We're Not Killing Iraqis

[Cypress]

I could care less about enemy casualties. It is the civilian casualties that most certainly do matter. Despite Darla's feeble attempt to paint the picture otherwise.

But I will not go running around pretending their are civilian deaths when there is no evidence to support such a claim. Nothing. Not one shred of evidence, yet she acts as though we were off deliberately killing babies and not caring.

I could care less about enemy casualties.

The iraqis weren't our enemies, until you invaded and occupied them. You invade and occupy a country that doesn't threaten you, and some of those people are going to shoot back. Some of them may be criminals, some are certifiably nuts. But, some are just oppossed to you invading and occupying them without just cause.

Don't be naive. You most certainly should care about the death of hundreds of thousands, because of your actions and Bush's actions.

 

[gonzojournals]

I could care less about enemy casualties.

The iraqis weren't our enemies, until you invaded and occupied them.

I'm sorry, did you stop being a citizen of this country? It is your war too, buddy. And the "I didn't support it" defense doesn't work-- just look at Nuremburg for proof of that.

You invade and occupy a country that doesn't threaten you, and some of those people are going to shoot back. Some of them may be criminals, some are certifiably nuts. But, some are just oppossed to you invading and occupying them without just cause.

We had a cause-- it just isn't a cause that you agree with. They shoot, we shoot back. They die, big deal.

Don't be naive. You most certainly should care about the death of hundreds of thousands, because of your actions and Bush's actions.

You are being naive for thinking that those deaths matter.

 

[Cancel 2016.2]

Gonzo believes that civilians are the enemy, he has already stated that, it’s why I have him on IA. You on the other hand, need to desperately believe that civilians aren’t being killed, when any rational person understands that our air wars have been white washed, but that of course, people are being killed. I know it, deep down, you know it. Rant all you want SF.

The only one desperate here is YOU. You have this desperate need to believe the US is bombing civilians and killing them by the thousands. So you pull some vague reference to a lot of bombs being used and try to equate that to unreported civilian deaths.

You have NO evidence to support that. None.

I understand fully that civilians die in war. But I don't have the obsessive desire to run around and act like they are being killed any time a bomb drops. Even in the situation of dropping 100k pounds of bombs. Again, it was over a week. It was on farmland. They were trying to blow up weapons caches and buried bombs. Do you really think they did this without attempting to clear the population that may be effected?

You think our military has a complete lack of regard for the safety of civilians. I 100% disagree with you.

 

[Cancel 2016.2]

Bottom line Darla....

WHAT is it that makes you think civilians were present at the time of the bombing?

Do you really believe our military is going to drop 100k pounds of munitions without any regard for the safety of the civilian population?

 

[uscitizen]

Gonzo believes that civilians are the enemy, he has already stated that, it’s why I have him on IA. You on the other hand, need to desperately believe that civilians aren’t being killed, when any rational person understands that our air wars have been white washed, but that of course, people are being killed. I know it, deep down, you know it. Rant all you want SF.

Well they are Muslims aren't they ?


sarcasm off.

We would likely be killing no one in Iraq if not for Bush.

 

[uscitizen]

Bottom line Darla....

WHAT is it that makes you think civilians were present at the time of the bombing?

Do you really believe our military is going to drop 100k pounds of munitions without any regard for the safety of the civilian population?

Yes.

 

[gonzojournals]

Civilians die in war. I don't care if they are Christians, Jews, Muslims, white, black, purple, or mutated-- if they aren't American, I don't care if they die.

 

[Cypress]

*Bush apologist: “You can’t be an American citizen if you don’t believe in shooting and killing Iraqi insurgents!

*Me and General Butler: Get out, and stop killing them.

Major General Smedly Butler
Two-Time Medal of Honor recipient

WAR is a racket. It always has been.

It is possibly the oldest, easily the most profitable, surely the most vicious. It is the only one international in scope. It is the only one in which the profits are reckoned in dollars and the losses in lives.

A racket is best described, I believe, as something that is not what it seems to the majority of the people. Only a small "inside" group knows what it is about. It is conducted for the benefit of the very few, at the expense of the very many. Out of war a few people make huge fortunes.

In the World War 1 a mere handful garnered the profits of the conflict. At least 21,000 new millionaires and billionaires were made in the United States during the World War. That many admitted their huge blood gains in their income tax returns. How many other war millionaires falsified their tax returns no one knows.

How many of these war millionaires shouldered a rifle? How many of them dug a trench? How many of them knew what it meant to go hungry in a rat-infested dug-out? How many of them spent sleepless, frightened nights, ducking shells and shrapnel and machine gun bullets? How many of them parried a bayonet thrust of an enemy? How many of them were wounded or killed in battle?

Out of war nations acquire additional territory, if they are victorious. They just take it. This newly acquired territory promptly is exploited by the few -- the selfsame few who wrung dollars out of blood in the war. The general public shoulders the bill…

It would have been far cheaper (not to say safer) for the average American who pays the bills to stay out of foreign entanglements. For a very few this racket, like bootlegging and other underworld rackets, brings fancy profits, but the cost of operations is always transferred to the people -- who do not profit. So...I say,
TO HELL WITH WAR!

 

[gonzojournals]

Those damn millionaires--- they definitely would have helped the war effort more as a grunt in the trenches then as a businessman providing the actual ammunition.

 

[BRUTALITOPS]

Do we know that Obama will do better? No. But we can hope. He might. He says he will. I'd say it's probable. With McCain there is no hope.

This is the stupidest logic i've ever read and it could only come from a diehard apologist.

When it comes to LIFE AND DEATH MATTERS, you don't roll the dice darla... you don't say "do we know? we can hope at least" That's a total fucking copout. You ask, you get reassured, and if you are not reassured, you vote for someone else.

 

[Cancel7]

Bottom line Darla....

WHAT is it that makes you think civilians were present at the time of the bombing?

Do you really believe our military is going to drop 100k pounds of munitions without any regard for the safety of the civilian population?

Yeah I do. Just as during the 80’s when Israel dropped cluster bombs in Lebanon, Reagan went ballistic . But today, they do it, and we say nothing, and pretend there is no other choice and not that many civilians are being killed, and if they are killed it’s their fault anyway for hanging around where “the terrorists” are. And just like during Vietnam, when pictures of US casualties were on the news, the public turned against the war, so they made sure that during new wars, the public would never see those pictures – they white washed it. We aren’t even allowed to see the coffins, no less the twisted, broken bodies of our soldiers.

And air wars have always killed civilians and if you bother to do a little research, you will find out they are still killing civilians, but they attempt to hide it as much as is possible. Because bombing campaigns have been considered uncivilized in the past, they were again, white washed. You fall for it, but don’t expect or demand that I do.

I really don’t want to talk about anymore. I’m tired. Really tired. Go on believing what you need to believe. What difference does it make anyway? Even if you suddenly woke up, so what? One monkey don’t stop no show.

 

[uscitizen]

This is the stupidest logic i've ever read and it could only come from a diehard apologist.

When it comes to LIFE AND DEATH MATTERS, you don't roll the dice darla... you don't say "do we know? we can hope at least" That's a total fucking copout. You ask, you get reassured, and if you are not reassured, you vote for someone else.

did that make any sense to anyone else ?

 

[gonzojournals]

I really don’t want to talk about anymore.

Then get the fuck off of a debate forum.

I’m tired. Really tired.

Poor baby. Maybe you should go take a nap until you feel up to the recreation you have chosen for yourself.

Go on believing what you need to believe. What difference does it make anyway? Even if you suddenly woke up, so what? One monkey don’t stop no show.

We will go on believing what we want to believe, the same as you. The only difference is we won't bitch and moan about others disagreeing with us and start crying because some stranger in a different state doesn't share our same perceptions on human life.

 

[Cancel7]

This is the stupidest logic i've ever read and it could only come from a diehard apologist.

When it comes to LIFE AND DEATH MATTERS, you don't roll the dice darla... you don't say "do we know? we can hope at least" That's a total fucking copout. You ask, you get reassured, and if you are not reassured, you vote for someone else.

Well, I know that McCain is going to kill. I have to assume that Hillary will based on her past record, and her husband’s past record. But Obama was against the war from the beginning. So, that is all I have to go on. It’s not stupid logic. It’s taking someone at their word until you have reason not to. I hope he never gives me reason not to.

 

[BRUTALITOPS]

I understand that, and my guess is you believe obama...

Perhaps we've just become to used to not demanding promises and anything better than lip service. I guess that's good enough for us these days. I know he hasn't given you any reason to disbelieve him, but I guess in a better world we would ask for a little more.

 

[Cancel7]

The only one desperate here is YOU. You have this desperate need to believe the US is bombing civilians and killing them by the thousands. So you pull some vague reference to a lot of bombs being used and try to equate that to unreported civilian deaths.

You have NO evidence to support that. None.

I understand fully that civilians die in war. But I don't have the obsessive desire to run around and act like they are being killed any time a bomb drops. Even in the situation of dropping 100k pounds of bombs. Again, it was over a week. It was on farmland. They were trying to blow up weapons caches and buried bombs. Do you really think they did this without attempting to clear the population that may be effected?

You think our military has a complete lack of regard for the safety of civilians. I 100% disagree with you.

What can you say to someone who could write that? You're stupid SF. Just stop. How long do you want to go on with this? I'm done with you on this.

You're stupid. Even people on the right like RS have told you so. But you keep it up because yo uwant someone to tell you it's ok. It's not ok. now give it up.

 

[Cancel7]

I understand that, and my guess is you believe obama...

Perhaps we've just become to used to not demanding promises and anything better than lip service. I guess that's good enough for us these days. I know he hasn't given you any reason to disbelieve him, but I guess in a better world we would ask for a little more.

In a better world, we’d have a hell of a lot more, and better choices. It’s pretty sad what we end up with at the end of the day.

 

[gonzojournals]

Darla is going to go cry and take a nap now.

 

[Cancel 2016.2]

Yeah I do. Just as during the 80’s when Israel dropped cluster bombs in Lebanon, Reagan went ballistic . But today, they do it, and we say nothing, and pretend there is no other choice and not that many civilians are being killed, and if they are killed it’s their fault anyway for hanging around where “the terrorists” are. And just like during Vietnam, when pictures of US casualties were on the news, the public turned against the war, so they made sure that during new wars, the public would never see those pictures – they white washed it. We aren’t even allowed to see the coffins, no less the twisted, broken bodies of our soldiers.

And air wars have always killed civilians and if you bother to do a little research, you will find out they are still killing civilians, but they attempt to hide it as much as is possible. Because bombing campaigns have been considered uncivilized in the past, they were again, white washed. You fall for it, but don’t expect or demand that I do.

I really don’t want to talk about anymore. I’m tired. Really tired. Go on believing what you need to believe. What difference does it make anyway? Even if you suddenly woke up, so what? One monkey don’t stop no show.

So your whole argument is based on, well in air wars people die?

Give me a break. In the intial months of the war, yes, without question civilians died in the bombings. But now we control the ground. We can inform the civilians, hey we are going to bomb this farm and we (along with the Iraqi army) can move anyone in harms way. This is not like warfare where our guys are under fire and we bomb the next street to try to protect them and in the process civilians are killed.

You are trying to equate to very different things. Then you act like if we drop bombs it must mean we are whitewashing the event.

and enough of your fucking monkey comments Darla. Obviously the only monkey performing here is you. You have been brainwashed by your moveon.org buddies and code pink buddies into believing the worst about our military. Good monkey Darla. You have spouted off their crap verbatim. They will be proud of your parroting abilities.

Enough as well of your high horse bullshit.

 

[uscitizen]

If she did cry for the children dead because of Bush's folly in Iraq, It raise her in my esteem not lower her.

Do we as a nation only care for our own children ?