Boston is not the first time that police overreacted

[Bonestorm]

people in boston and surrounding areas were dragged out of their homes at gun point and had their homes illegally searched. About as clear a violation of the 4th Amendment if there ever was one. If people consider that environment as being free, then we've already lost freedom and those people are brain dead. what kind of freedom does one have when the authorities can act against the constitution with impunity?

Homes in a 20 blaock radius in Watertown were searched. And if you can find a single person whose home was searched without their consent you might find a 4th Amendment violation. And I say might because I'm about 99.99% that the exigent circumstances exception applies.

 

[leaningright]

Homes in a 20 blaock radius in Watertown were searched. And if you can find a single person whose home was searched without their consent you might find a 4th Amendment violation. And I say might because I'm about 99.99% that the exigent circumstances exception applies.

This. I am almost positive as well that most folks in that radius were more than happy to cooperate with police given the circumstances. To me it would be common sense.

 

[SmarterthanYou]

Homes in a 20 blaock radius in Watertown were searched. And if you can find a single person whose home was searched without their consent you might find a 4th Amendment violation. And I say might because I'm about 99.99% that the exigent circumstances exception applies.

you think that warrantless entry a 20 block radius for one man qualifies for an exigent circumstance?

 

[Bonestorm]

you think that warrantless entry a 20 block radius for one man qualifies for an exigent circumstance?

(1) I assume you have not come up with a single person who did not consent to the search.

(2) Yes.

 

[SmarterthanYou]

(1) I assume you have not come up with a single person who did not consent to the search.]

youtube and twitter pics abound, as well as firsthand testimony.

(2) Yes.

i know of hot pursuit, and medical emergency. even evidence destruction...but only for a single known residence. to believe that this situation would be an exigent circumstance basically destroys the 4th Amendment. might as well shitcan it.

 

[Bonestorm]

youtube and twitter pics abound, as well as firsthand testimony.

Show me a single person refusing to consent to the search and that home being searched in any event.

i know of hot pursuit, and medical emergency. even evidence destruction...but only for a single known residence. to believe that this situation would be an exigent circumstance basically destroys the 4th Amendment. might as well shitcan it.

I disagree, mostly because of the remote circumstances at play here. The nice thing, though, is that it won't be litigated.

 

[SmarterthanYou]

Show me a single person refusing to consent to the search and that home being searched in any event.

I posted almost half a dozen in the other thread on friday.

I disagree, mostly because of the remote circumstances at play here. The nice thing, though, is that it won't be litigated.

remains to be seen, but like I said. I find it terribly saddening at the willingness of north easterners to so readily surrender their liberties over this and then praise and cheer that they did it. begging for slavery, still.

 

[Cancel 2020.1]

remains to be seen, but like I said. I find it terribly saddening at the willingness of north easterners to so readily surrender their liberties over this and then praise and cheer that they did it. begging for slavery, still.

I guess I just don't see the POV on this. Prior to the last suspect being arrested, pretty much everyone in Boston lived in a state of fear and anxiety; hardly what I would call "feelin' free."

Are there limits to what authorities should be able to do in such circumstances? Of course. You're really the only person who I have heard who is saying that they abused those limits & crossed the line. The vast majority of people are grateful for what were tireless efforts - including having many officers put themselves right in harm's way - to resove the situation without further fatalities.

They're not cheering "the end of liberty." That is melodramatic to the extreme. They're cheering a job well done by dedicated individuals, and a return to normalcy.

 

[Bonestorm]

I posted almost half a dozen in the other thread on friday.

Based on the video, I'd say people didn't have the opportunity to consent or not.

remains to be seen, but like I said. I find it terribly saddening at the willingness of north easterners to so readily surrender their liberties over this and then praise and cheer that they did it. begging for slavery, still.

What remains to be seen, exactly? Who's going to litigate it? Are you aware of any person who was charged with a crime based on a search of their home? Otherwise, I don't see how the issue gets litigated.

Also, too, the idea that you would have done anything differently is laughably absurd.

 

[SmarterthanYou]

Based on the video, I'd say people didn't have the opportunity to consent or not.


What remains to be seen, exactly? Who's going to litigate it? Are you aware of any person who was charged with a crime based on a search of their home? Otherwise, I don't see how the issue gets litigated.

Also, too, the idea that you would have done anything differently is laughably absurd.

let's assume that whatever other crimes may have been witnessed, like plain view of drugs or something. Those would be obviously litigated. also, let's assume that nothing other than the search was done and cops leave, the only option left for homeowner to do is file a lawsuit. are you saying that no lawyer would dare take his case? and laugh all you want, but i'd be dead and you'd be thrilled that you were proven right. congrats.

 

[BRUTALITOPS]

The MOVE bombing happened in Philadelphia not LA. I would say that practically closing a city down for two days is an overreaction.

My Iraqi friend has a son who got a scholarship to go to Brown University and has now married and lives in Boston about five minutes walking distance from the bombing.

everyone in boston lives 5 minutes from the bombing. I've been down at copley about one bajillion times. Most of the universities are in back bay.

 

[BRUTALITOPS]

BPD didn't really have a heck of a lot to do with Friday's events. The suspects went from Cambridge to Watertown and never entered Boston.

MIT area is basically boston. it's closer to boston than it is to harvard. I think BPD still responded to that event.

 

[christiefan915]

Wonder how many people have heard of the MOVE bombing? Police fired an astonishing 10,000 rounds of ammunition into that house while enforcing warrants that named only three MOVE members for misdemeanour charges. By the time that the fire was brought under control, 11 people were killed, 250 people were left homeless, and 61 houses were destroyed

PHILADELPHIA AND THE MOVE BOMBING

MOVE

Founded in the early 1970s, the MOVE organization was the brainchild of an idealistic social worker named Donald Glassey and a man named Vincent Leaphart. The name of the organization actually stood for nothing, and Leaphart and his followers espoused a back-to-nature retreat from the technology that they believed was ruining civilization. MOVE members were not known for much prior to 1977. During that year and into 1978, its members confronted the administration of former mayor Frank Rizzo. After six hundred police surrounded a MOVE commune, shots were exchanged between the police and commune members. One officer was killed and several others wounded. A dozen MOVE members were arrested on weapons and murder charges, and the movement spread out to other communes in the city. The group living at the Osage Avenue commune allegedly engaged in drug dealing, using the profits to purchase guns and explosives. Many of the members living there were children of the MOVE members imprisoned after the 1978 shootout. The stage for a second confrontation of authorities was set in the eighteen months prior to May 1985, when MOVE members in the Osage Avenue commune fortified the house and threatened the neighbors.

Confrontation

Because of their previous experience with MOVE in 1978, city officials took a vastly different approach in their efforts to evict the cult members from Osage Avenue. They evacuated more than five hundred people from a three-block area surrounding the cult house. When a last-minute appeal by boyhood friends of "defense minister" Conrad Africa failed to draw the MOVE members out, police began their siege. First, high-pressure water jets were used in an unsuccessful attempt to dislodge a steel-reinforced bunker on the roof of the building that allowed the cult members a clear field of fire over Osage Avenue. MOVE members and police then engaged in a ninety-minute gunfight. An attempt to enter the building by breaking through a cellar wall failed when MOVE members became aware of the attempt and set up an ambush, successfully fighting off the Special Weapons and Tactics (SWAT) team.

Air Attack

A decision was finally made to attack the roof bunker with explosives. A police helicopter dropped two pounds of DuPont Tovex TR-2, a nonincendiary blasting agent, onto the bunker. About twenty minutes later, flames were visible on the roof. Rather than once again turning on the water cannons, a decision was apparently reached to allow the fire to burn in an attempt to force the MOVE members out. By the time firefighters eventually responded, the roof collapsed and the entire building was in flames. This tragic decision was only the beginning of what turned out to be a monumental misjudgment by city officials.

Conflagration

Firefighters soon learned that the fire was spreading in the neighborhood of row houses. Attempts to halt the fire were initially unsuccessful. Only two MOVE members were able to escape the flames, Ramona Africa and a thirteen-year-old boy, Birdie Africa. By the time that the fire was brought under control, 11 people were killed, 250 people were left homeless, and 61 houses were destroyed. The eleven dead included six adults and five children. After months of hearings into the tragedy, Philadelphia mayor Wilson Goode admitted that he and city officials made a mistake in handling the situation.

Source:

http://www.encyclopedia.com/doc/1G2-3468303095.html

I remember this because I had an aunt living in the area. We debated whether this was right or wrong, she said right, I said wrong. I was shocked that anyone took the cops' side in this.

 

[BRUTALITOPS]

How did the BPD overreact?

I'm amazed at how last week went. There was a bombing, and they didn't have a heck of a lot to go on. Within days, they tracked down the suspects and the threat was gone. People in Boston rejoiced.

yeah tom is being a huge idiot, once again we have people across the pond trying to britsplain and trying to stick their stupid noses in boston affairs. They can't learn their god damn lesson. No one is pissed at BPD over here. No one thinks they overreacted. Everyone is loving them.

 

[Bonestorm]

MIT area is basically boston. it's closer to boston than it is to harvard. I think BPD still responded to that event.

Uh, not really sure how to respond to the bold. Yes, MIT is closer to Boston than it is to Harvard, but both MIT and Harvard are in Cambridge, across the river from Boston. Cambridge is an independent municipality from Boston with its own police force. Same for Watertown.

Yes, BPD responded once the shit hit the fan, but they were in a supporting role along with all sorts of other supporting police forces, including NYPD for instance.

 

[BRUTALITOPS]

Uh, not really sure how to respond to the bold. Yes, MIT is closer to Boston than it is to Harvard, but both MIT and Harvard are in Cambridge, across the river from Boston. Cambridge is an independent municipality from Boston with its own police force. Same for Watertown.

Yes, BPD responded once the shit hit the fan, but they were in a supporting role along with all sorts of other supporting police forces, including NYPD for instance.

bro I know MIT is in cambridge. why do you think I used that word "basically" if I thought otherwise?

 

[Bonestorm]

bro I know MIT is in cambridge. why do you think I used that word "basically" if I thought otherwise?

I assume you know it's in Cambridge, but I don't understand your point. I mean, what the hell does proximity to Harvard have to do with anything? BPD had no jurisdiction over the matter on Friday. Obviously, it's a larger and better equipped force than Cambridge or Watertown PD (excluding the Staties here) but it was in a support role.

But, basically, who gives a shit? Right? I was, like, just fucking with Tom because he's being an idiot who has no clue what the hell he's talking about.

 

[BRUTALITOPS]

there wasn't much of a point I was just simply including MIT in the whole boston game even though they technically aren't. And yeah BPD was in a supporting role but lets not kid ourselves, BPD has way more resources and they probably were only in a supporting role in name only. They were running the show.

 

[cancel2 2022]

yeah tom is being a huge idiot, once again we have people across the pond trying to britsplain and trying to stick their stupid noses in boston affairs. They can't learn their god damn lesson. No one is pissed at BPD over here. No one thinks they overreacted. Everyone is loving them.

Yeh, I wonder if you would be saying that if a few people on the sidelines got killed. All those guns for just one lone teenager, maybe you can massplain it for me?
My friend's son has a different story to tell but there you go, I'm done.

 

[Cancel 2016.11]

Well, wait a minute, are you guys (DH and Grind) saying that this video is okay? I understand going door to door, but forcing everyone out of the house with their hands over their heads, at gunpoint , and making them run down the street while yelling at them is okay? I was concerned about a hostage situation, and I can see door to door, but wtf, if someone answers and says, yeah they're not here, why is what happened in that video necessary? I would not be okay with that. I would not be okay with that kind of firepower in my home. Was this something they did at every house or was there something special about this house?