Kerry Is Still Pouting

[Cancel7]

I simply won't be "intimidated" into thinking every election is "stolen"...

I put forward thread after thread showing how there were actually more people registered to vote than actually lived in some of these highly Dem counties, but that is all ignored...

There are always irregularities in an election, but D counties do not fake election results against their candidates. They do control their own machines, they do control who gets in and how quickly... Our County Clerk would be so unelectable if she didn't have enough books to get more people into boxes than was happening in some of those places...

Yes, the number of machines thing was a problem, but mathematically set by the predecessor...

This whole idea that somehow all these D elected officials suddenly found love for bush and helped him steal an election is total hogwash...

Damo what in hell are you talking about??? The democrats did it! Just stop it.

Ohio is going dem this year. There's a small, evil part of me which hopes that the dems do the same thing, just so I can see you little weenies start to cry. I mean, the hypocrisy would be so entertaining. However, Democracy is more important to me, so I'll just be thankful that the corrupt repukes are getting their asses kicked out of Ohio, by the citizens of that state, and that maybe come 08, we can actually have an election.

And let's see then Damo, if the dem districts have so few voting machines that blacks have to wait in line all day to vote. You might actually have fooled yourself into believing that's the case.

If so, you're in for a surprise.

 

[Damocles]

Once again, the formula used for machine placement was set in place by a predecessor, not by Blackwell. Clearly it needed tweaking, but making it all his fault is a bit overzealous...

 

[Care4all]

Once again, the formula used for machine placement was set in place by a predecessor, not by Blackwell. Clearly it needed tweaking, but making it all his fault is a bit overzealous...

That's not true, show a link that says it was under someone elses control and show a link that they sent out the machines the same way they did the previous election...

and if they did that, WHY? why not in 4 years correct these districts being SHORTED SO DRASTICALLY and republican districts being flooded so drastically with voting machines.

He was the head of the elections in the state Damo!

Personally, I do not believe any elected official of the state should also head any particular party's election in the state...let alone a government official that is responsible for making everything involved in the election fair and balanced.

this is the only way to stop the rumor mills and also the corruption or possible corruption accusations regarding elections.

 

[Damocles]

Personally, I do not believe any elected official of the state should also head any particular party's election in the state...let alone a government official that is responsible for making everything involved in the election fair and balanced.

this is the only way to stop the rumor mills and also the corruption or possible corruption accusations regarding elections.

I agree that any elected official should not be the head of a party's election, especially if they are the one responsible for a fair election...

I do not agree that an elected official does not have to follow rules set in motion by predecessors, if they did not there would be no need for Constitutions...

The whole mathematical formula was set up on the previous vote population rather than the current registration or expectation... It was a preset formula that the state had used for years. One of the main objections now is that Blackwell won't put in effect the specific plan that the Dems want him to for future elections, he tweaked the formula differently than they want him to. It's not hard to figure that out, type in formula machines blackwell and find all the stories about machine placement and how Blackwell "refuses to use our formula"...

 

[Cypress]

You aren't partisan at alllllll are you cypress?!!!!

The point is,I'm not so partisan that I will go along with something just because someone from the Bush adm says it....that would make me less than partisan,and someone who can think on her own

krissy, you're displaying the very definition of blind partisanship.

Accussing Kerry of being a traitor for pointing out atrocities occured in vietnam, while giving General Tommy Franks a pass for saying the same thing. Presumably because tommy franks is a republican.

And you accused Dan Rather of treason in vietnam without a shred of evidence, even when you were asked to provide evidence.

 

[Cypress]

Once again, the formula used for machine placement was set in place by a predecessor, not by Blackwell. Clearly it needed tweaking, but making it all his fault is a bit overzealous...

I only saw long-lines in minority districts. Never in white middle and upper class districts.

Simply coincidence, and beauracratic bungling? Perhaps. Its possible there are other explanations.

 

[Damocles]

I only saw long-lines in minority districts. Never in white middle and upper class districts.

Simply coincidence, and beauracratic bungling? Perhaps. Its possible there are other explanations.

Where was the record new registrations? Remeber the reports of those? Like I said the formula involved previous voting population (actual voters in those precincts who went to the polls) and did not consider new registration. It was how the formula was constructed...

 

[Cypress]

Where was the record new registrations? Remeber the reports of those? Like I said the formula involved previous voting population (actual voters in those precincts who went to the polls) and did not consider new registration. It was how the formula was constructed...

Odd that the massive lines only seem to occur in Red states controlled by republicans. Ohio and Florida, for example.

I don't think the lines in minority districts were that bad in California and New York. But, I could be wrong. I don't dismiss that there was some competent of bureacratic incompetence involved.

 

[Care4all]

find all the stories about machine placement and how Blackwell "refuses to use our formula"...

And you think that proves SOMETHING in blackwell's favor? When he was WARNED THAT HE F-ED UP, and that he was not distributing them so that the people's vote of ohio would be counted and this absolves him somehow?

really?

 

[Care4all]

Odd that the massive lines only seem to occur in Red states controlled by republicans. Ohio and Florida, for example.

I don't think the lines in minority districts were that bad in California and New York. But, I could be wrong. I don't dismiss that there was some competent of bureacratic incompetence involved.

precisely cypress...logic has to come in to play at some point, ya know?

the districts effected drastically by this were all Democratic or darn near all democratic districts...are the repubs claiming that repubs did not add any new voters to their registration rolls out of the million new voters and that is why they were not shorted machines?

And who the HELL WOULD RUN the distribution of machines based on an election 4 years previously, when they were VERY AWARE THAT THEY ADDED 1 MILLION PEOPLE to the voters roll?

they have ABSOLUTE UPDATED INFO on all of the new voters and what districts they were adding new voters to....they use these rolls at the election polls to check off your name when you come in to vote.

He was INCOMPETANT as the secretary of state responsible to the people of ohio in making their vote count.

And you all put him up for a promotion...?

that is what sickens me about politics...

care

care

 

[Damocles]

Odd that the massive lines only seem to occur in Red states controlled by republicans. Ohio and Florida, for example.

I don't think the lines in minority districts were that bad in California and New York. But, I could be wrong. I don't dismiss that there was some competent of bureacratic incompetence involved.

The record new registration were in the districts that this took place. The mathematical formula used the previous voting numbers. There were more than three times the regular number of voting in those districts causing the mathematical formula to create those lines....

You are being deliberate in actually ignoring what I have written so that you can pretend that I haven't stated anything.

 

[Care4all]

Blackwell BRAGS about the million new registered voters that he helped get....record highs of new voters.

How can anyone with a BRAIN and RESPONSIBLE for the vote of the people of ohio being counted, NOT address this issue at the voting booth level?

 

[Cypress]

The record new registration were in the districts that this took place. The mathematical formula used the previous voting numbers. There were more than three times the regular number of voting in those districts causing the mathematical formula to create those lines....

You are being deliberate in actually ignoring what I have written so that you can pretend that I haven't stated anything.

I was under the impression that there were many new registrants in New York and California too, were there didn't appear to be massive lines in minority districts.

I don't think it was just Ohio and Florida that had a big influx of new voters.

 

[Damocles]

The issue had precedent in law. He had to use the formula that was presented. Of course I don't believe that he really had a problem with using it either. But the formula was written into law earlier. Simply pretending that he could do something different when it was what he was set to do is disingenuous. The law has been changed, but not to exactly what the Ds wanted so they complain on websites and blogs... This isn't going to be an issue in the next election the new formula takes registration into account.

This is one of those, "most people don't know about election laws and how this is done so we can cast doubt and make him look evil if we take advantage of it," tactics...

Our clerk has no recourse but to give us a certain amount of machines based on last election's voter population. Our state formula takes into account new residents as well as registration, theirs at the time didn't... He used the formula and they got the amount of machines that was proper for the amount of people who voted in the previous election as the law there told him. Just as our County Clerk has no other choice than to insure we have a certain amount of machines agreeable to those previous and current numbers so it was with him...

Now each County can purchase and keep extra machines, and large population Counties normally do, why these did not I cannot imagine.

 

[Damocles]

I was under the impression that there were many new registrants in New York and California too, were there didn't appear to be massive lines in minority districts.

I don't think it was just Ohio and Florida that had a big influx of new voters.

The formulas for machines were different in those states. Each state runs a different election and has their own formulas for machine placement. In this case the formula was inadequate to new registration and has since been changed.

 

[Cypress]

The formulas for machines were different in those states. Each state runs a different election and has their own formulas for machine placement. In this case the formula was inadequate to new registration and has since been changed.

I understand your point that the "formulas were different".

I still can't understan why there were such huge problems with lines in minority districts in Ohio and Florida, but evidently not so much in New York and California (although, I could be wrong).

Everyone had much higher voter turnout. Is it just conincidence that the massive lines were more evident in Red States? Are california and new york simply more competent than ohio and florida?

these are legitimate questions.

And the bottom line is, whether intentional or not, there have been and are more barriers to easy voting for minorities. This is a major problem that needs to be addressed.

 

[Damocles]

The larger populations made it so they had this problem previously and therefore created new formulas to better serve their populace. Usually because of lawsuits.

In this case they corrected it without lawsuits, the new formulas take into account registration and new residence unlike the old ones.

 

[Gaffer]

I don't think there will be any change in party controll in Ohio this year. 04 had a very good turn out and there were the usual voting problems. On election day I can only speak for what I saw. Butler county had no lines to speak of any where. While Warren county had long lines with people standing outside. Warren is a republican county. affluent area as well. So Blackwell must have missed that one.

There is just as much fraud on the demcrat side in any election as there is on the republican. I agree with dema that the elections need to be monitored by a non partisan non elected official.

After election day it wil be interesting to see the dems reaction when they don't do any better than they are now. If they lose the house and senate again they are going to go completely nuts.

 

[Care4all]

I think it is impossible for the Dems to lose the house change over....but knowing them, they will find a way to try to lose it!

 

[Trinity]

I also had no problem in Ohio with long lines. I was in Brown County and there were no lines there I was in and out with no problem at all.