Attempt to rekindle Domestic Oil Drilling...

uscitizen said:
You refuse to answer the question then ?

Yes this was a diversion, but an important one.

that was kinda like a Dixie dance there Damo.
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I answered directly and without obfuscation. The attempt to pretend that I did not is deliberately dishonest.

Bush's arguments would have been moot because the reason that we were supposed to "fear" these people would not exist.
 
uscitizen said:
Design and implementation are not the same thing.

but I agree in principle, we should be able to make good safe nuke plants now.
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That's true. Westinghouse has completed the certification programs and several utilities have filed request for permits to build. I think somewhere between 6 - 9 requests in the U.S. I do not recall the total generating capacity that these represent, BUT it's the same plant design in each case rather than custom, so the contractors should be able to get a learning curve going here.

What inoressed me is that the safety systems are set up t require no human intervention AND these systems operate off of motive sources such as gravity and are not dependent on having back-up generators / power available.
 
Damocles said:
I answered directly and without obfuscation. The attempt to pretend that I did not is deliberately dishonest.

Bush's arguments would have been moot because the reason that we were supposed to "fear" these people would not exist.
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LoL, I have been waiting for years for this level of realization about why we invaded Iraq to set in.
I guess I am still a bit premature.
Patience USC.

that is ok damo it will take a few more years of rationalization and high energy prices for us to be able as a nation to accept invading and killing for someone elses oil because "we deserve it".
 
The bill Hinchey voted for today, H.R. 6251, the "Use It or Lose It" bill, would have compelled the oil and natural gas industries to start drilling on the 68 million acres which they are currently warehousing, or be barred from obtaining any more federal drilling leases until they demonstrate that they are diligently developing those lands. The bill also gives companies an incentive to relinquish their non-producing leases, creating an opportunity for another company to explore and perhaps produce oil or gas from them. Under the bill, the terms of leases which are in production, or which can demonstrate diligent development, are extended.



Then give up the rights to the land that is not productive!

They are full of shit and just want more land added to their list that they can control.

If they want more hand back the other land, they wont and do you know why?

They just want more land under their control and will use any reason to gain more wether its true or not.
 
uscitizen said:
SF,
And who says it is economically viable to drill ? the oil companies
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God you are retarded. It is determined by the costs to drill the hole (how deep is it, what type of material do you have to drill throughetc...), get equipment and man power to the site etc....

It is typically far cheaper to drill on land than it is off shore. Far cheaper to drill off shore than deep sea. It costs more to produce oil from shale than it does light sweet. There are many factors and NO they are not determined solely by the oil companies. They are determined by the site and the state of the oil.
 
Desh said:
The bill Hinchey voted for today, H.R. 6251, the "Use It or Lose It" bill, would have compelled the oil and natural gas industries to start drilling on the 68 million acres which they are currently warehousing, or be barred from obtaining any more federal drilling leases until they demonstrate that they are diligently developing those lands. The bill also gives companies an incentive to relinquish their non-producing leases, creating an opportunity for another company to explore and perhaps produce oil or gas from them. Under the bill, the terms of leases which are in production, or which can demonstrate diligent development, are extended.



Then give up the rights to the land that is not productive!

They are full of shit and just want more land added to their list that they can control.

If they want more hand back the other land, they wont and do you know why?

They just want more land under their control and will use any reason to gain more wether its true or not.
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More government silliness where elected officials think they know better than anyone else.
 
Desh said:
The bill Hinchey voted for today, H.R. 6251, the "Use It or Lose It" bill, would have compelled the oil and natural gas industries to start drilling on the 68 million acres which they are currently warehousing, or be barred from obtaining any more federal drilling leases until they demonstrate that they are diligently developing those lands. The bill also gives companies an incentive to relinquish their non-producing leases, creating an opportunity for another company to explore and perhaps produce oil or gas from them. Under the bill, the terms of leases which are in production, or which can demonstrate diligent development, are extended.



Then give up the rights to the land that is not productive!

They are full of shit and just want more land added to their list that they can control.

If they want more hand back the other land, they wont and do you know why?

They just want more land under their control and will use any reason to gain more wether its true or not.
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I agree with your analysis Desh....they want the leases, to hold on to the land...making prices rise....

Those SOB's....I never thought that this would be the case, but knowing the oil company's increased percentage of profits per dollar spent by them the past few years, along with them buying back their own stock, along with them having the leases for millions upon millions of acres of the outer continental shelf for nearing 2 years now and NOT EVEN ONE tiny little tugboat of theirs has been sent in to these regions they lease for ANY KIND of exploration, and all other areas of the Gulf of mexico and other waters of the usa, leaving ONLY 7-9% of our oceans still under moritorium now from what I heard....

is PROOF they have NO INTENTIONS of drilling for more oil in the gulf, WHEN they can SO EASILY thru their Oil Contracts with Iraq, just drill a hole in the sand and reap the benefits of such for the next 30 years of their leases with Iraq at a much cheaper production/drilling cost with the USA tax payers paying for their security with our soldiers and contractor's lives.

Here is the full press release, if you had not posted it already, on the millions in oil leases given to them...

And so help me goodness, why the hell did our gvt give them these leases in the first place, without getting some kind of assurance of at least exploration of oil/natural gas?

They DO NEED to relinquish their leases if they do nothing with them, (after a certain amount of time), but to KEEP OTHER Entrepeneurs from drilling there....

There has to be some sort of legal way to protect the American people from this kind of manipulated usery...?

The NewsRoom
Fact Sheet: Energy Security Act
Date: March 20, 2008

Minerals Management Service and the Gulf of Mexico Energy Security Act of 2006

On December 20, 2006, the President signed into law the Gulf of Mexico Energy Security Act of 2006 (Pub. Law 109-432). The Act significantly enhances OCS oil and gas leasing activities and revenue sharing in the Gulf of Mexico (GOM). The Act:

requires leasing in 8.3 million acres in the GOM, including 5.8 million acres that were previously held under Congressional moratoria;

bans oil and gas leasing within 125 miles off the Florida coastline in the Eastern Planning Area, and a portion of the Central Planning Area, until 2022;

shares leasing revenues with Gulf producing states and the Land & Water Conservation Fund for coastal restoration projects; and,

allows companies to exchange certain existing leases in moratorium areas for bonus and royalty credits to be used on other GOM leases.
Access to Acreage for Leasing

The law requires that 8.3 million acres be offered for oil and gas leases. This acreage is included in both the Central Gulf Planning Area and the Eastern Gulf Planning Area. Approximately 2 million acres in the Central Gulf was first offered for lease after enactment of the law was and was included in Lease Sale 205 in October 2007. Approximate .5 million acres in the Eastern Gulf received additional environmental review and is being offered in Lease Sale 224 in March 2008.

The remaining 5.8 million acres in the Central Gulf is undergoing environmental review and is expected to be offered in Lease Sale 208 in 2009.

The Act also created revenue sharing provisions for four Gulf oil and gas producing States – Alabama, Louisiana, Mississippi and Texas, and their coastal political subdivisions. There are two timeframes involved in revenue sharing. From Fiscal Year 2007 through Fiscal Year 2016, 37.5 percent of all revenue including bonus bids, rentals and production royalty will be shared among the four States and subdivisions for those new leases in the
.5 million acres in the Eastern Gulf and the 5.8 million acres in the Central Gulf.

Revenue Sharing

There is a cap of $500 million for qualified OCS revenues shared beyond 2016. From Fiscal Year 2017 and beyond, the four States and subdivisions will share 37.5 percent of revenues from all Gulf leases issued after December 20, 2006.

GOMESA funds are to be used for coastal conservation, restoration and hurricane protection.

Extended Moratorium

The Act also updated moratoria areas in the Gulf. Those tracts in the Eastern Gulf of Mexico that are within 125 miles of Florida, all tracts east of the Military Mission Line, and tracts in the Central Gulf of Mexico within 100 miles of Florida that are included in the moratorium area which extends until 2022.

Credit Exchange for Eligible Leases

The Act also allowed for the exchange of existing leases in the moratorium areas for bonus or royalty credit to be used in the Gulf of Mexico.

A credit will be provided to lessees who relinquish certain eligible leases in the Gulf of Mexico. Leases are considered eligible if they lie within 125 miles off the Florida coast in the Eastern Planning Area or within 100 miles off the Florida coast in the Central Planning Area. The lessees will be allowed to use the credits in lieu of monetary payment for either a lease bonus bid or royalty due on oil and gas production from most other leases in the Gulf of Mexico or transfer the credits to other Gulf of Mexico lessees for their use.

MMS: Securing Ocean Energy & Economic Value for America
U.S. Department of the Interior
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Care
 
Troglodyte27 said:
More government silliness where elected officials think they know better than anyone else.
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If their arguement is the land they currently are allowed to drill is unproductive then they should have no problem turning over the drilling rights.

What in the fuck is silly about that ?
 
We have another case of government making a pronouncement based on politics rather than fact. Government has impeded progress at every turn, yet now that the issue is full blown in front of us, they yell that not enough has been done! Do something now! Our policies are based on chasing the last data point and not a rational look at the system as a whole or any kind of THINKING. Deming quantifies 'last data point chasing' (type 4 error) as the WORST way to solve problems.
 
yeah govt impeded progress. the transcontinental railroad. TVA, rural electrification, Interstate highway system. Health acts, etc. many more.
 
Yeah people are stupid and the people who run the corporations are the only smart ones.

Trog why the hell do you think government makes mistakes?

They do because some corporate whore buys their cooperation to rape us.

The only reason they want to more land under drilling rights is to control the oil that comes from these lands wether they drill or not.

Why do you refuse to see the reality of the situation?
 
Almost all emotive and reactionary policy turns out to be a mistake in the end. On occasion they can back into something good, but knee-jerking is not a good basis for law.

Take time, argue it, make it right.

It is true that they hold land and do nothing, less than the demonizers suggest, but more often than is good.
 
How did I miss this slow pitch thread right in my strike zone.
1. Dungheap have you have 1 economics class. Your saying it matters not where the oil comes from. 300 billion dollars shiped overseas and not here is an enourmous/gigantic pull down on our economy. There would be at least 100,000 jobs at and average of near 100k salary if that were not the case.
2. Desh your good at parroting the dem talking points, and our leaders are doing them too. LOFL So we're not greedy bastards in the oil industry after all, we've left all this oil in the ground the last 100 yrs. This may be the dems funnies talking point.
We spend billions each year looking for oil and go hundreds of miles offhore and drill MILES under the Gulf floor to get it. But we passed on the low hanging fruit. Yeah that's a grown up point.
 
Topspin said:
How did I miss this slow pitch thread right in my strike zone.
We spend billions each year looking for oil and go hundreds of miles offhore and drill MILES under the Gulf floor to get it. But we passed on the low hanging fruit. Yeah that's a grown up point.
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Thank you Toppy. Just got out of a real stressful meeting and that made me laugh.
 
I love my fellow democrats and I tease them in jest.
$130 oil is much more appealing than $20 like it was 10 yrs ago. Why the hell to I want all these billions of barrells on the market???
 
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