Question for Team Apocalypse

[Eagle_Eye]

Trump had control over our response to the pandemic. If you don't want ppl to believe that you're a Trumpanzee, quit trying to defend his multiple failures on that. The death toll (not rate!) is because of the "unchecked spread of the virus."

There is nothing special about Americans and our DNA that led us to have far more deaths than any other nation on this planet. Why do we then? No, it's not doctors faking causes of deaths. It's because of the failures of this thing.

Spoiler

You keep saying that but the truth is you center in on the death rate as if that is an indicator of how bad Trump did and I'm telling you the fucking body count is unimportant as an indicator. You make the same mistake the generals in Nam did thinking body counts indicated how the war was going they were wrong and you lefties are wrong! Trump dropped the ball by not giving better guidance when we only had a few hot spots. That is what you should be looking at. But you won't you will keep playing your silly game saying I'm defending Trump when it is clear I'm not.

 

[ThatOwlWoman]

How does our per capita death rate compare with other countries?

It's far higher. Oops. Did you mean something else? That's not what you Reichwingers are lying about anyways, now is it? Nope, you're insisting that our death total is artificially inflated because most of you are too stupid to understand how death certificates are filled out, no matter how many times it's explained to you. You MUST believe this because otherwise someone high up would bear the responsibility for the U.S. having far more deaths than any other single nation on the planet. And as we know, #COVID45 is on record as saying he has no responsibility.

"The United States has one of the highest rates of COVID-19 deaths per capita in the world. However, President Donald Trump made the false claim that “Germany and the United States are the two best in deaths per 100,000 people.”

"As of May 11, the U.S. had 24.66 deaths per 100,000 people — more than two times higher than Germany (9.24 deaths per 100,000), and the 11th highest rate out of the more than 140 countries tracked by Johns Hopkins University."

https://www.factcheck.org/2020/05/where-the-u-s-ranks-in-covid-19-deaths-per-capita/

From Johns Hopkins, we appear to be in the center of the graph:

https://coronavirus.jhu.edu/data/mortality

 

[Into the Night]

Fallacy fallacy. You can judge a thing based on its origins, such as 'Made in China' stickers. You can also judge an origin on how much fake news it puts out. That does not cause any error in logic to do so.

Bulverism applies to arguments, not news stories or an object. An argument is a set of predicates and a conclusion. A predicate is an assumed conclusion as True (also known as a 'fact'). If anyone disagrees with the predicate (or fact) it ceases to be a valid predicate and becomes an argument.

Challenging a predicate is not a fallacy.
Judging whether a 'news' source is writing mostly fiction is not a fallacy.

Discarding an argument solely because of the source making that argument is the fallacy. The source is irrelevant. The argument stands on its own. The argument itself must be addressed, not the one making it. News articles are not arguments. Indeed, many that try to make arguments are fallacies in and of themselves.

 

[Into the Night]

Trump had control over our response to the pandemic. If you don't want ppl to believe that you're a Trumpanzee, quit trying to defend his multiple failures on that. The death toll (not rate!) is because of the "unchecked spread of the virus."

There is nothing special about Americans and our DNA that led us to have far more deaths than any other nation on this planet. Why do we then? No, it's not doctors faking causes of deaths. It's because of the failures of this thing.

Spoiler

Trump did not create the virus. We do not have more deaths per 100,000 than any other nation on the planet.

Fear mongering. Untreated TDS.

 

[Into the Night]

This has been explained numerous times here, but as the wise man once said: "You can lead a Reichwinger to facts, but you cannot make him think."

People do not die of influenza; they die of the resulting complications. Ditto for the coronavirus. A typical death certificate may list cause of death of a flu patient as 1. Pneumonia, and 2. Secondary to influenza. This is true of many common causes of death.

Example: My mother was a lifelong smoker. She developed COPD. By age 50 it was all she could do to travel up and down the basement stairs. By age 60 she was on 02 24/7. She passed at age 66. Her cause of death was listed as 1. Heart failure, 2. Secondary to COPD. When metadata for that year was compiled, she would have been listed in the "heart failure" category, and possibly in the COPD category.

Deniers like the OP want to count only death certificates that mention COVID, and patients who were given tests that were positive. This, of course, makes for lower numbers which makes #COVID45 look less culpable.

Not facts. Learn what 'fact' means.

 

[Legion]

Discarding an argument solely because of the source making that argument is the fallacy.

That's the genetic fallacy.

https://fallacyinlogic.com/genetic-fallacy-definition-and-examples/

 

[Legion]

and money

Hospitals get paid more for chinese virus positive patients. They also get paid more for patients on ventilators.

The government subsidized the increase in death count. Also these blue states think that the higher their death toll the more money they can steal from other taxpayers. They are takers

Indeed.

 

[AProudLefty]

Fallacy fallacy. You can judge a thing based on its origins, such as 'Made in China' stickers. You can also judge an origin on how much fake news it puts out. That does not cause any error in logic to do so.

Bulverism applies to arguments, not news stories or an object. An argument is a set of predicates and a conclusion. A predicate is an assumed conclusion as True (also known as a 'fact'). If anyone disagrees with the predicate (or fact) it ceases to be a valid predicate and becomes an argument.

Challenging a predicate is not a fallacy.
Judging whether a 'news' source is writing mostly fiction is not a fallacy.

Discarding an argument solely because of the source making that argument is the fallacy. The source is irrelevant. The argument stands on its own. The argument itself must be addressed, not the one making it. News articles are not arguments. Indeed, many that try to make arguments are fallacies in and of themselves.

For once we agree.

 

[Into the Night]

That's the genetic fallacy.

https://fallacyinlogic.com/genetic-fallacy-definition-and-examples/

Also known as the Bulverism fallacy. Like I said. It must be applied to an argument. A statement is not an argument.