The Curse of Poverty

what about rights of the people? where will they come from?

The same place they do now. The rights people enjoy today are the rights that people in the 1700/1800s felt they should have.

A person or persons wrote the Bill of Rights. A person or persons wrote the Constitution and, of course, it can be changed with enough people wanting it.
 
It's those who benefit from globalization versus those who's lives are destroyed by it. It makes total sense. It's all the workers put out of work by incentivizing chinese tyranny versus managers and corporations who made the decision that globalization was a good idea.

it's rich versus poor. The elites versus the rest of society, just like always.

What about the people whose lives are now destroyed due to lack of globalization? People suffering famine? Do we keep sending them money and never expect them to work?
 
What about the people whose lives are now destroyed due to lack of globalization? People suffering famine? Do we keep sending them money and never expect them to work?

We can share technology, develop crops that grow better etc.

We dont need to put americans out of work so they can be corporate slaves. That doesnt help them either.
 
I explained that to you and even gave an example. Go back and read my post.

I agree, however, denying assistance is not the answer. Changing the rules to allow people to supplement their assistance is the answer. Again, however, there are people who are against that. That is the compromise between people who want to help and those who don’t want to help.

Agreed. But like every other government program there are people fighting against it. Here’s a good example of what I mean. Check this out. http://www.mmafighting.com/2011/01/...of-attention-after-obama-comment?ncid=webmail

The part between 3:00 and 4:00 minutes. "I'm starting my own business and it's not real easy when giving insurance companies the power to decline you and not pay you."

That's the guy’s concern over the health plan. It’s difficult for him and his business. Check out the video.
You keep pulling up the same strawman: "denying assistance is not the answer".

Show me ONE place where I indicated that denying assistance IS the answer.


What percentage of the population are small business owners? And what percentage are regular recipients of government assistance? If you don't know, use your own sources to look it up.

Guess which faction the government program trappers are going after? (Hint: recipients of assistance are significantly the larger group - again, BY DESIGN.)

The threat of denying assistance is part of the trap. "Oh, NO, you can't be on U/I and go to SCHOOL/TRAINING!!" Why? Because the person might actually make themselves re-employable, and no longer need the government for their daily bread.

You are correct that the idea is to disallow people to better themselves. But you are aimed at the wrong people who do not want that to happen. Think about it. What does the average tax payer want in government assistance? What has been the watch word for assistance programs for several decades now? "Hand UP, not hand out!" Yet the DESIGN of the programs is the latter, while DELIBERATELY designed to diminish the former! Do you REALLY think it is the PEOPLE who are demanding this? IF so, you are way out of step with reality.

Suppose we had assistance programs which actually helped people better themselves so they are more employable at better paying jobs. Do you really think the tax payers would OBJECT to assistance that did this? Do you think the average small business owner would support or oppose programs that encouraged people to go out and support themselves as much as possible, then filled in the gaps between the individual's income and expenses? OF COURSE they would support such programs. Contrary to the mad wailing of people like evince, the average business owner, the average fiscal conservative, even the average wealthy person (AVERAGE, not the Darwinian extreme) do not begrudge a helping hand to people in need. What IS objected to is a system that perpetuates the situation.

So WHY is it the vast majority of programs are designed so as to DISCOURAGE people working to become self sufficient? It is NOT due to the demands of the PEOPLE, not even small business owners, and not even the rich (unless the rich person is also an elected government official). The people, from conservative to liberal WANT the "hand up, not hand out" programs, and we get "hand out, and don't you dare try to do better" programs instead. If it's not the people asking for the programs we have, WHO IS?

Think again: what happens when millions of people find themselves dependent on government assistance at election time? What is one of the central themes of democratic campaigning? "Vote for us or THEY'LL CUT YOU OFF!!" Again, the THREAT of losing assistance unless you do as GOVERNMENT says. Result: a solidly entrenched (enslaved) voting block.
 
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We can share technology, develop crops that grow better etc.

We dont need to put americans out of work so they can be corporate slaves. That doesnt help them either.

So what do we do if they don't have jobs? Do we keep supporting them? Do we put an entire country on the welfare roll?
 
So what do we do if they don't have jobs? Do we keep supporting them? Do we put an entire country on the welfare roll?

What do americans do if THEY don't have jobs? Your priorities are those of a traitor. We cant fix the world, but incentivizng their slave status with your orders is not helping them either.

You should care more about americans. You create a victim out of americans because you believe you are serving some higher morality, but you're not.

You have a form of reversed patriotism because you're a brainwash victim.
 
First of all this idea that rich people work so much harder is nonsense. I gave an example of Glenn Beck on another thread. He earned 25 million last year. If we take the average wage to be $50,000/yr. that means Mr. Beck worked as hard as 500 people. Does it make sense?

In many cases, in almost all cases, those who garner wealth did so through luck. How many people worked weeks and months and years doing what Bill Gates did? Nobody? Or hundreds who worked just as "hard" as he did?

Or, more down to earth, how many people made the right decision regarding housing prices? I bought two rental properties before the bubble and combined with speculators/developers moving into the area I sold them less than five years later for three times what I paid.

I didn't work for that money. I had no idea the prices would skyrocket. Who wouldn't have bought, when I did, if people knew the outcome? Why would people, those who owned those properties for 10 or 15 years and never saw a decent increase, sell them just before the value soared? And those who bought less then five years prior probably took a loss as prices were stagnant or slightly decreasing.

Remember that fella who said something about taking the bread out of the mouth of labor regarding taxes? With today's excesses and extravagance it's more like taking their throw-away caviar after a party.

All children need access and exposure to different things. Field trips provided by schools can expose children to ideas. They need that exposure to stimulate their minds.

And of course, you donated that 2/3 profit to a charity!! :good4u:
 
You keep pulling up the same strawman: "denying assistance is not the answer".

Show me ONE place where I indicated that denying assistance IS the answer.


What percentage of the population are small business owners? And what percentage are regular recipients of government assistance? If you don't know, use your own sources to look it up.

Guess which faction the government program trappers are going after? (Hint: recipients of assistance are significantly the larger group - again, BY DESIGN.)

The threat of denying assistance is part of the trap. "Oh, NO, you can't be on U/I and go to SCHOOL/TRAINING!!" Why? Because the person might actually make themselves re-employable, and no longer need the government for their daily bread.

You are correct that the idea is to disallow people to better themselves. But you are aimed at the wrong people who do not want that to happen. Think about it. What does the average tax payer want in government assistance? What has been the watch word for assistance programs for several decades now? "Hand UP, not hand out!" Yet the DESIGN of the programs is the latter, while DELIBERATELY designed to diminish the former! Do you REALLY think it is the PEOPLE who are demanding this? IF so, you are way out of step with reality.

Suppose we had assistance programs which actually helped people better themselves so they are more employable at better paying jobs. Do you really think the tax payers would OBJECT to assistance that did this? Do you think the average small business owner would support or oppose programs that encouraged people to go out and support themselves as much as possible, then filled in the gaps between the individual's income and expenses? OF COURSE they would support such programs. Contrary to the mad wailing of people like evince, the average business owner, the average fiscal conservative, even the average wealthy person (AVERAGE, not the Darwinian extreme) do not begrudge a helping hand to people in need. What IS objected to is a system that perpetuates the situation.

So WHY is it the vast majority of programs are designed so as to DISCOURAGE people working to become self sufficient? It is NOT due to the demands of the PEOPLE, not even small business owners, and not even the rich (unless the rich person is also an elected government official). The people, from conservative to liberal WANT the "hand up, not hand out" programs, and we get "hand out, and don't you dare try to do better" programs instead. If it's not the people asking for the programs we have, WHO IS?

Think again: what happens when millions of people find themselves dependent on government assistance at election time? What is one of the central themes of democratic campaigning? "Vote for us or THEY'LL CUT YOU OFF!!" Again, the THREAT of losing assistance unless you do as GOVERNMENT says. Result: a solidly entrenched (enslaved) voting block.

Why did government cut welfare rolls back in the 90s if they had a voting block? Why do governments impose so many restrictions on eligibility if they want everyone collecting benefits?

Your arguments don't make any sense.

As for
The people, from conservative to liberal WANT the "hand up, not hand out" programs, and we get "hand out, and don't you dare try to do better" programs instead. If it's not the people asking for the programs we have, WHO IS?

It is the people. Well, those folks who don't give a damn about anyone else.

Didn't you follow the HCR debate? Why were people against others getting medical coverage?

HCR. Unemployment. Welfare. It's all the same when it comes to helping others. The convoluted policies are the result of compromise.
 
I just dont understand how people like this guy then talk about the inheritance taxes.

He is just the kind who scream about it being a death tax.

How fucking stupid is it to call it a death tax?

The rich must have figured out a way to take their money with them now.

When you die your money doesnt go with you.

Its like a chair, someone else is sitting in it now.

Its is in NO way wrong to then tax that money as income recieved by someone else.

No one taxed the dead.

I think any kid can be alright with a 4 million tax free head start dont you?

Crying fucking crockodile tears becasue the other 10 million your kid will get comes with a tax on it is fucking insanity.

How hard did that kid work for that money?


Its time in this country for people to quit making up reasons to NOT take care of our american children, in case just decency isnt enough reason for you it is also Intragal to our ability to compete in a world market of the future.

There is NO sound reason to short change American children

Translation:
No one should have more money, then anyone else and if they do; then it should be taken from them and handed out to whoever the bureaucrats say it should go to.
 
What do americans do if THEY don't have jobs? Your priorities are those of a traitor. We cant fix the world, but incentivizng their slave status with your orders is not helping them either.

You should care more about americans. You create a victim out of americans because you believe you are serving some higher morality, but you're not.

You have a form of reversed patriotism because you're a brainwash victim.

What kind of silliness is "We cant fix the world"? Of course we can and we better do it.

It will take adjustment and it will take time but it has to be done.
 
APple just admit that you dont give two shits about poverty in america.

Actually, I give three shits about poverty worldwide. Well, maybe not three. To paraphrase Mr. Carlin the week-end is coming. :)

I's not just poverty, Dixie. Poverty leads to discontent and discontent leads to angry people and considering the weapons available changes have to be made.
 
And of course, you donated that 2/3 profit to a charity!! :good4u:

Actually, I paid taxes on it. The government knows who needs the help better than I. It's fine to give to local charity but maybe there's a poorer person in another community.

Speaking with a friend of mine at the time he said I must be upset having to pay all that tax. I replied, "Why? I didn't even work for the money."
 
Why did government cut welfare rolls back in the 90s if they had a voting block? Why do governments impose so many restrictions on eligibility if they want everyone collecting benefits?
Now why don't you just ponder that a little....why indeed...?
Actually, the pertinent question is WHO cut welfare rolls back in the '90's....
That answer might tell you something ......and please, don't say Clinton.:idea:
 
Actually, I give three shits about poverty worldwide. Well, maybe not three. To paraphrase Mr. Carlin the week-end is coming. :)

I's not just poverty, Dixie. Poverty leads to discontent and discontent leads to angry people and considering the weapons available changes have to be made.

Yes, maybe we should go to a more Soviet Union or Cuba style economy where no one has anything and therefore no one will be jealous of anyone else.
 
Now why don't you just ponder that a little....why indeed...?
Actually, the pertinent question is WHO cut welfare rolls back in the '90's....
That answer might tell you something ......and please, don't say Clinton.:idea:

I wouldn't venture to guess what you're implying.

If welfare people like/vote for politicians who give them welfare then it must follow they don't like politicians who don't give them welfare so why would any politician vote for cutting welfare assuming the foregoing is true?
 
Yes, maybe we should go to a more Soviet Union or Cuba style economy where no one has anything and therefore no one will be jealous of anyone else.

Why would no one have anything if everyone had something unless you believe the world can not support the people who are here in which case we may as well just let them struggle on their own and give them nothing. What is the point of any kind of aid? Why keep them alive at all? Seems like it's just dragging out their suffering.
 
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