PostmodernProphet
fully immersed in faith..
unless you count places like Asia, Africa and South America......when you come right down to it, the only place religion is fading is Western Europe......
Pagan Roots? 5 Surprising Facts About Christmas
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PostmodernProphet
fully immersed in faith..
the gospels were written after his death by eye witnesses.......
http://www.thehistoryofchristmas.com/ch/before_christ.htm
History of Christmas - Before Christ?
The middle of winter has long been a time of celebration around the world. Centuries before the arrival of the man called Jesus, early Europeans celebrated light and birth in the darkest days of winter. Many peoples rejoiced during the winter solstice, when the worst of the winter was behind them and they could look forward to longer days and extended hours of sunlight. In Scandinavia, the Norse celebrated Yule from December 21, the winter solstice, through January. In recognition of the return of the sun, fathers and sons would bring home large logs, which they would set on fire. The people would feast until the log burned out, which could take as many as 12 days. The Norse believed that each spark from the fire represented a new pig or calf that would be born during the coming year.
The end of December was a perfect time for celebration in most areas of Europe. At that time of year, most cattle were slaughtered so they would not have to be fed during the winter. For many, it was the only time of year when they had a supply of fresh meat. In addition, most wine and beer made during the year was finally fermented and ready for drinking.
In Germany, people honored the pagan god Oden during the mid-winter holiday. Germans were terrified of Oden, as they believed he made nocturnal flights through the sky to observe his people, and then decide who would prosper or perish. Because of his presence, many people chose to stay inside.
Saturnalia - In Rome, where winters were not as harsh as those in the far north, Saturnalia—a holiday in honor of Saturn, the god of agriculture—was celebrated. Beginning in the week leading up to the winter solstice and continuing for a full month, Saturnalia was a hedonistic time, when food and drink were plentiful and the normal Roman social order was turned upside down. For a month, slaves would become masters. Peasants were in command of the city. Business and schools were closed so that everyone could join in the fun.
Also around the time of the winter solstice, Romans observed Juvenalia, a feast honoring the children of Rome. In addition, members of the upper classes often celebrated the birthday of Mithra, the god of the unconquerable sun, on December 25. It was believed that Mithra, an infant god, was born of a rock. For some Romans, Mithra’s birthday was the most sacred day of the year. In the early years of Christianity, Easter was the main holiday; the birth of Jesus was not celebrated.
History of Christmas - Before Christ?
The middle of winter has long been a time of celebration around the world. Centuries before the arrival of the man called Jesus, early Europeans celebrated light and birth in the darkest days of winter. Many peoples rejoiced during the winter solstice, when the worst of the winter was behind them and they could look forward to longer days and extended hours of sunlight. In Scandinavia, the Norse celebrated Yule from December 21, the winter solstice, through January. In recognition of the return of the sun, fathers and sons would bring home large logs, which they would set on fire. The people would feast until the log burned out, which could take as many as 12 days. The Norse believed that each spark from the fire represented a new pig or calf that would be born during the coming year.
The end of December was a perfect time for celebration in most areas of Europe. At that time of year, most cattle were slaughtered so they would not have to be fed during the winter. For many, it was the only time of year when they had a supply of fresh meat. In addition, most wine and beer made during the year was finally fermented and ready for drinking.
In Germany, people honored the pagan god Oden during the mid-winter holiday. Germans were terrified of Oden, as they believed he made nocturnal flights through the sky to observe his people, and then decide who would prosper or perish. Because of his presence, many people chose to stay inside.
Saturnalia - In Rome, where winters were not as harsh as those in the far north, Saturnalia—a holiday in honor of Saturn, the god of agriculture—was celebrated. Beginning in the week leading up to the winter solstice and continuing for a full month, Saturnalia was a hedonistic time, when food and drink were plentiful and the normal Roman social order was turned upside down. For a month, slaves would become masters. Peasants were in command of the city. Business and schools were closed so that everyone could join in the fun.
Also around the time of the winter solstice, Romans observed Juvenalia, a feast honoring the children of Rome. In addition, members of the upper classes often celebrated the birthday of Mithra, the god of the unconquerable sun, on December 25. It was believed that Mithra, an infant god, was born of a rock. For some Romans, Mithra’s birthday was the most sacred day of the year. In the early years of Christianity, Easter was the main holiday; the birth of Jesus was not celebrated.
Lowaicue
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It? That is not possible.
Lowaicue
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You are, as you well know, wrong. However we could make it right by simply changing the word religion to superstition. There are populations where there is little sign of religion fading, The Philipines for example. Even Muslim societies are seeing their youth questioning their teaching.
One symptom of this is the rabid fundementalism, both Islamic and Christian.
How a nation so bent on violence, arrogance and selfishness and on denying proper health care to its people ever call themselves religious, is beyond me. Evidence, of course, of a poorly educated, frightened and gullible people.
Amen brother!
And again your observation is wrong. Christians DO in fact celebrate the pagan rituals. What ritual is uniquely Christian other than holding mass? The majority of Christians probably don't bother with that.
What Christians call Christmas is almost entirely based on pagan rituals.
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josephus is the historical. history is always questioned, nonetheless, there exists mention of jesus outside of the bible.
anecdotal and eye witness are of course 3 of the 4 gospels.
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i don't know how many times i need to make myself clear on this, but you clearly are not understanding what i'm saying. so here it is again:
- i never said 'everything' christians celebrate christmas for was adopted from pagans. they took an already popular pagan holiday, some pagen rituals, and turned it into a christian holiday by adding the remembrance of christ's birth. quoting the source that there was nothing intrinsically christian about saturnalia................does not..............mean there is nothing intrinsically pagan about christmas.
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i wouldn't say disagreement and i definitely wouldn't say "key" things. if they all said exactly the same thing, you would claim they would made up and that they each agreed on the same story. the fact they differ actually lends more credibility to the accounts.
Josephus' account amounts to a couple sentences and he was not a contemporary.
It is not that the history is questioned but the source.
The gospels are not believed to be eye witness acounts. Just because they carry the name of an apostle does nit mean they were written by one.
PostmodernProphet
fully immersed in faith..
I know I am right....the largest Christian churches in the world are in South Korea, Nigeria and Brazil.....
PostmodernProphet
fully immersed in faith..
lol.....you mean decorated trees, Santa Claus and reindeer...sorry dude, you've gotten a bit mixed up on your religions.....
Christians practice those rituals. What is your point? I am not mixed up on anything.
I was thinking today about the disconnect of idiot conservatives that complain about the commercialization/secularization of Christmas while they villify workers that objected to working on Thanksgiving. The cognitive dissonance of conservative thought even leaves many of them so ditzy they don't know they are believers.
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actually, it is believed that 3 of 4 were written by the eye witness. some of course do not. but to simply claim they are not believed is not accurate.
doesn't matter if it is only a couple of sentences, he wrote about the man, jesus. you can question the source all you like, but the fact remains, he was mentioned in a secular setting.
By who, is it believed they were written by the eye witness?
You are not understanding and becoming defensive.
Josephus was not a cotemporary of Christ. He wrote about someome else's account of Christ. He did not provide any support for his existence. Further, it is disputed whether the brief mention came from him or was inserted after the fact by the church.