Theodicy, the problem of evil

BidenPresident said:
Deism is the idea God created the universe then disappeared.
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Or didn't directly act in human affairs.

I had the impression that some people thought that god was present in the natural laws and mathmatical scaffolding of the universe, even if it doesn't act directly in human affairs.
 
Cypress said:
Or didn't directly act in human affairs.

I had the impression that some people thought that god was present in the natural laws and mathmatical scaffolding of the universe, even if it doesn't act directly in human affairs.
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Newton thought God created the physical laws.
 
Cypress said:
One line of reasoning -->

Because of Hitler, Pol Pot, mass murderers, earthquakes, floods, fires, cancer there cannot be an omniscient and beneficent higher power deserving of admiration and veneration.
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The bad people could be blamed on the "gift" of free will.

I'm more concerned about the malignant tumors, the sick babies,
carnivores in the wild and in humanity, and all the other horrors not caused
by people allegedly created in the image of God and having free will.

I'm concerned about things that we ironically call "acts of God."

I'm unable to see the universe in which we live as the creation

of a deity who's supposed to be
all-powerful and all-loving at the same time.

Logic would suggest that an all-loving creator would be a bit more magnanimous with its unlimited power.
 
NiftyNiblick said:
The bad people could be blamed on the "gift" of free will.

I'm more concerned about the malignant tumors, the sick babies,
carnivores in the wild and in humanity, and all the other horrors not caused
by people alleged created in the image of God and having free will.

I'm concerned about things that we ironically call "acts of God."

I'm unable to see the universe in which we live as the creation

of a deity who's supposed to be
all-powerful and all-loving at the same time.

Logic would suggest that an all-loving creator would be a bit more magnanimous with its unlimited power.
Click to expand...

Thence cometh: "This is the best of all possible worlds".
 
NiftyNiblick said:
The bad people could be blamed on the "gift" of free will.

I'm more concerned about the malignant tumors, the sick babies,
carnivores in the wild and in humanity, and all the other horrors not caused
by people allegedly created in the image of God and having free will.

I'm concerned about things that we ironically call "acts of God."

I'm unable to see the universe in which we live as the creation

of a deity who's supposed to be
all-powerful and all-loving at the same time.

Logic would suggest that an all-loving creator would be a bit more magnanimous with its unlimited power.
Click to expand...

I don't believe sharks, tigers, or grizzly bears are a manifestation of evil, even if humans are occasionally attacked by them. We have the capacity to understand them and avoid conflict.

A lot of diseases end up being the result of human behavior, diabetes, obesity, cancers resulting from long term exposure to synthetic toxic carcinogens.

I don't think humans are supposed to be immortal; that would makes us divine beings ourselves. We have to die somehow and in someway.

An all loving and beneficent creator is a Christian construction which is not neccesarily applicable to other religions.

We have evolved the cognitive capacity and reason to imagine how to avoid conflict with grizzly bears, how to minimize the risk of death by flood or earthquake, how to prepare for fire risks, how to treat and maintain our bodies to be at low risk of obesity, cancer, heart disease.


That doesn't prove anything about the existence of gods. But I think it sufficiently dismantles the argument that there cannot be any higher transcendent power because fire, earthquake, flood, and death.
 
Cypress said:
I don't believe sharks, tigers, or grizzly bears are a manifestation of evil, even if humans are occasionally attacked by them.

A lot of diseases end up being the result of human behavior, diabetes, obesity, cancers resulting from long term exposure to synthetic toxic carcinogens.

I don't think humans are supposed to be immortal; that would makes us divine beings ourselves. We have to die somehow and in someway.

An all loving and beneficent creator is a Christian construction which is not neccesarily applicable to other religions.

We have evolved the cognitive capacity and reason to imagine how to avoid conflict with grizzly bears, how to minimize the risk of death by flood or earthquake, how to prepare for fire risks, how to treat and maintain our bodies to be at low risk of obesity, cancer, heart disease.


That doesn't prove anything about the existence of gods. But I think it sufficiently dismantles the argument that there cannot be any higher transcendent power because fire, earthquake, flood, and death.
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What is the role of God other than giving you security that an all knowing being controls the universe?
 
IlaceWords said:
Kudos...you've sort of discovered Leibniz.
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Wrong, the free will theodicy goes back to Christian theologians of late antiquity, more than a thousand years before Liebniz .

That's the problem with reacting to someone's post by frantically googling for two minutes. It is a lazy and misguided attempt to bypass the hard work of learning history and theology
 
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