Report Questions Wind Power’s Ability to Deliver Electricity When Most Needed

Aoxomoxoa said:
If you don't have any backup to provide a baseload, what do you do? What is vital to make wind power viable is a coast to coast super transmission grid, that will cost trillions of dollars. I can't see anybody with the political will to make that happen.
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So you choose to ignore existing hydropower, nuclear, and new solar-thermal, all of which provide excellent baseload?
 
Aoxomoxoa said:
I have already stated the reasons why the current generation of wind turbines are inefficient. I have also tried to point out that the massive investment in wind turbines would be better applied to thorium reactors, China, India and Japan are investing considerable amounts on developing this technology.

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/finance/...nd-China-is-leading-the-way-with-thorium.html
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Your bullshit will not fly among americans, who have seen and are seeing successful implementation of windpower on an ongoing basis.
 
Rune said:
So you choose to ignore existing hydropower, nuclear, and new solar-thermal, all of which provide excellent baseload?
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You are an odd cove, only the other day you were bitching about the tiny amount of radioactivity detected in Pacific tuna!! One of wind power's supposed selling points is that it is clean and replaces fossil fuels. However real life experience shows that what actually happens is existing fossil fuel power stations have to be maintained and the excess electricity sold off if possible. You just cannot have power stations sitting around waiting for when the wind is too little or too much, this is basic stuff but seems to be beyond your comprehension. There are some power stations that have been built inside mountains like one in Wales which works by pumping water at off peak times awaiting a surge in demand, however they are extremely expensive to build and are only a very partial solution to the problem.

How many mountains are there in Iowa?

http://www.fhc.co.uk/dinorwig.htm

http://www.nofreewind.com/2010/01/wind-turbine-out-graphs-part-i.html
 
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Fascinating article in the Guardian about James Lovelock, inventor of the Gaia theory, and his belief that nuclear energy is the only real solution to the world's energy problems.

"If wind energy were the one practical and affordable answer to global heating then I would grit my teeth at the loss of the countryside and accept it."
Lovelock sees nuclear power as a solution to reducing carbon emissions criticises the whole concept of renewable power. "There is no such thing as renewable energy; it belongs as an idea with perpetual motion and other delusions but politicians and ideologues have become skilled at using enticing words to cover essentially rotten ideas."
Using the example of large-scale investment in wind power in Germany, Lovelock argued that because the wind does not blow continuously, turbines are only 17% efficient. He argues this means that national grids must have back-up power from fossil fuel powered stations.
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http://www.guardian.co.uk/environment/2009/mar/29/lovelock-wind
 
Aoxomoxoa said:
You are an odd cove, only the other day you were bitching about the tiny amount of radioactivity detected in Pacific tuna!! One of wind power's supposed selling points is that it is clean and replaces fossil fuels. However real life experience shows that what actually happens is existing fossil fuel power stations have to be maintained and the excess electricity sold off if possible. You just cannot have power stations sitting around waiting for when the wind is too little or too much, this is basic stuff but seems to be beyond your comprehension. There are some power stations that have been built inside mountains like one in Wales which works by pumping water at off peak times awaiting a surge in demand, however they are extremely expensive to build and are only a very partial solution to the problem.

How many mountains are there in Iowa?

http://www.fhc.co.uk/dinorwig.htm

http://www.nofreewind.com/2010/01/wind-turbine-out-graphs-part-i.html
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http://www.technologyreview.com/review/421403/how-not-to-make-energy-decisions/


 
Rune said:
http://www.technologyreview.com/review/421403/how-not-to-make-energy-decisions/
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Nothing Tom? No so easy to refute MIT? 85 million gallons of diesel saved yearly by one wind farm alone is insignificant? It never crossed your mind that some places in the US use diesel generators and would be a perfect match for wind farms?

Don't feel like you missed out on anything by not already sabotaging the Cape Wind project. There were plenty of other one way bastards here to do your work for you.
 
Rune said:
Don't feel like you missed out on anything by not already sabotaging the Cape Wind project. There were plenty of other one way bastards here to do your work for you.
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I wonder why it is that liberals hate wind energy......the Kennedy family were the biggest opponents in Massachusetts as well.....it's almost as if whenever we find something that works, liberals automatically oppose it......
 
Rune said:
Nothing Tom? No so easy to refute MIT? 85 million gallons of diesel saved yearly by one wind farm alone is insignificant? It never crossed your mind that some places in the US use diesel generators and would be a perfect match for wind farms?

Don't feel like you missed out on anything by not already sabotaging the Cape Wind project. There were plenty of other one way bastards here to do your work for you.
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Tom?
 
PostmodernProphet said:
I wonder why it is that liberals hate wind energy......the Kennedy family were the biggest opponents in Massachusetts as well.....it's almost as if whenever we find something that works, liberals automatically oppose it......
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In my experience, it is the liberals that love them, the conservatives that are for them love the subsidies.
 
Rune said:
Tom?
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From a cost/benefit point of view the only thing worse than wind turbines are solar panels. That is why electricity generators don't install turbines unless they get subsidised access to the grid. The market price for electricity averages about 5-10 cents per kilowatt hour. The government guarantees wind producers 14 to 18 cents per kwh. Thus the market subsidises wind and solar is even worse. The government guarantees solar producers 45 to 80 cents per kwh. In addition to being hard on the wallet, wind and solar power are not reliable. They don't produce electricity when the wind isn't blowing or the sun isn't shining, so both are a very bad investment.

Many people think it is worth the cost because wind and solar are renewable. Unfortunately this is really just "feel-good environmentalism." For the small amount of electricity turbines and panels produce, they require a lot of resources and some very polluting techniques to manufacture. Stick with hydro, nuclear, tidal and invest in clean coal and thorium reactors.
 
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Aoxomoxoa said:
clean coal .
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Laughing my ass off. There is no such thing as clean coal idiot.

Solar panels have fallen by 1/2 in cost in the last 10 years alone, have no moving parts, no known failure period and produce the most electricity when the demand is highest.

As pointed out in the article, and proven by the test tower erected by Cape Wind, the wind in Nantucket Sound is steady, constant, year round and averages 20 knots.

None of your calculations take into account the continuous rise in cost of fossil fuels, which changes the R.O.I. of alternative energy installations, often dramatically.

Your ridiculous pronouncement that alternative energy sources are always subsidised would have some validity, if it were not for the fact that all sources of energy are heavily subsidised, hackmaster.

You would have a very hard time selling your lies here on Cape Cod, where new solar and wind turbines are constantly being erected.

FYI, Cape Cod has the highest electrical rates in the US, save Hawaii. The big profit for the installers is the Renewable Energy Credits. Learn what you are talking about or shut up.
 
Aoxomoxoa said:
From a cost/benefit point of view the only thing worse than wind turbines are solar panels. That is why electricity generators don't install turbines unless they get subsidised access to the grid. The market price for electricity averages about 5-10 cents per kilowatt hour. The government guarantees wind producers 14 to 18 cents per kwh. Thus the market subsidises wind and solar is even worse. The government guarantees solar producers 45 to 80 cents per kwh. In addition to being hard on the wallet, wind and solar power are not reliable. They don't produce electricity when the wind isn't blowing or the sun isn't shining, so both are a very bad investment.

Many people think it is worth the cost because wind and solar are renewable. Unfortunately this is really just "feel-good environmentalism." For the small amount of electricity turbines and panels produce, they require a lot of resources and some very polluting techniques to manufacture. Stick with hydro, nuclear, tidal and invest in clean coal and thorium reactors.
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:hand:
 
Rune said:
Laughing my ass off. There is no such thing as clean coal idiot.
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You prove on a daily basis your ignorance for all to see, apparently there is no start to your abilities!!


http://gigaom.com/cleantech/faq-carbon-capture-sequestration-1/

Let-me-show-you-something.gif
 
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Aoxomoxoa said:
You prove on a daily basis your ignorance for all to see, apparently there is no start to your abilities!!


http://gigaom.com/cleantech/faq-carbon-capture-sequestration-1/
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From your own link;
Carbon capture and sequestration (CCS) is the great hope of the fossil fuel industry.

It is a hope, you frigging delusional idiot. There is currently (which is all that matters) NO SUCH THING AS CLEAN COAL.

http://e360.yale.edu/feature/the_myth_of_clean_coal/2014/

[URL="http://www.popularmechanics.com/science/energy/coal-oil-gas/4339171"]http://www.popularmechanics.com/science/energy/coal-oil-gas/4339171

[URL="http://www.time.com/time/health/article/0,8599,1870599,00.html"]http://www.time.com/time/health/article/0,8599,1870599,00.html

[URL="http://thinkprogress.org/climate/2010/01/07/205313/science-clean-coal-mountaintop-mining-removal/?mobile=nc"]http://thinkprogress.org/climate/2010/01/07/205313/science-clean-coal-mountaintop-mining-removal/?mobile=nc

[URL="http://www.guardian.co.uk/environment/2008/oct/30/fossilfuels-carbonemissions"]http://www.guardian.co.uk/environment/2008/oct/30/fossilfuels-carbonemissions

[URL="http://www.coal-is-dirty.org/top-5-clean-coal-myths"]http://www.coal-is-dirty.org/top-5-clean-coal-myths
[URL="http://www.counterpunch.org/2009/02/13/the-myth-of-clean-coal/"]http://www.counterpunch.org/2009/02/13/the-myth-of-clean-coal/
[URL="http://sierraclub.typepad.com/gaa/2011/02/cleancoal.html"]http://sierraclub.typepad.com/gaa/2011/02/cleancoal.html

http://www.democracynow.org/2010/2/26/as_obama_pushes_clean_coal_jeff

http://rationalwiki.org/wiki/Clean_coal


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