I'm repulsed to say: we need more conservative Democrats

That's why it's called an EXAMPLE. The topic of Republican corruption would take a book to write about.

Why don't you tell us all you know about the K Street project? Or the history of Medicare Part D?
 
so facts about republican party cheating that is completely documented in the USA courts right up to the SCOTUS is lies?


wow


you have been outed
 
Craig234 said:
That's why it's called an EXAMPLE. The topic of Republican corruption would take a book to write about.

Why don't you tell us all you know about the K Street project? Or the history of Medicare Part D?
Click to expand...

because they are meanigless if you cant win elections because you refuse to stop election cheating


CLEAN ELECTIONS

how the fuck can you be against that?
 
TTQ64 said:
IMO, as far as the minorities not coming out to vote is not because they are complacent or not inspired, it's because their votes are being suppressed. Besides that, the numbers are low in red state because they cheat then blame their win on minorities not coming out to vote. Black women come out to vote every election every cycle and Black men, well most cant vote if they wanted to.

This all boils down to cheating. The only thing republicans are good at.
Click to expand...
Cheating...which includes the closing of polling stations in Blue districts, changing the rules for college students, and creating long lines by including pages of ballot initiatives is indeed a big reason for the issues you mentioned. But they all came out in droves for Obama, so I have to revert back to my previous comments.
 
evince said:
because they are meanigless if you cant win elections because you refuse to stop election cheating


CLEAN ELECTIONS

how the fuck can you be against that?
Click to expand...

Why don't you tell us all you know about the K Street project? Or the history of Medicare Part D?
 
evince said:
so facts about republican party cheating that is completely documented in the USA courts right up to the SCOTUS is lies?


wow


you have been outed
Click to expand...

No, THOSE aren't the lies, and you ignored your last warning to stop lying and being an asshole and are not on ignore. Because you aren't usually like this I'll consider giving you aother chance after a period of time.
 
Craig234 said:
I'll reply about the topic to your next post, but the problem was not Bernie's great leadership for the right policies.

You say the problem was Democrats who liked his policies who decided to 'teach Democrats a lesson' - something I argued with them not to do - but more Bernie supporters voted for Hillary, than in 2008 Hillary supporters voted for Obama. Only 10% didn't.
Click to expand...
We need to clarify something first. I don't believe there was a more qualified candidate to actually legislate, than Hillary.....warts and all. But, she did have warts, and Bernie appealed to the masses who don't necessarily follow the issues, but they loved his (flawed) platform.

I love that he finally came out with my idea for a fee on Wall St. transactions, but he wanted to piss the money away on silly programs that didn't really make sense.

I said the problem was with Independents (read...college kids and much of the Obama coalition) who wanted to teach the DNC a lesson.

I don't know if I agree with your numbers re Bernie supporters. Many voted for trump, and many stayed home. You might be referring to people who voted....but that wasn't what got trump elected.
 
TTQ64 said:
Over 1 million Americans voted for Clinton over dump. She did what she was suppose to do. The racist EC is why dump is in office. We need to stop blaming ourselves and put the blame where it belongs and, that's solely on the racist EC.
Click to expand...
Black participation was down in this election...no matter the reason. That isn't debatable. Given that trump won by 77,000 votes, any decline had a direct affect.

You don't click links, so I won't bother citing Pew results.
 
Althea said:
Cheating...which includes the closing of polling stations in Blue districts, changing the rules for college students, and creating long lines by including pages of ballot initiatives is indeed a big reason for the issues you mentioned. But they all came out in droves for Obama, so I have to revert back to my previous comments.
Click to expand...


They came out for Hilary as well.
 
Craig234 said:
No, I'm not suggesting anyone lie. Let me try to spell this out.

Imagine in a district there are 100,000 voters. Imagine 100 of them are very wealthy and want selfish plutocrat policies that will take from the poor and give to them - Republican policies.

If democracy was working, if voters were informed, they'd lose horribly, getting only their own 100 votes.

Now imagine the polls show that the top issues for the voters are social conservative issues. 80% don't like gay marriage. 90% think their gun rights are under attack. 65% don't like the NFL protests.

Now these voters, if asked whether they like the plutocrat policies, might say; perhaps probably say no. But they're not what they're concerned about.

The choice at the ballot for them:

A Republican who cares about nothing but their wealthy donors and voting for plutocracy, but has a campaign that talks about nothing but what the voters want to hear on gays, on guns, any any other issues polls show they care about.

Their opponent is a Democrat who shares the national Democratic views - pro-equality, pro-saving lives in urban areas with more gun control, and so on. Because of the social issues, the Republican gets 80% of the vote - and passes plutocracy.

What if instead, there was a Democrat who ran giving the voters what they want on social issues - while a minority within the Democratic Party - but would NOT support the Republicans' plutocrat agenda (or the corporate Democrats for that matter)?

THAT Democrat might have a better chance to win the election, and while we keep fighting to change the minds of those voters on the social issues, Republicans AREN'T taking $6 trillion and healthcare away from the people.

Instead, we're just handing the district for free to the say-anything Republican who will use social issues to get elected - the wolf in sheep's clothing who will vote for plutocrat policies but run on social issues.

I'm not saying for the national party to change its policies to those views. I'm not saying not to TRY to get a progressive elected instead if they can be. I'm not saying not to try to get the voters to change their opinions.

I *am* saying to recognize that while voters DO have the wrong views on social issues, it'd be nice to not let that hand the election to the plutocrats who will destroy the country - to try to actually win some elections.

The Republicans are building a massive political machine, built on the right for unlimited money in politics, billionaire donors, a propaganda industry of 'think tanks' that create lies to sell the American people on false opinions, a massive media machine to
dominate what the people hear, Gerrymandering and voter suppression, a massive lobbying industry that offers politicians a pay raise if they are voted out so they don't have to listen to voters.

We need to fight that with better than losing a majority of seats and letting Republicans destroy the country. And if that means in the short term giving voters what they want in order to not let plutocrats use social issues to win, it's a price we need to pay.
Click to expand...
I believe I have a grasp on your theory, but this is what I asked about. Either the Dem would be lying about the social issues, or he's not really a guy we want in the House. I see your point, because it's the Tea Party in reverse to a point.

So you don't believe there are enough Dem voters in these districts to care about, thus sacrificing them with the 180 on the social issues?

Again...I live in a Red region of a Blue state. Nobody here would vote for a candidate with a D in front of his name, no matter what he promised. Perhaps other regions are different.

BUT...look at what just happened in Virginia. It took an overwhelming number of Democrats coming out, in order to win an 8 point margin for the Dems governor. They literally had to have a landslide at the voting booths, to win in an average spread.

That's due to the gerrymandering, but what if you disenfranchised most of those Dems with inane social rhetoric?
 
Althea said:
Black participation was down in this election...no matter the reason. That isn't debatable. Given that trump won by 77,000 votes, any decline had a direct affect.

You don't click links, so I won't bother citing Pew results.
Click to expand...

It's debatable to me. Voter suppression was even stronger in the south once the republicans saw how many came out to vote for President Obama. They went in full force to suppress the Black vote to make sure that didn't happen again and they succeeded . But yet, Black women still voted overwhelming for Clinton, while white women voted overwhelming for dump.

I'm just tired of whites always blaming Blacks for losing elections that were stolen in the first place.

Blaming people who votes are intentional suppressed. How about blaming white women who's votes weren't suppressed for voting for dump.

Over 3 million more people voted for Clinton, they came out to vote. It's the racist EC that gave the win to dump.

Let's stop playing into the BS of dems losing because of people, mainly people of color not coming out and all the other BS reason's the right wing throws out there and we suck up.

Let's focus on fair elections and holding the racist right accountable for cheating.
 
A record 137.5 million Americans voted in the 2016 presidential election, according to new data from the U.S. Census Bureau. Overall voter turnout – defined as the share of adult U.S. citizens who cast ballots – was 61.4% in 2016, a share similar to 2012 but below the 63.6% who say they voted in 2008.


can you say ID laws that target black voters




http://www.pewresearch.org/fact-tan...as-a-record-number-of-americans-cast-ballots/



dont blame the voters

blame the people who cheated those voters
 
when youleave out of your dicision making a HUGE fact like Democracy is bein g subverted bythe republican party and that is what tbheie wealthy fucking donors are paying for you make the wrong decisions for what the Democratic party should do.



WE SHOULD STOP THE FUCKS FROM CHEATING
 
TTQ64 said:
It's debatable to me. Voter suppression was even stronger in the south once the republicans saw how many came out to vote for President Obama. They went in full force to suppress the Black vote to make sure that didn't happen again and they succeeded . But yet, Black women still voted overwhelming for Clinton, while white women voted overwhelming for dump.

I'm just tired of whites always blaming Blacks for losing elections that were stolen in the first place.

Blaming people who votes are intentional suppressed. How about blaming white women who's votes weren't suppressed for voting for dump.

Over 3 million more people voted for Clinton, they came out to vote. It's the racist EC that gave the win to dump.

Let's stop playing into the BS of dems losing because of people, mainly people of color not coming out and all the other BS reason's the right wing throws out there and we suck up.

Let's focus on fair elections and holding the racist right accountable for cheating.
Click to expand...
You don't get fair elections until you turn the states Blue. That won't happen by staying home
 
evince said:
A record 137.5 million Americans voted in the 2016 presidential election, according to new data from the U.S. Census Bureau. Overall voter turnout – defined as the share of adult U.S. citizens who cast ballots – was 61.4% in 2016, a share similar to 2012 but below the 63.6% who say they voted in 2008.


can you say ID laws that target black voters




http://www.pewresearch.org/fact-tan...as-a-record-number-of-americans-cast-ballots/



dont blame the voters

blame the people who cheated those voters
Click to expand...
It's easy to blame cheating, but trump won by 77,000 votes. The record Pew cites is due in large part to the Nazi vote, that includes the white racist group that typically doesn't get involved in politics.

trump inspired racists to vote, and Clinton inspired her base, and nobody else.

Cite the paragraph in that link that shows black voter participation down 7%, and black voters in general down by almost 1 million.
 
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