A good example of why southern conservatives are not trusted.

apple0154 said:
The downfall is a part of the population is covered. Of course Medicare's cost is going to be high. It covers the people who require the most medical treatments because of age.

It's like having an insurance company that only covers cancer patients. That company would be in trouble.
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it isn't that difficult.....you simply need to calculate premiums to cover benefits plus administration.....can't a government figure out what private companies take for granted?......
 
apple0154 said:
Sweden taxes for more than health care. Other countries have lower taxes than Sweden.

Universal health care is paid for by taxes. That does not mean it costs more. The people are not paying premiums to an insurance company.

Look at the math. Per capita spending on health care is double in the US. and not all the people are covered. That means the people who are paying for health care are paying more than double what the citizens of other countries are paying.
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we provide more health care than they do.....
 
Mott the Hoople said:
I believe that's my point. That would be a conflict of interest.
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My point is by the government owning a car manufacturing business that does not necessarily mean there will be a conflict of interest. It can operate as any other car manufacturing business or it can wrongly favor any car manufacturer whether or not it owns a business.
 
maineman said:
people working at jobs that do not provide health care but provide a wage high enough to make the individual ineligible for medicaid.

do you mean to tell me you honestly did not know that?
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I honestly did not know you were foolish enough to equate health insurance with health care......are you seriously pretending that people who do not have health INSURANCE provided by their employers or by the state have nothing?......what about all those people who buy their own health insurance?.......what about all those people who don't carry insurance and buy their own health care?.....and finally, what about those people who walk into emergency rooms when they have a cold, get treatment and never pay for it?......
 
PostmodernProphet said:
it isn't that difficult.....you simply need to calculate premiums to cover benefits plus administration.....can't a government figure out what private companies take for granted?......
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You're forgetting that for eight years there was a government that didn't believe in government. How can one possibly expect a government to do a good job when the government intentionally wants to show that the government can not do a good job.

As you mentioned what's so complicated about figuring out what every private company figures out. There's nothing complicated about it. Dozens of countries have figured it out for generations.

That's why, when it comes to universal medical, all this talk about "it can't be done" or "it's so complicated" is nothing but nonsense. There are dozens of examples where it is being done.
 
apple0154 said:
You're forgetting that for eight years there was a government that didn't believe in government. How can one possibly expect a government to do a good job when the government intentionally wants to show that the government can not do a good job.
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put away your partisan mask.....Medicare has been fucked up for a lot more than eight years......
 
PostmodernProphet said:
why do you assume that if the government ran it, it would work properly?.....
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Mussolini kept the trains running on time. :)

As the old saying goes if they can figure out the departure and arrival time to put a man on the moon surely they can figure out a plane trip from NY to LA.
 
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apple0154 said:
Not to those who can't afford it and that's what it's all about.
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sorry, you can't have it both ways.....if that's what it's all about then stop using "they pay less" as a justification for your agenda......you're going to have to come up with some statistics to show how much those other nations pay for health care for those who can't afford it versus how much we spend before you can claim superiority.....

to start with, what percentage of Americans have no access to health CARE, not health insurance, but health care?......
 
PostmodernProphet said:
put away your partisan mask.....Medicare has been fucked up for a lot more than eight years......
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And members of the party that doesn't believe in government have been around for longer than eight years, as well.

As you said yourself private companies figure things out all the time. The only logical conclusion one can draw is the politicians who are responsible for figuring things out don't want to figure it out.

There are people who don't want the government involved regardless of how it works. That's the problem.
 
PostmodernProphet said:
sorry, you can't have it both ways.....if that's what it's all about then stop using "they pay less" as a justification for your agenda......you're going to have to come up with some statistics to show how much those other nations pay for health care for those who can't afford it versus how much we spend before you can claim superiority.....

to start with, what percentage of Americans have no access to health CARE, not health insurance, but health care?......
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The statistics are readily available on the net. The average is $3,000/per capita in countries with universal plans and $6,000/per capita in the US where some people are not covered.

There is no point discussing the difference between health insurance and health care. If you're implying care is always available then this entire discussion would be moot. No one would buy insurance and simply check into a hospital.
 
PostmodernProphet said:
then I expect because you want universal health care you will refuse to accept the payments your private insurance company sends your doctor and insist on paying them yourself?......
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Well, thanks for the honesty about the sheer and mind boggling depths of your hypocrisy. You don't dispute that no matter how much you whine about government insurance, that you would be the first in line to accept the myriad government insurance benefits that insure your money in the bank, that insures you against catastrophic disability, and that insures you a wage if you become unemployed. In fact, you don't dispute at all that you would happily, and gladly take advantage of those government insurance benefits if it was neccessary at some point in your life.

I'd be embarrassed to be as much of a hypocrite as you are, but I've learned that neocons and teabaggers have no honor or principles, as a general rule.


I don't even get your question. Is it supposed to be the standard NeoCon ruse of "Liberals are just as big hypocrites as I am! Democrats do it too!"? That seems to be standard NeoCon tradition, to project and assume that others are as unprincipled and hypocritical as you are.

If we had a national public single payer health insurance system, I would have no problem giving up my private insurance.

What do I care? Private insurance doesn't provide me healthcare. They're just a middleman that makes money off being a third-party in a financial transaction. Doctors, clinics, and hospitals are the ones that provide me health care.
 
apple0154 said:
The statistics are readily available on the net. The average is $3,000/per capita in countries with universal plans
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that doesn't tell me how much of it is spent on people who could not afford their own.....or are you saying that after decades of socialism, nobody in Sweden could afford their own (not unexpected of course).......
 
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