Our Fine-Tuned Universe: Accident or Design?

ZenMode said:
God is a God. All powerful. HE, per Christians, was hands-on in sub-atomic details. Why didn't he, an all-knowing, omniscient being, design things so we get cancer FROM BEING OUTSIDE?
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Look using skin cancer to prove the logical necessity of atheism is just a weak argument.

The Earth was given an ozone layer that protects life from excessive UV radiation. The fact that human emissions of chlorinated chemicals have reduced the amount of atmospheric ozone is nobody's fault but ours. The fact that mass media convinced us that a deep tan has sex appeal is the fault of marketing and vanity.

Surely, there are better arguments for the logical necessity of atheism than this
 
Cypress said:
How do you know it was the god of Abraham, rather than some other purposeful creative energy?
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Know?......no.....Believe?.....yes......no other deities have claimed responsibility for the creation of the universe other than YHWH and his claim is recognized by the Jews, Christians and Muslims......that accounts for most of the current religious people in the world.....which other "purposeful creative energy" do you propose......
 
Cypress said:
Look using skin cancer to prove the logical necessity of atheism is just a weak argument.

The Earth was given an ozone layer that protects life from excessive UV radiation. The fact that human emissions of chlorinated chemicals have reduced the amount of atmospheric ozone is nobody's fault but ours. The fact that mass media convinced us that a deep tan has sex appeal is the fault of marketing and vanity.

Surely, there are better arguments for the logical necessity of atheism than this
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True that the ozone layer offers less protection now than before, what, the 1980's? It was never anything close to perfect protection. But, the fact remains that God had he chosen to, could have come up with a better solution. Prior to the 1980's, specifically in the ancient world, being out of the sun was much more difficult and being in the sun was required for survival. That might mean traveling on foot or horseback. That could mean spending hours a day planting and harvesting crops.

There are many other design flaws that an omniscient, all-powerful deity, who personally designed the universe at a sub-atomic level, should have thought about. Why design a planet with flaws that cause earthquakes?

Keep in mind, had God not set up Adam for failure with the apple, the earth would be essentially perfect. Per the Bible, there would be no disease, no suffering, no hunger etc. So, a perfect design is possible.
 
ZenMode said:
True that the ozone layer offers less protection now than before, what, the 1980's? It was never anything close to perfect protection. But, the fact remains that God had he chosen to, could have come up with a better solution. Prior to the 1980's, specifically in the ancient world, being out of the sun was much more difficult and being in the sun was required for survival. That might mean traveling on foot or horseback. That could mean spending hours a day planting and harvesting crops.

There are many other design flaws that an omniscient, all-powerful deity, who personally designed the universe at a sub-atomic level, should have thought about. Why design a planet with flaws that cause earthquakes?
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I have to admit, the world could be better......for example, Biden voters could have been aborted instead of the kids who were........
 
PostmodernProphet said:
Know?......no.....Believe?.....yes......no other deities have claimed responsibility for the creation of the universe other than YHWH and his claim is recognized by the Jews, Christians and Muslims......that accounts for most of the current religious people in the world.....which other "purposeful creative energy" do you propose......
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This may come as a shock to you, but there are other world religions which attribute the origin of the universe to entities and forces that are not the god Abraham.


Fair enough, so you are just guessing that the god of Abraham is responsible for the universal natural laws and mathmatical properties of the cosmos.
 
PostmodernProphet said:
I have to admit, the world could be better......for example, Biden voters could have been aborted instead of the kids who were........
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Yah..... I've always thought it was weird that Christian Republicans were against abortion. The people being aborted are likely to be Democrats.
 
ZenMode said:
True that the ozone layer offers less protection now than before, what, the 1980's? It was never anything close to perfect protection. But, the fact remains that God had he chosen to, could have come up with a better solution. Prior to the 1980's, specifically in the ancient world, being out of the sun was much more difficult and being in the sun was required for survival. That might mean traveling on foot or horseback. That could mean spending hours a day planting and harvesting crops.

There are many other design flaws that an omniscient, all-powerful deity, who personally designed the universe at a sub-atomic level, should have thought about. Why design a planet with flaws that cause earthquakes?

Keep in mind, had God not set up Adam for failure with the apple, the earth would be essentially perfect. Per the Bible, there would be no disease, no suffering, no hunger etc. So, a perfect design is possible.
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Demanding that we be able to live in in a perfect and ideal world, free of any injury, suffering, disease is not a belief or expectation of any world religion I am aware of.

The fact we live on a planet that uniquely in the solar system has magnetic and atmospheric properties protecting us from mostly all the risk of associated with cosmic rays and UV radiation is a remarkable fact, no matter what one believes about religion.

Earthquakes and floods are neccessary parts of the natural cycle of earth, and are neccessary for preservation of biology and ecosystems on the planet.

Earthquakes and floods almost never killed any early humans, because we did not manipulate the natural environment to build crowded and fragile cities, or build permanent settlements in the heart of floodplains. Our choices made earthquakes and floods really dangerous, but we also uniquely are endowed with the cognitive and reasoning powers to reduce the risks associated with building large settlements in geologically active areas or flood zones.
 
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Cypress said:
Demanding that we be able to live in in a perfect and ideal world, free of any injury, suffering, disease is not a beliefs of any world religion I am aware of.

The fact we live on a planet that uniquely in the solar system has magnetic and atmospheric properties protecting us from mostly all the risk of associated with cosmic rays and UV radiation is a remarkable fact, no matter what one believes about religion.

Earthquakes and floods are neccessary parts of the natural cycle of earth, and are neccessary for preservation of biology and ecosystems on the planet.

Earthquakes and floods almost never killed any early humans, because we did not manipulate the natural environment to build crowded and fragile cities, or build permanent settlements in the heart of floodplains. Our choices made earthquakes and floods really dangerous, but we also uniquely have the cognitive and reasoning powers to reduce the risks associated with building large settlements in geologically active areas or flood zones.
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It's not a demand for a perfect world. A perfect world is what we would beiving in now had Adam not eaten the Apple. A perfect world is what the earth will become when God returns to Earth. Both of those claims are detailed in the Bible

Do you believe that the Christian God, as described by the Bible and Christians, had the ability to create a light source that did not cause cancer or an earth that did not have flaws that caused earthquakes?
 
ZenMode said:
It's not a demand for a perfect world. A perfect world is what we would beiving in now had Adam not eaten the Apple. A perfect world is what the earth will become when God returns to Earth. Both of those claims are detailed in the Bible

Do you believe that the Christian God, as described by the Bible and Christians, had the ability to create a light source that did not cause cancer or an earth that did not have flaws that caused earthquakes?
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Complaining that there are cases of skin cancer out there sounds pretty close to an expectation that we deserve to live in a relatively ideal world, free of injury and disease.

Yesterday when I pointed out to you that Buddhist scripture acknowledges the supernatural, the superstitious, the reality of dieties and demons, you said Buddhists were allowed to not take that all literally because their is diversity in their religion.


Why is it so important to you to insist that Christians universally must be accountable for reading the Old Testament in a very literal way, and never have diversity in opinion about what the Old Testament means or how to interpret it?
 
PostmodernProphet said:
I have to admit, the world could be better......for example, Biden voters could have been aborted instead of the kids who were........
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Ah, so you DO support reproductive freedom -- as long as those aborted embryos might grow up to vote for political candidates you don't support. So very "Christian" of you, PiMP.
 
domer76 said:
For awhile in the Garden, he wasn’t even able to find Adam. Went looking for him.

So much for omniscience.
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Lol you have said some stupid shit but this is wow. So whan an attorney asks a witness, "Where were you on the night of Oct 12, 2023?" they are asking because they dont know? You're a simpleton
 
ThatOwlWoman said:
My oldest daughter just died at age 46 from kidney cancer. I could blame your god, or bad karma, or the universe in general. There's no point in it, is there? Shit happens.
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I am sorry to hear about your daughter. I can only imagine how horrible that is. I dont know how I would react if that happened to one of my kids but the possibility that its part of some greater plan that I dont know about or agree with offers me some consolation. Is that stupid of me? Maybe but the belief they might be with God and not suffering would be comforting but it would still be horrible.
 
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