Trump: Can end 'disastrous' Russian war in a day

T. A. Gardner said:
No, I am reciting historical fact. You are tossing political rhetoric and nonsense. Where JFK fucked up was putting IRBM's in Europe. Oh, those were removed as part of the deal too...

In reality, there was a quid pro quo for the Soviet retreat. In return for the Soviet withdrawal of nukes from Cuba, the Americans would remove their nukes from Turkey. The Cuban Missile Crisis’s resolution was, in fact, a triumph of compromise centered half a world away.
https://daily.jstor.org/us-nuclear-weapons-turkey-part-2/

The Kennedy administration fucked up, then had to find a way out of the mess they created.
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Disagreed it was a fuck up, Terry. You have a lengthy history on this forum of conceding to the Russians. Do you have Russian relatives?
 
Doc Dutch said:
Disagreed it was a fuck up, Terry. You have a lengthy history on this forum of conceding to the Russians. Do you have Russian relatives?
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I had to study this event at some length doing my master's. Kennedy was the cause, not the Soviets. Doesn't absolve the Russians of the shit they did do at all, only in this particular event it was Kennedy and his administration that caused the problem. Had Kennedy foregone putting those IRBM's in Europe, the Russians would have never bothered at all with Castro or Cuba. Castro would have withered on the vine, and probably never lasted beyond a decade or two.
 
T. A. Gardner said:
Gorebal Warming is the belief in the Church of Global Warming / Climate Change and it's high priest Al Gore. It is the sort of person that truly believes for the last 50 years we've had 10 years before the world ends due to Climate Change.
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Wow, you really have gone round the bend, Terry. While Al certainly politicized it, Climate Change is a fact regardless if you want to live in denial about it or not.

https://climate.nasa.gov/evidence/
There is unequivocal evidence that Earth is warming at an unprecedented rate. Human activity is the principal cause.
 
Doc Dutch said:
Wow, you really have gone round the bend, Terry. While Al certainly politicized it, Climate Change is a fact regardless if you want to live in denial about it or not.

https://climate.nasa.gov/evidence/
There is unequivocal evidence that Earth is warming at an unprecedented rate. Human activity is the principal cause.
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That doesn't make it an "existential threat" or that the world's going to end in a decade, or that every environmental and climate change is due to anthropogenic causes, which is what the Church of Gorebal Warming tells us.
 
T. A. Gardner said:
I had to study this event at some length doing my master's. Kennedy was the cause, not the Soviets. Doesn't absolve the Russians of the shit they did do at all, only in this particular event it was Kennedy and his administration that caused the problem. Had Kennedy foregone putting those IRBM's in Europe, the Russians would have never bothered at all with Castro or Cuba. Castro would have withered on the vine, and probably never lasted beyond a decade or two.
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Your ability to foretell the future of 60 year old events is interesting, Terry. Maybe you can use those skills to predict our future since it would be more useful today than in whining about dead Presidents.

Lemme guess, if JFK hadn't got us into Vietnam, the Russians and Chinese would never have spread to other nations. Is that your prediction too, Terry?
 
Doc Dutch said:
Your ability to foretell the future of 60 year old events is interesting, Terry. Maybe you can use those skills to predict our future since it would be more useful today than in whining about dead Presidents.
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No, you don't get to blame him for YOUR problem. Inversion fallacy.
 
T. A. Gardner said:
That doesn't make it an "existential threat" or that the world's going to end in a decade, or that every environmental and climate change is due to anthropogenic causes, which is what the Church of Gorebal Warming tells us.
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Thanks for admitting Climate Change exists, Terry. For a minute there I thought you were as nutty as Sybil or his twin, Uncensored.

Into the Night said:
Stop making shit up.
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Into the Night said:
Circular argument fallacy (fundamentalism).

Define 'climate change'.
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Into the Night said:
No, you don't get to blame him for YOUR problem. Inversion fallacy.
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Trump couldn't even get more votes than a senile old fart that had to dropout of prior elections for stealing speeches and lying about grades
 
T. A. Gardner said:
I had to study this event at some length doing my master's. Kennedy was the cause, not the Soviets. Doesn't absolve the Russians of the shit they did do at all, only in this particular event it was Kennedy and his administration that caused the problem. Had Kennedy foregone putting those IRBM's in Europe, the Russians would have never bothered at all with Castro or Cuba. Castro would have withered on the vine, and probably never lasted beyond a decade or two.
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The soviets were discovered slopping nukes into Cuba. It was discovered by spy planes. How is that not the cause? Russia has been circled by nukes for a long time. That was a given.
 
Nordberg said:
The soviets were discovered slopping nukes into Cuba. It was discovered by spy planes. How is that not the cause? Russia has been circled by nukes for a long time. That was a given.
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If that was true, how could Terry blame the Democrat JFK for the Cold War?
 
Doc Dutch said:
Your ability to foretell the future of 60 year old events is interesting, Terry. Maybe you can use those skills to predict our future since it would be more useful today than in whining about dead Presidents.

Lemme guess, if JFK hadn't got us into Vietnam, the Russians and Chinese would never have spread to other nations. Is that your prediction too, Terry?
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JFK didn't "get us into Vietnam." During the Kennedy administration there were less than 1000 US advisors in Vietnam. LBJ got us into Vietnam after the phony Gulf of Tonkin incident.

As for the origins of the Cuban Missile Crisis I suggest starting with

516J-%2BSHmAL._SY291_BO1,204,203,200_QL40_.jpg
 
Nordberg said:
The soviets were discovered slopping nukes into Cuba. It was discovered by spy planes. How is that not the cause? Russia has been circled by nukes for a long time. That was a given.
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Because the Soviets wouldn't have given Castro shit unless he paid them cash (he didn't have). The Soviets did it in direct response to the US (Kennedy) putting IRBM's in Europe and creating a huge new threat to the Soviet Union.
At the time, Russia wasn't "circled by nukes" at all. The French and British barely had nuclear weapons of their own in the early 60's and only limited means to project them. The US's up to that point main power projection means was the intercontinental bomber (eg., SAC). ICBM's were only just coming into service in both the US and Russia so they weren't the big threat at the time. The main ballistic missile for nukes was the IRBM.
 
T. A. Gardner said:
JFK didn't "get us into Vietnam." During the Kennedy administration there were less than 1000 US advisors in Vietnam. LBJ got us into Vietnam after the phony Gulf of Tonkin incident.

As for the origins of the Cuban Missile Crisis I suggest starting with

516J-%2BSHmAL._SY291_BO1,204,203,200_QL40_.jpg
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I'm surprised you're giving JFK a pass on that one.
 
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