Project Lifeline - More Mortgage Welfare

LadyT said:
Hey! I like Suzie Orman!
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As to Suze, since I have NEVER seen / heard / read her advising anyone to take money out of a 401(k), I'll show her a little bit of respect and leave her "undesignated" for now.
 
Chapdog said:
BUT.. ill stand up for the buyer.. when your talking to mortgage company and they are not disclosing the risks of interest rate fluctuation while selling you an AMR when you could get a 30year fixed at historic lows (which would be the correct thing to sell) just so they could make a better commission.. its unethical in my opinion. the ONLY time you should buy an arm is when you plan to pay off the mortgage within the ARM period. Handy for people who flip houses, or move frequently.
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I don't even buy that. In most cases they are explicit about what the loan can reset to even if the interest rates are at historic lows or if it goes up 2 or 3 % points. If there are cases where it wasn't disclosed, that's one thing, but buyer beware dude.
 
Desh said:
If home prices had not skyrocketed these loans would not have been used. People saw home prices soaring and you could buy a house with an interest only loan .Then you refi in a year or so and have equity or then turn arround and sell the house or outright and have a downpayment on a more modest home making it more affordable for you. Many people did this and it worked fine. There were people who saw this happen and wanted in to do the same. Then the market went bad because these entities were scrambling for the last few bucks to make and not warning gullible people who didnt see it coming. These people are for the most part just people trying to find a way to buy the American dream of home ownership.
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Then those people are idiots Desh. No market goes up forever. Every market has cycles. To assume otherwise is foolish.

You say they are just trying to buy the American dream and weren't informed by greedy lenders in the same paragraph that you discuss how they were greedy and buying more home than they could afford with the hopes of building equity, reselling their home and then buying a more modest one they could afford.

Do you see the contradiction?

Obviously by your own assertation, the individuals you described were also scrambling around trying to make money. Which is WHY they are just as culpable as the lenders.
 
Desh said:
If home prices had not skyrocketed these loans would not have been used. People saw home prices soaring and you could buy a house with an interest only loan .Then you refi in a year or so and have equity or then turn arround and sell the house or outright and have a downpayment on a more modest home making it more affordable for you. Many people did this and it worked fine. There were people who saw this happen and wanted in to do the same. Then the market went bad because these entities were scrambling for the last few bucks to make and not warning gullible people who didnt see it coming. These people are for the most part just people trying to find a way to buy the American dream of home ownership.
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Rule #1 - never risk more than you can afford to lose. Rule#2 - NEVER speculate on your home. Rule #3 - Have cash reserves to hold you through the bad times. Rule #4 - speed is key when risk is attached to a deal.

These idiots speculated on real estate using their residence. They treated it like an ATM machine. They did absolutely nothing to add value to the property and just played a waiting game - that is the very essence of speculation and arbitrage.

It was greed, not the American dream.

It was greed, not gullibility.

It was greed, not reason.

It was greed, by whatever motivation.

It was a mass display of buying things you don't need, with money you don't have, to impress people you don't really like. It was adults acting like that little red faced kid at the toy store - "I want it, I WANT it, I WANT IT NOW!" An adult temper tantrum on a national scale.

My ten year old has more financial sense than these people used. (No, that is NOT hyperbole.)
 
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Watermark said:
Ignorant losers. I hope you lose your house one day and starve on the streets. It would do america a lot of good to see you dead.
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why? because we don't feel sorry for some idiots that wanted to spend 3x what they could afford on a house?
 
Troglodyte27 said:
"Project Lifeline" - WTF! It is NOT a life and death situation, just an emotionally charged headline. I just about want to puke. I've been reading some so-called 'financial experts" and I conclude that the majority of them are (capital A) - Assclowns.

OMG - the newest financial piece of shit to come down the road--- a debit card that taps directly into your 401(k). Are you kidding me? Anybody else with sense see this as a bad thing? Liz Weston Pulliam, a now confirmed Assclown, thinks there might be some positives to this. LOL, one of the links embedded in her article on the positives of gutting your own 401(k) - "Top five mistakes people make with their 401(k)." Hey Liz, #5: Taking loans from the 401! Hello? (If anybody knows her, please grasp her shoulders and pull really hard - do her a favor and pop her head out of her ass, please.) Get her editor a fresh cup of coffee, too; that idiot is asleep.

Personally, I think Suze Orman and her advice are both pretty much idiotic and simplistic. Even she would not go for this obviously horrible idea.

I read some article yesterday about 'new, tougher' lending standards. These ' new "tough" standards would be that the borrowers mortgage payment should be limited to not more than 36% of after tax monthly income.** What a fucking joke! Yes, yes, 'tougher' than the subprime 50% of gross guideline.... but

Years ago, way before the 'reforms,' I was told that my TOTAL debt payments - mortgage PLUS credit cards, student loans and cars) should not exceed 33% of monthly after tax. I was told that I would be considered 'marginal' if that number was 36%; I would be able to get a loan with more than 10% down, and I was unlikely to be able to qualify if it was higher than 36%, even with more money down.

Our 'new' standards are not tough at all. But they are a step away from being ridiculously lax.


**"after tax," not "take home" (i.e., gross minus Fed, state and SS / medicare taxes).

Sorry for the rant, but I am tired of idiots and politicians catering to idiots because it screws people who have a clue.
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Elitists always think of themselves as more than they are, then they are screwed by the same deals 99% of America falls for. We shouldn't allow the deals to be put out on the table. That's common sense. They're manipulative and they take advantage of flaws that exist in ALL human minds.
 
Watermark said:
Rule no. 1 - don't allow predatory lendors to give this manipulative loans out. That's all that's needed. No one else is at fault.
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Again, if someone was the victim of fraud that should be addressed and we've already got laws on teh books to address this. Just because a lot of people were using their hoomes as piggy banks and trying to over extend themselves on thier mortgages doesn't mean congress has to come to the rescue.
 
LadyT said:
Again, if someone was the victim of fraud that should be addressed and we've already got laws on teh books to address this. Just because a lot of people were using their hoomes as piggy banks and trying to over extend themselves on thier mortgages doesn't mean congress has to come to the rescue.
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U R a greedy idiot.
 
Watermark said:
Elitists always think of themselves as more than they are, then they are screwed by the same deals 99% of America falls for. We shouldn't allow the deals to be put out on the table. That's common sense. They're manipulative and they take advantage of flaws that exist in ALL human minds.
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Yeah, that's a nice rational well thought out argument

/sarcasm off.
 
Watermark said:
U R a greedy idiot.
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LOL. I didn't buy a house when I couldn't afford it and I also didn't end up buying a house that I can't afford. I've got enough cushion to support me through and illness and for all intents and purposes can pretty much live in the lifestyle I'm accustomed to if I have to collect unemployment. Its called fiscal responsibility.
 
LadyT said:
Yeah, that's a nice rational well thought out argument

/sarcasm off.
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It is true. Humans think of themselves as perfectly rational. Humans are idiots. There is none of you above it. The reason you weren't taken in by this is because you weren't in their situation at the time - fucking loser. And I hope you lose everything because of your greed and indifference and irrationality.
 
LadyT said:
LOL. I didn't buy a house when I couldn't afford it and I also didn't end up buying a house that I can't afford. I've got enough cushion to support me through and illness and for all intents and purposes can pretty much live in the lifestyle I'm accustomed to if I have to collect unemployment. Its called fiscal responsibility.
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You're a greedy bitch.
 
Watermark said:
Rule no. 1 - don't allow predatory lendors to give this manipulative loans out. That's all that's needed. No one else is at fault.
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It takes two PissStain. So unless you can show fraud and that the HUD disclosures weren't followed, then you are, as is typical, speaking from a position of ignorance.

How many closings have you been to?
 
I don't give a fuck what you greedy bastards think. This is right and this is going to happen and we're going to save these families from greed and poverty. Because we saved them, it's not going to be as big a hit on our economy.
 
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