MI/FL Do over?

Obama would be foolish to even consider it

What???

Since when do politicians who already have their own dog in the fight, get to have a say in how the rules get changed?

Obama would be foolish to consider do-overs, you say, I assume since he's currently ahead and do-overs might help Hillary catch up?

Yes, he would be foolish... unless he actually believed all the Democrat poppycock about "one man, one vote" and thought it was important that some of his potential constituents not be disenfranchised.

Given their conflicit interests in the issue, how on earth can Obama (or Hillary) have any voice in the matter? Do you actually think either Democrat would stand on PRINCIPLE when it threatens his or her power?????

From the article:
Democratic National Committee Chairman Howard Dean wouldn't say Thursday if he supported the Florida Democratic Party's proposal of a combination mail-in vote and in-person election, saying only that the best option is whatever he can get Hillary Clinton and Barack Obama to agree to.

"The best option is whatever we can get the candidates to agree with....
Ummm, no, Howard. The best option is whatever is most fair to the citizens of the U.S., which includes those residing in FL and MI.

Unsurprisingly, Howard Dean has forgotten (if he ever knew it) that elections are held to benefit the electorate, not the candidates.
 
regardless clinton wont net more then like 20 delegates out of Florida and Michigan do overs and it will put obama closer to the mark even without the 350 supers left.
 
Initially, before a specific date had been decided upon by the Republicans, some Democrats did actively support the idea of moving earlier in the calendar year. That changed when Speaker Rubio announced he wanted to break the Rules of the Democratic and Republican National Committees. Following this announcement, DNC and Florida Democratic Party staff talked about the possibility that our primary date would move up in violation of Rule 11.A.

Party leaders, Chairwoman Thurman and members of Congress then lobbied Democratic members of the Legislature through a variety of means to prevent the primary from moving earlier than February 5th. Party leadership and staff spent countless hours discussing our opposition to and the ramifications of a pre-February 5th primary with legislators, former and current Congressional members, DNC members, DNC staff, donors, activists, county leaders, media, legislative staff, Congressional staff, municipal elected officials, constituency leaders, labor leaders and counterparts in other state parties. In response to the Party’s efforts, Senate Democratic Leaders Geller and Wilson and House Democratic Leaders Gelber and Cusack introduced amendments to CS/HB 537 to hold the Presidential Preference Primary on the first Tuesday in February, instead of January 29th. These were both defeated by the overwhelming Republican majority in each house.

The primary bill, which at this point had been rolled into a larger legislation train, went to a vote in both houses. It passed almost unanimously. The final bill contained a whole host of elections legislation, much of which Democrats did not support. However, in legislative bodies, the majority party can shove bad omnibus legislation down the minority’s throats by attaching a couple of things that made the whole bill very difficult, if not impossible, to vote against. This is what the Republicans did in Florida, including a vital provision to require a paper trail for Florida elections. There was no way that any Florida Democratic Party official or Democratic legislative leader could ask our Democratic members, especially those in the Florida Legislative Black Caucus, to vote against a paper trail for our elections. It would have been embarrassing, futile, and, moreover, against Democratic principles.

Who cares about the paper trail?
Floridians do. Our state has had far too many election controversies. A verifiable paper trail for elections is something Democrats have fought for since the election debacle of 2000. It is a groundbreaking change in a state that has no standardized voting and a long record of disastrous elections. In fact, the Government Accountability Office (GAO) continues to investigate Florida’s District 13 Congressional election in which touch-screen voting machines lost 18,000 ballots in the most Democratic part of the district - putting a Republican in Congress by less than 400 votes, instead of an accomplished Democratic woman who worked her way from bank teller to bank president before running for Congress.

Read the fucking history of the law.

The dems tried and tried to change the primary date back to fit the DNCs requirements. They were shut down by the republican majority in the state house.
 
Over the weekend, on Fox Brett Hume interviewed one of the whiners from Florida who also supports Clinton and said the delegates should count as is. Brett confronted her with who introduced the bill on the Senate floor in Florida and she had to admit that it was introduced by a republican. He then asked how many dems voted against the bill and she immediately broke out with "these are inappropriate questions". The Dems in Florida were ALL for moving the primary up so Florida would be relevant in the primary season thinking they would be all over if they stayed where they were. THis is why the Primaries ALL need to be held on the same day in June. A general primary election and let the chips fall where they may.
 
Initially, before a specific date had been decided upon by the Republicans, some Democrats did actively support the idea of moving earlier in the calendar year. That changed when Speaker Rubio announced he wanted to break the Rules of the Democratic and Republican National Committees. Following this announcement, DNC and Florida Democratic Party staff talked about the possibility that our primary date would move up in violation of Rule 11.A.

Party leaders, Chairwoman Thurman and members of Congress then lobbied Democratic members of the Legislature through a variety of means to prevent the primary from moving earlier than February 5th. Party leadership and staff spent countless hours discussing our opposition to and the ramifications of a pre-February 5th primary with legislators, former and current Congressional members, DNC members, DNC staff, donors, activists, county leaders, media, legislative staff, Congressional staff, municipal elected officials, constituency leaders, labor leaders and counterparts in other state parties. In response to the Party’s efforts, Senate Democratic Leaders Geller and Wilson and House Democratic Leaders Gelber and Cusack introduced amendments to CS/HB 537 to hold the Presidential Preference Primary on the first Tuesday in February, instead of January 29th. These were both defeated by the overwhelming Republican majority in each house.

The primary bill, which at this point had been rolled into a larger legislation train, went to a vote in both houses. It passed almost unanimously. The final bill contained a whole host of elections legislation, much of which Democrats did not support. However, in legislative bodies, the majority party can shove bad omnibus legislation down the minority’s throats by attaching a couple of things that made the whole bill very difficult, if not impossible, to vote against. This is what the Republicans did in Florida, including a vital provision to require a paper trail for Florida elections. There was no way that any Florida Democratic Party official or Democratic legislative leader could ask our Democratic members, especially those in the Florida Legislative Black Caucus, to vote against a paper trail for our elections. It would have been embarrassing, futile, and, moreover, against Democratic principles.

Who cares about the paper trail?
Floridians do. Our state has had far too many election controversies. A verifiable paper trail for elections is something Democrats have fought for since the election debacle of 2000. It is a groundbreaking change in a state that has no standardized voting and a long record of disastrous elections. In fact, the Government Accountability Office (GAO) continues to investigate Florida’s District 13 Congressional election in which touch-screen voting machines lost 18,000 ballots in the most Democratic part of the district - putting a Republican in Congress by less than 400 votes, instead of an accomplished Democratic woman who worked her way from bank teller to bank president before running for Congress.

Read the fucking history of the law.

The dems tried and tried to change the primary date back to fit the DNCs requirements. They were shut down by the republican majority in the state house.


Nice spin by the Democratic site. "Initially some Democrats suppported..." The vote was 118-0. That is ALL Democrats supported.
 
So basically the Fl. Dems let the republicans pi mp them?


Like sausage its always disscusting. You have to make vaulue judgements like paper trails for voting machines and then try to get the dates chaged later.

At least the votes will count in the general elections instead of being stolen.
 
cawacko do you really think they should have sacraficed paper trails of votes for this?

it's their choice. California did the same thing of moving up its dates. But for a state that complains about having disenfranchised voters to then disenfranchise its own voters is pretty ironic.
 
Well, the republicans seem to have had their $hit together:

"The state-run Presidential Preference Primary date is set by the Florida Legislature. In the 2007 legislative session, the Republican Speaker of the House made it a priority to move up the Primary to January, in violation of both Democratic and Republican National Committee Rules."
 
Either way, the FL. Dems dropped the ball on this and because no one had teh foresight to have a date declared before they voted on it they are getting screwed. They should suffer the political consequences.
 
Hey at least the votes will actually have to be tallied now.

I would have made the same sacrafice if forced to choose.
 
Initially, before a specific date had been decided upon by the Republicans, some Democrats did actively support the idea of moving earlier in the calendar year. That changed when Speaker Rubio announced he wanted to break the Rules of the Democratic and Republican National Committees. Following this announcement, DNC and Florida Democratic Party staff talked about the possibility that our primary date would move up in violation of Rule 11.A.

Party leaders, Chairwoman Thurman and members of Congress then lobbied Democratic members of the Legislature through a variety of means to prevent the primary from moving earlier than February 5th. Party leadership and staff spent countless hours discussing our opposition to and the ramifications of a pre-February 5th primary with legislators, former and current Congressional members, DNC members, DNC staff, donors, activists, county leaders, media, legislative staff, Congressional staff, municipal elected officials, constituency leaders, labor leaders and counterparts in other state parties. In response to the Party’s efforts, Senate Democratic Leaders Geller and Wilson and House Democratic Leaders Gelber and Cusack introduced amendments to CS/HB 537 to hold the Presidential Preference Primary on the first Tuesday in February, instead of January 29th. These were both defeated by the overwhelming Republican majority in each house.

The primary bill, which at this point had been rolled into a larger legislation train, went to a vote in both houses. It passed almost unanimously. The final bill contained a whole host of elections legislation, much of which Democrats did not support. However, in legislative bodies, the majority party can shove bad omnibus legislation down the minority’s throats by attaching a couple of things that made the whole bill very difficult, if not impossible, to vote against. This is what the Republicans did in Florida, including a vital provision to require a paper trail for Florida elections. There was no way that any Florida Democratic Party official or Democratic legislative leader could ask our Democratic members, especially those in the Florida Legislative Black Caucus, to vote against a paper trail for our elections. It would have been embarrassing, futile, and, moreover, against Democratic principles.

Who cares about the paper trail?
Floridians do. Our state has had far too many election controversies. A verifiable paper trail for elections is something Democrats have fought for since the election debacle of 2000. It is a groundbreaking change in a state that has no standardized voting and a long record of disastrous elections. In fact, the Government Accountability Office (GAO) continues to investigate Florida’s District 13 Congressional election in which touch-screen voting machines lost 18,000 ballots in the most Democratic part of the district - putting a Republican in Congress by less than 400 votes, instead of an accomplished Democratic woman who worked her way from bank teller to bank president before running for Congress.

Read the fucking history of the law.

The dems tried and tried to change the primary date back to fit the DNCs requirements. They were shut down by the republican majority in the state house.


I agree that the Reps played rough on this... but why is it the excuse every time the Dems are in the minority that they HAD to vote for it?

That is a load of crap. They could have easily gone to the public and stated that they wanted to eliminate machines that lacked paper trails, but that the Reps were trying to push for an early primary that would potentially eliminate the FL Dems votes at the Dem convention.

But they didn't. This, we were in the minority and thus forced to vote in favor of our opponents is a weak argument.

Yes, the Reps would likely have tried to spin it during the election that Dems didn't want a paper trail... but if the Dems had made public their views, it would have looked weak on the part of the Reps.
 
Gone to the public?....HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA!

This shit gets no traction in the media , funny that "liberal " media huh?
 
Gone to the public?....HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA!

This shit gets no traction in the media , funny that "liberal " media huh?

California trying to move up its primary didn't make much national news either. You should create your own newspaper so that every issue you find important makes the front page.
 
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