steelplate said:
Ummm...what does the USA's religious policies keep you from doing? Yes...some of the more conservative States have draconian abortion laws, some don't allow gays to get married....but there are no border restrictions...you can move to a more liberal state.

Look the bottom line is....in a free society, religion is part of that freedom...and yes, no matter what the ideology....even going beyond religion....you will have fanatics.

Look at our conservative brethren as an example. They believe that Capitalism with no regulation or limits is the only answer. Socialists...or more accurately, Communists on the far left feel much the same.

But what makes a dynamic society is one that uses elements of both....the economic freedom of Capitalism tempered with the compassion of Socialism.
Click to expand...

Yes, at least on this thread, you'll find no opposition to religious freedom.

But elaborate your criticism of socialism and communism a bit. We may be able to have an interesting enchange about that. :cof1:
 
Rose said:
Yes, at least on this thread, you'll find no opposition to religious freedom.

But elaborate your criticism of socialism and communism a bit. We may be able to have an interesting enchange about that. :cof1:
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I think that in society there needs to be individual incentive. Working for the collective is all well and good, but if it gets to the point where you're working your ass off and you aren't seeing the fruits of your labor.....complacency sets in....when that happens on a large enough scale, the system collapses.

It happens in a Capitalist system too....especially when the "Conglomerate" has so much control over policy.

That's why the individual's efforts must be rewarded. I saw a quote once....I think Marx took it a step further....you'll recognize it..."from each, according to their ability, to each, according to their contribution"
 
Steelplate said:
I think that in society there needs to be individual incentive. Working for the collective is all well and good, but if it gets to the point where you're working your ass off and you aren't seeing the fruits of your labor.....complacency sets in....when that happens on a large enough scale, the system collapses.

It happens in a Capitalist system too....especially when the "Conglomerate" has so much control over policy.

That's why the individual's efforts must be rewarded. I saw a quote once....I think Marx took it a step further....you'll recognize it..."from each, according to their ability, to each, according to their contribution"
Click to expand...

I don't know how socialism would eliminate individual incentive. In the kind of market based system I generally support, you are guaranteed a minimum standard of living, but exceeding that is always encouraged.
 
tekkychick said:
When you say "Move to a more liberal state" - only recently is it possible for gays/lesbians to move to a state that will allow them to marry. Why should they have to uproot their lives due to local religions biases? And a woman who needs an abortion can't just uproot her life and move to another state. Even going to another state for abortion means loss of days at work, money spent on travel, etc.

I agree with the passing of the blue laws and things like that the USA laws are getting less religiously biased. But there's still some left in them.

And yes, religion or no religion there will be fanatics; there will be authoritarians; etc. That is, sadly, human nature.

And in a shoutout to compassionate religious - some churches in our town have banded together and have started a shelter; they serve a meal and give people a place to stay the night. Along with some local homeless, this has been great for people who live elsewhere but have to report to court in town in the morning - no bus can get them here early enough in the morning, so they come the night before, use the program, and are able to report to court on time.

So yes, there are some awesome people of faith out there. I just hope they would be just as compassionate if they didn't believe. But the churches did give them a way to organize, and they are offering a valuable service to the community.

And I like the line "the economic freedom of Capitalism tempered with the compassion of Socialism."
Click to expand...

That's always been the basis for the separate states. The idea that each person can find the right location to settle down at. Puritans could be safe in MA/CT/NH, Anglicans were safe in the South, Catholics were supposed to be safe in Maryland (but the Anglicans took it over like the fucktards that they are), and everyone else was safe in PE and RI. That's just religion right there, but the list goes on into other topics.
 
Professor Baxter said:
http://www.alternet.org/belief/6-types-atheists-and-non-believers-america?page=0,1

http://www.alternet.org/belief/6-types-atheists-and-non-believers-america?page=0,1With the rising number of people in America— now nearly one in five—who have no religious affiliation at all, more people are asking questions about who exactly these unbelievers are. Not all of them identify as atheist or agnostic or a non-believer, but plenty do, and while there are many people offering to defend this particular community, few are willing to speak for them.


After all, unlike religious believers, non-believers have no authorities, no hierarchies, no theology, nothing for us to look at to determine exactly who these people are. In addition, the public image of atheists, who are a diverse group in reality, is being shaped by a handful of vocal white men—Richard Dawkins and Christopher Hitchens being the most famous—who, while well-respected in the atheist community, are not really representative.


Because of this, researchers at the University of Tennessee at Chattanooga decided to poll and interview non-believers to find out what kind of people abandon religious faith and why. Based on this research, the project authors were able to divide non-believers into six basic categories, some of which may surprise you.


First things first: While atheists have a public image of being dogmatic and belligerent—an image that famous atheists like Bill Maher only end up reinforcing—researchers found that to absolutely not be true. Only 15 percent of non-believers even fit in the category of those who actively seek out religious people to argue with, and the subset that are dogmatic about it are probably even smaller than that. But that doesn’t mean that the majority of non-believers are just sitting around, twiddling their thumbs and not letting atheism affect their worldview. On the contrary, researchers found that the majority of non-believers take some kind of action in the world to promote humanism, atheism or secularism. Here is a breakdown of the types.


http://www.alternet.org/belief/6-types-atheists-and-non-believers-america?page=0,1
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Your viewpoint of Atheists and non believers is effected by your own religious beliefs and is therefor null and void.
 
Behold, the six types of atheists

http://religion.blogs.cnn.com/2013/07/15/the-six-types-of-atheists/?iref=allsearch
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