59% support AOC's plan to raise top bracket to 70%

Flash said:
Under that 70% rate there were many more tax deductions which were eliminated when the rates were lowered.
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You know, this seems to be the Conservative talking point du jour, yet when pressed for details every Conservative comes up short and draws a blank.

You say there were all these deductions...OK...name them.

How about just one?

Name one deduction that existed from 1946-1980, or within that frame, that resulted in any rich person avoiding paying the top marginal rate.

I don't think you can. I think you're just repeating shit you heard someone else say that sounded good to you, but because you lack the ability to think critically, you never questioned it. That kind of sad devotion to your biases is what gave us Bush the Dumber, and what gave us Trump.
 
Flash said:
AOC's plan for a 70% rate is a stupid idea, will never happen, and would only result in people changing their behavior to avoid higher tax rates. She is more interested in punishing the successful than raising revenue because it appeals to those who think the rich don't deserve their wealth. It is a emotional political appeal based on envy and resentment.
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What's stupid is thinking that people don't already change their behaviors to avoid paying taxes.

What's also stupid is thinking that it won't result in more revenues despite the fact that income gains for the top 1% have happened over the last 40 years, while everyone else's income has remained flat.

So there's more money being earned at the top now that can -and should- be taxed.
 
Flash said:
She is more interested in punishing the successful than raising revenue because it appeals to those who think the rich don't deserve their wealth.
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This is ultimately what every Conservative argument boils down to...emotion.

There is no economic or fiscal reason we can't have a higher tax rate on the wealthy, and Conservatives cannot make one. So they instead try to make the debate about emotions.

Why are you such an emotional snowflake? Why are those the only terms with which you can debate? Don't you have any fiscal or economic support for your position? No. That's why you have to boil it down to emotions.

You have to make this an emotional debate because you can't make it a fiscal or economic one.
 
I will share this again. Over a decade since I wrote this. But I send it to my rep and Senators each year. Feel free to do the same if you so choose.

Flat Tax with standard deduction
It is time for this country to become fiscally responsible. The national debt has increased every fiscal year since 1960. What has happened to the responsibility of the two parties? Both like to point the blame at the other, but in reality neither have been responsible fiscally. It is time for a change. Let’s begin with our tax code. It should be simple enough that the average person can understand it. It should not be filled with thousands of loopholes and deductions. Let us push for the flat tax with a standard deduction and nothing more.

Start with a standard deduction of $30k (adjusted for inflation annually) for each adult and then tax every dollar over that $30k at 20%. This is simple, easy to understand, fair and progressive. It protects the low-income individuals and couples from paying federal income taxes. It provides the middle-income families a lower effective tax rate than the wealthy. This plan would encompass ALL income, including earned income, capital gains and dividend income.

A person making $30k pays an effective rate of 0%.

A person making $50k pays an effective rate of 8%.

A person making $100k pays an effective rate of 14%.

A person making $200k pays en effective rate of 17%.

A person making $1mm pays an effective rate of 19.4%

Everyone has the same deduction and takes it. Which causes the effective tax rate to increase the more you make.

To reduce the national debt I would propose we add an additional temporary bracket to the flat tax. Every dollar over $1 million (again adjusted for inflation annually) would be taxed at 30% rather than 20%. The additional 10% would be mandated to pay down the debt.

It is our responsibility to pay our own way and not dump trillions of dollars of debt on future generations. We need to begin electing leaders that are fiscally responsible. The future of our nation depends upon it. We are our own worst enemy. It will be our ever-increasing debt that leads to our demise. We must act now.
 
Superfreak said:
I will share this again. Over a decade since I wrote this. But I send it to my rep and Senators each year. Feel free to do the same if you so choose.

Flat Tax with standard deduction
It is time for this country to become fiscally responsible. The national debt has increased every fiscal year since 1960. What has happened to the responsibility of the two parties? Both like to point the blame at the other, but in reality neither have been responsible fiscally. It is time for a change. Let’s begin with our tax code. It should be simple enough that the average person can understand it. It should not be filled with thousands of loopholes and deductions. Let us push for the flat tax with a standard deduction and nothing more.

Start with a standard deduction of $30k (adjusted for inflation annually) for each adult and then tax every dollar over that $30k at 20%. This is simple, easy to understand, fair and progressive. It protects the low-income individuals and couples from paying federal income taxes. It provides the middle-income families a lower effective tax rate than the wealthy. This plan would encompass ALL income, including earned income, capital gains and dividend income.

A person making $30k pays an effective rate of 0%.

A person making $50k pays an effective rate of 8%.

A person making $100k pays an effective rate of 14%.

A person making $200k pays en effective rate of 17%.

A person making $1mm pays an effective rate of 19.4%

Everyone has the same deduction and takes it. Which causes the effective tax rate to increase the more you make.

To reduce the national debt I would propose we add an additional temporary bracket to the flat tax. Every dollar over $1 million (again adjusted for inflation annually) would be taxed at 30% rather than 20%. The additional 10% would be mandated to pay down the debt.

It is our responsibility to pay our own way and not dump trillions of dollars of debt on future generations. We need to begin electing leaders that are fiscally responsible. The future of our nation depends upon it. We are our own worst enemy. It will be our ever-increasing debt that leads to our demise. We must act now.
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There is nothing complicated about progressive taxation, so there's no need to simplify the tax code to a flat tax just because you don't get how progressive taxation works.
 
LV426 said:
Well, the bad news for you is that since 1980, the top 1% has seen all the income gains.

So if everyone's income rose at the same rate, you'd have a point.

But they didn't, so you don't.
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did I miss your explanation and numbers on how taxing people that make over 10 million 70% will help in any meaningful way?

(((crickets)))
 
Getin the ring said:
did I miss your explanation and numbers on how taxing people that make over 10 million 70% will help in any meaningful way?
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Well, when we let the Bush Tax Cuts for the rich expire at the end of 2012, revenues grew 13% ($325B) which was the highest single year gain in revenue ever.

That was simply raising the top rate back to 39.6% from 35%.
 
Havana Moon said:
Well it is for simpletons like you, of course.
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It's not simplistic, it's necessary.

We have to erase Conservatism entirely from society.

That means undoing all its effects on our tax code.

That means yanking Fox News off the air.

That means isolating and excluding you from the debate.

That means diminishing your representation or eliminating it entirely.

There is no need to include you people in any discussions or any policy moving forward since your minds were so weak, your instincts so bad, your judgment so poor, and your character so rotten you got conned into supporting Trump.
 
nope you said we could raise an additional 325 billion in revenue by increasing the top bracket from 35 to 39.5.

So you're claiming you know where 8 trillion dollars is you can tax to make that kind of dough.
It's math goober

so, give me some statistics that show we have 8 trillion dollars worth of rich people that make over 10 million each (((crickets)))

your problem is you're so stupid you let your mouth get ahead of your brain
 
Getin the ring said:
nope you said we could raise an additional 325 billion in revenue by increasing the top bracket from 35 to 39.5.
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Not that we could, but that we did raise $325B more dollars when we let the top tax rate return to what it was before Bush the Dumber.

I didn't quantify that amount to the tax increase...I merely said that revenue increased more than ever before after we let the Bush Tax Cuts for the rich expire.

Your argument is that raising taxes results in less revenue, and there is no empirical data that proves that.

So you're just spitting out bullshit because you don't want to admit that raising taxes raises revenue, and revenue can be used to offset out of pocket costs for individuals on things like health care and education, and that it can provide for good paying jobs like in a Green New Deal.
 
Getin the ring said:
so, give me some statistics that show we have 8 trillion dollars worth of rich people that make over 10 million each
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I never said anything to this effect, and I don't know how you're coming to these numbers.

All I said was that contrary to what you claim, raising taxes has never once reduced revenue. Never. Not once. And that when Obama let the Bush Tax Cuts expire on the wealthy, revenues grew more in that one year than they ever had before.

However, there is plenty of empirical and enumerated data that shows cutting taxes reduces revenue, and we can see that plainly in revenue from 2001-2004, four years of Bush Tax Cuts where the revenue collected was less than in the year 2000.
 
LV426 said:
I never said anything to this effect, and I don't know how you're coming to these numbers.

All I said was that contrary to what you claim, raising taxes has never once reduced revenue. Never. Not once. And that when Obama let the Bush Tax Cuts expire on the wealthy, revenues grew more in that one year than they ever had before.

However, there is plenty of empirical and enumerated data that shows cutting taxes reduces revenue, and we can see that plainly in revenue from 2001-2004, four years of Bush Tax Cuts where the revenue collected was less than in the year 2000.
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And why in the HELL would I want the fucking government to EVER see an INCREASE in revenue?? Every quarter for 8 years of obama, the same headline over and over: :"IRS collects record amount of tax revenue", and it's been the same for the past 2 years under Trump! WITH the tax cuts!! Fuck the government, let THEM struggle to pay THEIR bills!
 
Callinectes Ocasio-Cortez said:
And why in the HELL would I want the fucking government to EVER see an INCREASE in revenue??
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Well, for starters, because of inflation.

We get it; you're anti-social. That's fine. If you don't want to participate in society, self-deport or self-isolate. But don't drag us into your miserable world because going out in public gives you crippling anxiety you'll never be able to overcome.
 
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