T
Thumper
Guest
Unlike you and Desh, I just don't have the time to stay on a message board all day long.
charver
You lookin' at my pint?
But you do have time to reply...just not to your inaccuracies?
Well done there. (btw it's night over here in our Muslim homeland you daft fecking infidel)
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charver
You lookin' at my pint?
It's alright US, i'm confident that my fellow Englanders wouldn't take the babblings of a z-list troll as indicative of the average American mindset.
Although, on saying that, the composite "American mindset" presented in the media is worrying enough.
I prefer to think of the great United States as a microcosm of the Americans i know from this board (give or take a few crazies, you understand). It makes me feel better, believe it or not.
T
Thumper
Guest
Obama, refusing to salute the flag:
Is that YOUR man, Desh?
Is that YOUR man, Desh?
Socrtease
Verified User
The Photo was taken during the singing of the National Anthem. He had his hand on his heart during the Pledge portion but then stood with his hands in front of him which is also concidered an acceptable way to stand during the National Anthem.
I never put my hand on my heart, or even said the pledge until I was in the Army. At a very young age I found it to be absurd to pledge ANYTHING to a flag. I gladly took my oath to protect and defend the constitution, both when I joined the Army and when I was sworn in as a lawyer. My ex-wife's grandfather had his right arm damaged during WWII and cannot place it over his heart. At a Diamondbacks baseball game Thumper's dad, or maybe another of his realitives, started yelling at him for not putting his hand over his heart during the National Anthem. Her grand-dad had to too much class to say anything to him but I didn't. I yelled for everyone to hear that he had been injured during the invasion of Germany and that is why is hand wasn't over his heart. He looked extremely stupid but NEVER apologized.
Herein lay the difference between the right and the rest. Only for Rightwingers does it have any real palpable meaning when someone does not speak at the flag or put their hand over their heart. Only rightwingers will attack people in public for it. ONLY the rightwing gets fucking nuts about a piece of cloth and a song. But talk to most right wingers about problems with the Patriot act and they spout the creed of the great american coward, "9-11 Changed Everything"
I never put my hand on my heart, or even said the pledge until I was in the Army. At a very young age I found it to be absurd to pledge ANYTHING to a flag. I gladly took my oath to protect and defend the constitution, both when I joined the Army and when I was sworn in as a lawyer. My ex-wife's grandfather had his right arm damaged during WWII and cannot place it over his heart. At a Diamondbacks baseball game Thumper's dad, or maybe another of his realitives, started yelling at him for not putting his hand over his heart during the National Anthem. Her grand-dad had to too much class to say anything to him but I didn't. I yelled for everyone to hear that he had been injured during the invasion of Germany and that is why is hand wasn't over his heart. He looked extremely stupid but NEVER apologized.
Herein lay the difference between the right and the rest. Only for Rightwingers does it have any real palpable meaning when someone does not speak at the flag or put their hand over their heart. Only rightwingers will attack people in public for it. ONLY the rightwing gets fucking nuts about a piece of cloth and a song. But talk to most right wingers about problems with the Patriot act and they spout the creed of the great american coward, "9-11 Changed Everything"
evince
Truthmatters
Obama, refusing to salute the flag:
Is that YOUR man, Desh?
No my man is on the couch here near me.
Obama is my candidate however and did you know you face the flag to salute it?
This was taken while they sang the anthem and you are supposed to stand in respect.
Obama is doing so. There is no fucking protocol to hold your hand over your heart.
Richardson did so the other clones behingd him thought they had to too
This one is embarrassing. Any service member knows that you stand at attention and face the flag when the Anthem is played, also saluting is in order.Obama, refusing to salute the flag:
Is that YOUR man, Desh?
Now, the fact that he didn't notice that everybody else there was holding their hand over their heart and participate as others in the area just shows that he wasn't paying attention because he was actually facing the flag (like Hillary and whoever that other lady is).
There are two people in the photo not doing what they should during the anthem, but the other gets a pass?
I'm not voting for Obama and I disagree with him on the War and other issues. But calling Barack Obama names is not an effective way of debating his virtues and weaknesses. Pastor Wright has definately surfaced as a weakness and I believe Obama is paying some politcal price for his association with the Pastor. I mainly see his experience as limited for a person applying to be the most powerful elected official in the world. Given a few more years in Congress and a more substantive record to evaluate, I might just vote for him in the future.
I do think unlike his Pastor, Barack is a decent, patriotic man, but time is the big truth teller in politics. Most politicians start out wanting to change the world, but most over time, become involved with corruption on some level. In short, the longer you stay in politics, the more likely you are to sell-out your beliefs. I don't think Hillary or Barack have sold out their beliefs, I just don't agree with them. Both are relatively "young" in their political lives. John McCain is "old" in his political life. But John McCain hasn't been corrupted and I still believe he is true to his core beliefs.
I do think unlike his Pastor, Barack is a decent, patriotic man, but time is the big truth teller in politics. Most politicians start out wanting to change the world, but most over time, become involved with corruption on some level. In short, the longer you stay in politics, the more likely you are to sell-out your beliefs. I don't think Hillary or Barack have sold out their beliefs, I just don't agree with them. Both are relatively "young" in their political lives. John McCain is "old" in his political life. But John McCain hasn't been corrupted and I still believe he is true to his core beliefs.
evince
Truthmatters
I don't buy that McCain has sold-out, but I'm sure logical arguments can be made to counter my view. Has he given in on some issues? Sure, but his core beliefs are still his name-sake.
As far as Obama being the best candidate because he hasn't had time to sell-out, I think that is a bad argument. That's like saying teenagers with new driver's licenses are good drivers because they haven't yet had any accidents or tickets. Much like they lack driving experience to assess their driving skills, Obama lacks the leadership experience to assess his leadership abilities.
If Obama spends a little more time in Congress and builds a credible record (the right votes - free of corruption), I think a lot more Americans would be willing to vote for him.
I can remember some time ago when my son sat in the back seat and commented on my driving. When I reflect on that now, it is a lot like Barack Obama criticizing Hillary on votes she made before he was elected to office. It is a lot different when you are behind the wheel than sitting in the back-seat.
As far as Obama being the best candidate because he hasn't had time to sell-out, I think that is a bad argument. That's like saying teenagers with new driver's licenses are good drivers because they haven't yet had any accidents or tickets. Much like they lack driving experience to assess their driving skills, Obama lacks the leadership experience to assess his leadership abilities.
If Obama spends a little more time in Congress and builds a credible record (the right votes - free of corruption), I think a lot more Americans would be willing to vote for him.
I can remember some time ago when my son sat in the back seat and commented on my driving. When I reflect on that now, it is a lot like Barack Obama criticizing Hillary on votes she made before he was elected to office. It is a lot different when you are behind the wheel than sitting in the back-seat.