ACORN under scrutiny for voter fraud in Kansas City

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Clerk: One woman named Monica Ray registered 10 times

KANSAS CITY, Mo. (AP) — Officials in Missouri, a hard-fought jewel in the presidential race, are sifting through possibly hundreds of questionable or duplicate voter-registration forms submitted by an advocacy group that has been accused of election fraud in other states.

Charlene Davis, co-director of the election board in Jackson County, said many of the forms came from the Association of Community Organizations for Reform Now, or ACORN. She said they were bogging down work Wednesday, the final day Missourians could register to vote.

"I don't even know the entire scope of it because registrations are coming in so heavy," Davis said from her office in the Kansas City suburb of Independence, the county seat. "We have identified about 100 duplicates, and probably 280 addresses that don't exist, people who have driver's license numbers that won't verify or Social Security numbers that won't verify. Some have no address at all."

The nonpartisan group works to recruit low-income voters, who tend to lean Democratic. In bellwether Missouri, polls show Republican presidential candidate John McCain and Democrat Barack Obama appear to have pulled even.

Jess Ordower, Midwest director of ACORN, said his group hasn't done any registrations in Kansas City since late August. He said he was told three weeks ago by election officials that there were only about 135 questionable cards - 85 of them duplicates.

"They keep telling different people different things," he said. "They gave us a list of 130, then told someone else it was 1,000."

FBI spokeswoman Bridget Patton said the agency has been in contact with elections officials about potential voter fraud and plans to investigate.

"It's a matter we take very seriously," Patton said. "It is against the law to register someone to vote who does not fall within the parameters to vote, or to put someone on there falsely."

On Tuesday, authorities in Nevada seized records from ACORN after finding fraudulent registration forms that included the starting lineup of the Dallas Cowboys.

In April, eight ACORN workers in St. Louis city and county pleaded guilty to federal election fraud for submitting false registration cards for the 2006 election. U.S. Attorney Catherine Hanaway said they submitted cards with false addresses and names, and forged signatures.

Ordower said Wednesday that ACORN registered about 53,500 people in Missouri this year. He believes his group is being targeted because some politicians don't want that many low-income people having a voice.

"It's par for the course," he said. "When you're doing more registrations than anyone else in the country, some don't want low-income people being empowered to vote. There are pretty targeted attacks on us, but we're proud to be out there doing the patriotic thing getting people registered to vote."

Davis estimated there may be around 1,000 questionable registration cards in her office she can attribute to ACORN.

"They're stamped ACORN," she said. "They say ACORN right on them. We're not guessing."

Republicans are among ACORN's loudest critics. At a campaign stop in Bethlehem, Pa., supporters of John McCain interrupted his remarks Wednesday by shouting, "No more ACORN."

According to its national Web site, the group has registered 1.3 million people nationwide for the Nov. 4 election. It also has encountered complaints of fraud stemming from registration efforts in Wisconsin, New Mexico, Nevada and battleground states like Michigan, Ohio and North Carolina, where new voter registrations have favored Democrats nearly 4 to 1 since the beginning of this year.

Missouri offers 11 electoral votes; the presidential candidates need at least 270 to win the election.

POSTERS NOTE: I know there are already two posts dealing with ACORN but I think it is important to show that this is NOT just in Nevada or Denver. This organzation is implicated or connected to fraudulent voter registration all over the US.
 
When someone acts as your agent you are responsible for their bad acts. You are supposed to monitor them. ACORN is dirty and like I said if this was the NRA Desh would be near stroke. Funny she has not denied that.

too bad that does not apply to CEO's.
 
When someone acts as your agent you are responsible for their bad acts.

If I paid someone to go and collect 100 signatures and they just filled out 100 bogus names, sent them back to me, and I turned them in and they were, of course, rejected, who's fault is that? You Republicans blame the victim in more situations that just rape.
 
I don't know what you want them to do Soc. Would you want me to go door to door with that guy and see that he's getting real signatures and not defrauding me? And with everyone else I hire? Wouldn't that defeat the purpose?

Is it my fault if my identity is stolen too?
 
When someone acts as your agent you are responsible for their bad acts. You are supposed to monitor them. ACORN is dirty and like I said if this was the NRA Desh would be near stroke. Funny she has not denied that.


You are wrong.

they turned them in themselves.

If the NRA hired someone to collect voter regs and that person stayed home and made up regs instead in so doing, defrauding the NRA I would laugh but I would not suggest that the NRA did it on purpose.
 
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If I paid someone to go and collect 100 signatures and they just filled out 100 bogus names, sent them back to me, and I turned them in and they were, of course, rejected, who's fault is that? You Republicans blame the victim in more situations that just rape.

And you once wanted to be a lawyer! Under the strict code of law, as Soc said, if someone acts as your agent you are responsible for their actions.
 
And you once wanted to be a lawyer! Under the strict code of law, as Soc said, if someone acts as your agent you are responsible for their actions.


Um, that's stupid. Unless ACORN is paying these employees to write up fictitious voter registrations, ACORN is a victim of fraud, too and is not responsible for the unauthorized actions of its agents.
 
Um, that's stupid. Unless ACORN is paying these employees to write up fictitious voter registrations, ACORN is a victim of fraud, too and is not responsible for the unauthorized actions of its agents.

I believe that there are means for the organization to avoid being held responsible, but in the strict sense of the law, that's the line of responsibility. Desh suggested that ACORN itself turned those workers in, so would have legally avoided being held responsible for their fraudulent actions.
 
I dont know why that is so hard for people to get here?

If the people prove ACORN instructed them to waste their money and fill them out illegally then OK.

The problem is is that is not what has happened in ANY of these cases.


If the NYT pays someone to deliver papers and they break a store window to rob it with the paper instead of delivering the paper I dont think anyone should say the NYT robbed the store.
 
Um, that's stupid. Unless ACORN is paying these employees to write up fictitious voter registrations, ACORN is a victim of fraud, too and is not responsible for the unauthorized actions of its agents.

If this was an isolated event, you might have a point. But take a look at the number of instances that ACORN has had this same problem. While it may stem from their paying their employees based on registrations acquired, it is STILL there responsibility.

If I go out and act fraudulently while representing my firm, both myself and my firm are liable for my actions.

Falling back on 'oh, gee I didn't know what my employees were doing' is NOT a valid excuse.
 
This whole attack on ACORN is designed to scare poor people away from registaring to vote.

1.3 million perfectly legal American voters have been brought into taking part in our democracy because of this group.
 
If this was an isolated event, you might have a point. But take a look at the number of instances that ACORN has had this same problem. While it may stem from their paying their employees based on registrations acquired, it is STILL there responsibility.

If I go out and act fraudulently while representing my firm, both myself and my firm are liable for my actions.

Falling back on 'oh, gee I didn't know what my employees were doing' is NOT a valid excuse.


The bottom line is that ACORN is not legally responsible for the unauthorized actions of its employees. Look at it this way, if a pizza joint hires a delivery guy and the delivery guy deals drugs on his deliveries the pizza place isn't guilty of dealing drugs solely because their employee was a dealer.

Now, perhaps ACORN negligently supervised its employees, but that doesn't make it complicit in voter registration fraud. It just makes it a bad employer.
 
SP they hire temps within the community to actually walk the streets to gather the regs.

They are temp workers.

Out of the tens of thousands they have hired a few dozen scattered throughout the states have been stupid enough to fake some with famous football players names and such.

They all got caught because ACORN turns them in and now you act like ACORN is a criminal group?

fucking A
 
And you once wanted to be a lawyer! Under the strict code of law, as Soc said, if someone acts as your agent you are responsible for their actions.

OK so if I pay McDonald's to make my burger and they poison it am I liable for my own death? They are my burger-making agent under Soc's retarded knowledgeless interpretation of the law.
 
These temp workers were ACORN's agent for one purpose only: to LAWFULLY register voters. If they go and do anything else, they are not doing it as ACORN's agent. If they buy a hotdog and eat it is not ACORN's hotdog. If they rob a bank it is not ACORN's robbery. If they UNLAWFULLY register voters it is not ACORN's unlawful registry. They have not fulfilled the contract, because they haven't put up enough LAWFULLY registered names.
 
These temp workers were ACORN's agent for one purpose only: to LAWFULLY register voters. If they go and do anything else, they are not doing it as ACORN's agent. If they buy a hotdog and eat it is not ACORN's hotdog. If they rob a bank it is not ACORN's robbery. If they UNLAWFULLY register voters it is not ACORN's unlawful registry. They have not fulfilled the contract, because they haven't put up enough LAWFULLY registered names.

and in your McDonalds example... they hire people to make burgers WITHOUT poison. But that does not remove McDonalds liability should the employee poison someone. They are still responsible for the actions of their employees.
 
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