Attempt to rekindle Domestic Oil Drilling...

You need to retake economics 101. Even with gold at record prices, you know that some of the gold mines are not running at all! Why?

I don't know about Gold, I do know about these capped wells. As I explained, it is a 'supply and demand' thing. You know what that is, right? You see, when the supply is short, and demand remains high, the price goes up. Higher price means more profit for the oil company, so they keep the capped oil wells capped, so that supply will remain low and demand will make the price rise and profits increase. Not only do they realize increased profits, they also pressure Congress into easing restrictions on areas they previously couldn't drill in, which will mean even more profit in the future. It's really not that complicated.

I am all for allowing them to drill in Alaska, off the coast of California, Florida, and the Gulf of Mexico, but I want them to be forced to open up these capped wells and start using what we already have available to us. In other words, I want the supply increased to the point it will have an effect on the price. I think I understand more about Economics than you do.
 
Who knew dixie would be for nationalizing the oil industry? If you're going pass laws micromanaging to the degree he seems to desire, we might as well just take them over ala hugo.

Never said a word about "nationalizing" anything. If you want to call it "micromanaging" that is fine with me, it needs to be done that way to insure the oil companies don't screw us, as they will certainly do.
 
I am stating that the cause for the attack on 9/11 to begin with was because of this reliance. What came after is all after-effects of our stupid insistence on foreign reliance.

Of course, not reading what I actually say is your forte.

We wouldn't have been worrying about attack from that sector at all if we had removed ourselves from the reliance on foreign sources of oil. All of the Bush arguments would have been moot.
I believe you are vastly over simplifying our relationship with the ME. First, we have a relationship with Israel that is not related to ME oil fields. Second, we have close ties with countries whose dependence on ME oil is far and away larger than our own. (We get most of our foreign oil from South America.)

Due to our relationship with Israel, we also have developed ties with ME countries who don't hate Israel - like Kuwait. We also have developed relationships with anti-Israel countries, like Egypt, Saudi Arabia, etc. We also would have developed a presence there - appreciated by a few, hated by most, when we were assisting Afghanistan against the Soviet invasion.

Of course, the oil factor is a huge, and still the primary factor in our dealing with the ME. But to say 9/11 would not have happened if we were not reliant on foreign oil is not seeing the larger picture. We probably would still have had a strong and friendly relationship with Kuwait. We probably still would have supported Saddam's rise to power as a buffer to Iran's trouble making, due to their anti-Israel stance even without oil as an added motivator.

As such, we probably still would have faced the same situation in stationing troops in the ME in response to Saddam's invasion of Kuwait. And that is what triggered OBL's targeting of the US.
 
I believe you are vastly over simplifying our relationship with the ME. First, we have a relationship with Israel that is not related to ME oil fields. Second, we have close ties with countries whose dependence on ME oil is far and away larger than our own. (We get most of our foreign oil from South America.)

Due to our relationship with Israel, we also have developed ties with ME countries who don't hate Israel - like Kuwait. We also have developed relationships with anti-Israel countries, like Egypt, Saudi Arabia, etc. We also would have developed a presence there - appreciated by a few, hated by most, when we were assisting Afghanistan against the Soviet invasion.

Of course, the oil factor is a huge, and still the primary factor in our dealing with the ME. But to say 9/11 would not have happened if we were not reliant on foreign oil is not seeing the larger picture. We probably would still have had a strong and friendly relationship with Kuwait. We probably still would have supported Saddam's rise to power as a buffer to Iran's trouble making, due to their anti-Israel stance even without oil as an added motivator.

As such, we probably still would have faced the same situation in stationing troops in the ME in response to Saddam's invasion of Kuwait. And that is what triggered OBL's targeting of the US.
That's a lot of probablys there, douchebag. None of those terrorist over there would have nearly the wealth they have now were it not for our idiotic globalization scheme. But of course, that the point of globalization isn't it, to empower other nations to destroy america. Isn't it, you illuminati douchebag.
 
That's a lot of probablys there, douchebag. None of those terrorist over there would have nearly the wealth they have now were it not for our idiotic globalization scheme. But of course, that the point of globalization isn't it, to empower other nations to destroy america. Isn't it, you illuminati douchebag.
We don't fucking buy much oil from them, lack brain. It was not our money that made the ME suddenly enormously wealthy - it was primarily from Europe. Venezuela and Mexico are our big suppliers as anyone with two connected neurons knows.

Learn something before spouting your bullshit. (unless you like looking like a 12 year old imbecile.)

But in the meantime you can sit in your little secluded dwelling in your little secluded area spouted mind numbingly ignorant paranoid shit about things you are completely without reference while hiding your fiat dollars under your fiat mattress until you can afford to buy a 1992 Fiat.
 
We don't fucking buy much oil from them, lack brain. It was not our money that made the ME suddenly enormously wealthy - it was primarily from Europe. Venezuela and Mexico are our big suppliers as anyone with two connected neurons knows.
The percentage we get from them has become way too high, and that money does matter to them. Period.
Learn something before spouting your bullshit. (unless you like looking like a 12 year old imbecile.)
You learn something, piddling jackanapes.
But in the meantime you can sit in your little secluded dwelling in your little secluded area spouted mind numbingly ignorant paranoid shit about things you are completely without reference while hiding your fiat dollars under your fiat mattress until you can afford to buy a 1992 Fiat.

Your fascist assholery isn't charming.

Fiat currency is exactly what makes our entire financial system a basically totalitarian system. You run from this topic everytime. Face it, nazi.
 
GoodLuck, anyone with two connected neurons can google "us oil imports" and find that our leading supplier is not south america. It is Canada, then Saudi Arabia, then Mexico.

I tend to agree with your point about Israel, and I do think we would still be involved in the middle east with military presence, even IF we weren't dependent on the oil. Less dependence may mean a little more time at the negotiation table and a little less sense of urgency regarding military intervention, but I think the enemy would still be Islamofacists. They use the "excuse" of US military presence in Saudi Arabia as their reason for Jihad, but if it weren't that, it would be "westernizing" the middle east, or "corporate interests" in the middle east, or the old "support of Israel" excuse.
 
GoodLuck, anyone with two connected neurons can google "us oil imports" and find that our leading supplier is not south america. It is Canada, then Saudi Arabia, then Mexico.
My bad - I did not think to look at the date of the book I was reading the other day.

I tend to agree with your point about Israel, and I do think we would still be involved in the middle east with military presence, even IF we weren't dependent on the oil. Less dependence may mean a little more time at the negotiation table and a little less sense of urgency regarding military intervention, but I think the enemy would still be Islamofacists. They use the "excuse" of US military presence in Saudi Arabia as their reason for Jihad, but if it weren't that, it would be "westernizing" the middle east, or "corporate interests" in the middle east, or the old "support of Israel" excuse.
The central point is there are several other reasons than U.S. oil interests that has the U.S. politically and economically involved in the ME. Oil would (and will) still be a major factor, because even if the U.S. itself has no oil interests in the ME, we have several significant allies who do. Then there is, as many often complain about, our alliance with Israel. The end analysis shows that while oil interests are a major factor, lack of oil interests most likely would not have significantly changed the historical events that led to OBL targeting the U.S.

And from 9/11 on, the events of history were in Bush's hands, who has been more interested in his place in history than the health of the country. (War presidents are invariably more referenced in history than peacetime presidents.)
 
My bad - I did not think to look at the date of the book I was reading the other day.

What was the date, 1938? lol ;)


The central point is there are several other reasons than U.S. oil interests that has the U.S. politically and economically involved in the ME. Oil would (and will) still be a major factor, because even if the U.S. itself has no oil interests in the ME, we have several significant allies who do. Then there is, as many often complain about, our alliance with Israel. The end analysis shows that while oil interests are a major factor, lack of oil interests most likely would not have significantly changed the historical events that led to OBL targeting the U.S.

In a sense, you are correct. The US has vital economic interest in the world markets, and will have to be interested as long as it continues to sell off it's domestic assets. Those who complain about our support of Israel, are the same ones who have complained about Israel since it was formed, and this will never change, for what should be obvious reasons. I overheard someone talking about this incessant complaining of our support for Israel the other day, and the response proved a great point. If you were traveling abroad and lost you passport and ID completely, had nothing... where would you rather be? Afghanistan, Saudi Arabia, Egypt, Iran, Pakistan or Israel? You might actually stand a chance at getting fair treatment by the government of Israel, the others? We may never hear from you again.

And from 9/11 on, the events of history were in Bush's hands, who has been more interested in his place in history than the health of the country. (War presidents are invariably more referenced in history than peacetime presidents.)

This is where you lose me. We can't say that 9/11 would have happened if we had been independent of Saudi Oil and Bush Sr. hadn't been challenged to protect the Saudi Kingdom from Saddam with US Military forces. It may not have happened on 9/11/01... it would have eventually happened. This is a fanatical religious movement that has gained popularity in that part of the world, and is currently still being taught daily to school kids in Saudi Arabia!

They are literally taught from an early age, to hunt down and kill the infidel and jew, until the trees and rocks they hide behind, cry out... there is a jew or infidel hiding behind me, come kill it! This is what they teach in the schools!

Now........ We can sit here, like we did in 1937...38....39...40... and let this thing continue to grow and flourish across that region of the world and eventually spread into Europe and take it over too. We've done that before, and paid a pretty heavy price in terms of American lives. OR... we can combat it now, we can defeat it before it takes over half of the world, and we have to pull a magic nuclear bunny out of the hat to win it. That is kind of how I see it, we really don't have a choice, we have to fight it or be defeated by it eventually. The longer we prolong the fight and pretend there is some alternative, the tougher the ultimate job of defeating it becomes. This thinking was best described by Churchill as 'feeding the alligator' and the example fits well here. As long as we stand on the principles of human equality and respect for human rights, and oppose terror, oppression, and hate, we are on the right side and I am completely in support of such a fight.
 
We don't fucking buy much oil from them, lack brain. It was not our money that made the ME suddenly enormously wealthy - it was primarily from Europe. Venezuela and Mexico are our big suppliers as anyone with two connected neurons knows.

Learn something before spouting your bullshit. (unless you like looking like a 12 year old imbecile.)

But in the meantime you can sit in your little secluded dwelling in your little secluded area spouted mind numbingly ignorant paranoid shit about things you are completely without reference while hiding your fiat dollars under your fiat mattress until you can afford to buy a 1992 Fiat.

what and spoil all the fun, half the point of coming here is seeing asshat and usged make asses of themselves daily.:cof1:
 
All our offshore oil reserves are estimated at a 10-12 year supply at current consumption rates. What do we do after that ?
 
All our offshore oil reserves are estimated at a 10-12 year supply at current consumption rates. What do we do after that ?

We certainly can't open any more area's up because a huge democratic talking point says it wouldn't affect price.:pke:
 
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