Trump tariffs ruled illegal by U.S. court

Yakuda said:
It's not a tax no matter how much you cry. You people do this all the time. All the lame brain media use the same word over and over. I wonder which of you demholes came up with the a tariff is a "tax" idea. Hilarious
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It is a fee paid to the government for trade? How is that not a tax?
 
T. A. Gardner said:
Congress won't act until forced to act. Even then, they are so disunited on everything it would take months to reach a half-assed compromise to fix whatever the problem is. The last thing I want is unelected judges who are also moron lawyers, running anything. The judiciary would become a far worse dictatorship than having an actual dictator, which at the moment we don't have, whether you like it or not.
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You believe they are wrong in this ruling? Do you believe taxation powers belong to the Executive?
 
QP! said:
The problem is you are wrong.

Tariffs not only do not 'in large part, fal under' Trump (POTUS) or the Executive's office, they do not even in small part.

Congress has GRANTED the Executive a piece of their authority as it entirely falls under Congress and Congress could take it away.
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The Court simply ruled, the power Trump is trying to use was not given to him by Congress.

Only the most uneducated of Trumppers are claiming that The Felon has the power without Congress.
 
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Jarod said:
You believe they are wrong in this ruling? Do you believe taxation powers belong to the Executive?
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No, I believe that Congress is incapable of fast or decisive action. Instead, it moves glacially slow, is indecisive, and prone to half-assed solutions. Congress has legislated away much of their power to the executive branch in one way or another due to that. They let unelected bureaucrats run much of the government and make rules and regulations that have the effect of law. They let the President have greater discretion over what the government does as well. One of those things they legislated away was imposing tariffs.

As a result, Trump is now using that power in a serious way that the Left, and globalists, really dislike. The Left is now howling that Congress should act (unlikely any time soon). Because they recognize that, their only recourse is to use the judiciary and find like-minded judges that will impose stays, rulings, and such against Trump meant to stop him. These are often, usually, temporary at best but because the legal system is equally glacial in many ways, their being overturned can take months, even years, to occur.

This is as true of illegal immigration as it is tariffs, or for that matter, anything else Trump does they don't like.
 
Jarod said:
The Court simply ruled, the power Trump is trying to use was not given to him by Congress.

Only the most uneducated of Trumppers are claiming that The Felon has the power without Congress.
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Correct.

If you had an org chart or a job descriptions list this area entirely falls under COngress. Trump has zero authority over any of it other than any temporary powers Congress grants him and that they can take back at any time.

It would be like your boss telling the VP Sales he can put together quotes to try and attract new business. The boss is allowing the VP that ability but it is the boss who owns that power. The VP gets zero latitude to do with anything beyond what the boss specifically says he can do with it.
 
T. A. Gardner said:
No, I believe that Congress is incapable of fast or decisive action. Instead, it moves glacially slow, is indecisive, and prone to half-assed solutions. Congress has legislated away much of their power to the executive branch in one way or another due to that. They let unelected bureaucrats run much of the government and make rules and regulations that have the effect of law. They let the President have greater discretion over what the government does as well. One of those things they legislated away was imposing tariffs.

As a result, Trump is now using that power in a serious way that the Left, and globalists, really dislike. The Left is now howling that Congress should act (unlikely any time soon). Because they recognize that, their only recourse is to use the judiciary and find like-minded judges that will impose stays, rulings, and such against Trump meant to stop him. These are often, usually, temporary at best but because the legal system is equally glacial in many ways, their being overturned can take months, even years, to occur.

This is as true of illegal immigration as it is tariffs, or for that matter, anything else Trump does they don't like.
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What law legislated away total power on Tariffs?
 
T. A. Gardner said:
No, I believe that Congress is incapable of fast or decisive action. Instead, it moves glacially slow, is indecisive, and prone to half-assed solutions. Congress has legislated away much of their power to the executive branch in one way or another due to that. They let unelected bureaucrats run much of the government and make rules and regulations that have the effect of law. They let the President have greater discretion over what the government does as well. One of those things they legislated away was imposing tariffs.

As a result, Trump is now using that power in a serious way that the Left, and globalists, really dislike. The Left is now howling that Congress should act (unlikely any time soon). Because they recognize that, their only recourse is to use the judiciary and find like-minded judges that will impose stays, rulings, and such against Trump meant to stop him. These are often, usually, temporary at best but because the legal system is equally glacial in many ways, their being overturned can take months, even years, to occur.

This is as true of illegal immigration as it is tariffs, or for that matter, anything else Trump does they don't like.
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Just as the right would howl and cry if Biden or Obama said 'Congress is slow and prone to half assed solutions' so i will just take over Congress power and take action myself.

Do you agree Terry that you would disagree with them doing that.

Like if Biden want to give student debt relief without the proper actions of Congress first?
 
QP! said:
Correct.

If you had an org chart or a job descriptions list this area entirely falls under COngress. Trump has zero authority over any of it other than any temporary powers Congress grants him and that they can take back at any time.

It would be like your boss telling the VP Sales he can put together quotes to try and attract new business. The boss is allowing the VP that ability but it is the boss who owns that power. The VP gets zero latitude to do with anything beyond what the boss specifically says he can do with it.
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Wrong. The issue at hand is that Trump is using powers Congress gave him on tariffs to an extent and in a way that hasn't been done before by a President. What the court is saying (it's one district judge at this point) is that Trump can't do what he's doing because there is no precedent for him doing it. In other words, the court claims Trump can't do it because no president before him did, and not ruling on the basis of law as written.

Congress won't intervene any time soon because that's just the nature of congress. It's likely that the lone district judge will be overturned at the appellate level as well. The solution here is that congress acts to clarify their previous vague legislation but don't hold your breath for that to happen.
 
T. A. Gardner said:
Wrong. The issue at hand is that Trump is using powers Congress gave him on tariffs to an extent and in a way that hasn't been done before by a President. What the court is saying (it's one district judge at this point) is that Trump can't do what he's doing because there is no precedent for him doing it. In other words, the court claims Trump can't do it because no president before him did, and not ruling on the basis of law as written.

Congress won't intervene any time soon because that's just the nature of congress. It's likely that the lone district judge will be overturned at the appellate level as well. The solution here is that congress acts to clarify their previous vague legislation but don't hold your breath for that to happen.
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FALSE.

You have not read the judge's ruling and that is clear.

It is not an issue of 'has any other POTUS taken this power on to himself... and thus can Trump do it' and the judge specifically said Trump, in no way has the powers he is using based on the small grant of powers that Congress have given POTUS prior.
 
Cypress said:
Correct, until very recently on this board right-wingers paraded around announcing they were strict and devout constitutionalists. But when they joined the Trump cult they completely flip-flopped.
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There are people who devoutly deny being racist, and yet they say that racial discrimination is the only cure for past discrimination.

Contrast.

Is the only cure for increasing disregard for the spirit of the law to disregard it yourself?

If both sides believe they aren't playing dirty games, there is no cure one way or another. Refusing to match escalation is just surrender.

There is a slight chance that after sufficient escalation enough people will see the symmetry and try to return to a high trust political process by emphasizing honor and benefit of the doubt.

To make this more specific, Trump's legal positions are novel. His lawyers won't ever admit that they were breaking the law; but neither did the left-tribe lawfare lawyers; even though their 'interpretations' were just as unprecedented and absurd.

It's a flaw in law that it can be used this way, that's true; but that doesn't change the fact that it wasn't until the last decade. Or at least it wasn't publicly visible.
 
T. A. Gardner said:
No, I believe that Congress is incapable of fast or decisive action. Instead, it moves glacially slow, is indecisive, and prone to half-assed solutions. Congress has legislated away much of their power to the executive branch in one way or another due to that. They let unelected bureaucrats run much of the government and make rules and regulations that have the effect of law. They let the President have greater discretion over what the government does as well. One of those things they legislated away was imposing tariffs.

As a result, Trump is now using that power in a serious way that the Left, and globalists, really dislike. The Left is now howling that Congress should act (unlikely any time soon). Because they recognize that, their only recourse is to use the judiciary and find like-minded judges that will impose stays, rulings, and such against Trump meant to stop him. These are often, usually, temporary at best but because the legal system is equally glacial in many ways, their being overturned can take months, even years, to occur.

This is as true of illegal immigration as it is tariffs, or for that matter, anything else Trump does they don't like.
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Trump is TACO man. That shows indecision on a grand scale. He has been flip-flopping for almost 6 months. Again, you look in the wrong direction.
 
Jarod said:
Taxation is with Congress. Even the preisdnet has reconized this in his Court arguments. He did not claim he had the power in the Constitution, he claimed Congress gave it to him. Very different.

The Power is Congresses, under limited circumstances they have granted the executive the authority to use their power.
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Jarod said:
Not an Executive power, long standing law and the clear wording of the Constitution gives this power to the Congress.
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You better take your happy faggot ass and go read the Constitution some more.
 
Jarod said:
The Court simply ruled, the power Trump is trying to use was not given to him by Congress.

Only the most uneducated of Trumppers are claiming that The Felon has the power without Congress.
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You will pivot from this to some other current Democrat talking point when it gets bitchsmacked down and then some.
Weasel.
 
Matt Dillon said:
You will pivot from this to some other current Democrat talking point when it gets bitchsmacked down and then some.
Weasel.
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Let me know when it has been bitchsmaked down.

A higher Court MIGHT say the actions of The Felon do fit within the limited power granted him. That is very possible, we will see.
 
Jarod said:
Let me know when it has been bitchsmaked down.

A higher Court MIGHT say the actions of The Felon do fit within the limited power granted him. That is very possible, we will see.
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I'm going to gloat when penalties start rolling out for these chuckleheads. You know that, right? And it IS going to happen.
Lemme tell you something "lawyer man", if any of the judges injunctions prevent or hamper Trump from keeping The United States from being invaded, there are several charges that can be leveled at them and a conviction is almost guaranteed.
The penalties for one involve removal from office, up to a year in prison, and some kind of fine $100K or more.
That's just for violating their oath to uphold The Constitution.
What if they're involved in a coordinated conspiracy to do so? Now they get some serious charges. :awesome:
 
Matt Dillon said:
I'm going to gloat when penalties start rolling out for these chuckleheads. You know that, right? And it IS going to happen.
Lemme tell you something "lawyer man", if any of the judges injunctions prevent or hamper Trump from keeping The United States from being invaded, there are several charges that can be leveled at them and a conviction is almost guaranteed.
The penalties for one involve removal from office, up to a year in prison, and some kind of fine $100K or more.
That's just for violating their oath to uphold The Constitution.
What if they're involved in a coordinated conspiracy to do so? Now they get some serious charges. :awesome:
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You are over the edge. Maybe lithium will help.
 
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