It was the state attorney's office, not local authorities

[Rune]

How is Yurt being biased? He simply states that there are not a lot of facts to go on. He's right.

Obviously I am in the minority about racial profiling but I really haven't seen a lot, if any, evidence that racial profiling or discrimination were involved in the police investigation. I'm not discounting the possibility and I certainly understand African Americans sensitivity to this issue. Zimmerman though is another case. I think it's obvious that he did racially profile Trayvon.

Note that wheter he is playing the devil's advocate or not, his comment are more defensive of Zim, than Martin.

 

[Cancel 2018. 3]

dune is incapable of anything but far left partisan hack views. of course he can't understand that i'm not biased on the issue and am solely trying to understand the issue.

i haven't given deference to either person.

 

[Cancel 2018. 3]

Note that wheter he is playing the devil's advocate or not, his comment are more defensive of Zim, than Martin.

right...just because you've already convicted zimmerman, doesn't mean i have said he is innocent. do to try and be such a hack so often dune.

 

[Cancel 2016.2]

The FACT is that Zimmerman left his vehicle to chase after Martin, as heard on the 911 tape.

After discussing his location with the dispatcher, Zimmerman exclaimed, "Shit, he's running," and the following sounds suggest he left his vehicle to run after Martin.

"Are you following him?" the dispatcher asked. Zimmerman replied: "Yep."
"Okay, we don't need you to do that," the dispatcher warned.

The point is, the above does not conflict with Zimmerman's account of the night.

What I would like to see is the paramedics report from the night. That would be pretty telling.

 

[Onceler]

dune is incapable of anything but far left partisan hack views. of course he can't understand that i'm not biased on the issue and am solely trying to understand the issue.

i haven't given deference to either person.

Sure thing...

 

[Cancel 2016.2]

Are you saying Martin was a suspicious person, and you weren't there? Speculation.

Zimmerman thought so. The neighborhood had seen an increase in crime, the black neighbor stated it was mostly black men causing the increase. So it is believable that Zimmerman thought he was suspicious.

 

[Bonestorm]

The point is, the above does not conflict with Zimmerman's account of the night.

What I would like to see is the paramedics report from the night. That would be pretty telling.

I think it's interesting that the State Attorney's office was involved in the initial determination not to charge him. In another thread, you and I were discussing what prosecutors were advising the police that they could not make any charges stick.

 

[Cancel 2018. 3]

I think it's interesting that the State Attorney's office was involved in the initial determination not to charge him. In another thread, you and I were discussing what prosecutors were advising the police that they could not make any charges stick.

what is so interesting about it. fairly routine...

 

[Bonestorm]

Zimmerman thought so. The neighborhood had seen an increase in crime, the black neighbor stated it was mostly black men causing the increase. So it is believable that Zimmerman thought he was suspicious.

Well, was it reasonable for Zimmerman to think he was suspicious? I don't think so.

 

[Cancel 2016.2]

Did you read the entire article? Why did Zimmerman get out of the car, if not to confront Martin.

Um, to follow him? Again, I don't like what Zimmerman did because it led to the confrontation that led to Martin being killed. But you are making a lot of speculation sound like 'fact' to you. He could have been following Martin so that he could let police know where he was. The police told him not to do that and according to Zimmerman he was heading back to his car. According to the girl who was on the phone with Martin he was still following Martin. One of them is lying.

 

[Bonestorm]

what is so interesting about it. fairly routine...

It's interesting in light of a prior discussion between me and SF on a totally separate issue.

 

[Cancel 2016.2]

Yes, he did talk to the kid.

According to the girl. According to Zimmerman it was Martin that came up to him. Again you are acting like you have a fact, when in reality you have the account of someone who was on the phone. She could not see who approached who.

He asked what he was doing around there. And I'm ignoring nothing, even if it came from Faux news. There was an eyewitness who didn't see which one started the confrontation, just that he saw them both on the ground. "... the man who does not want his identity revealed says that when he came upon the fight, Zimmerman was on the bottom and he was the one yelling for help."

I think a "neighborhood watch" is supposed to "watch", Popeye. Watch, and call the authorities if they think something's suspicious, not take the law into their own hands.

Again... if Martin was the one that initiated the conversation and Zimmerman was just 'watching'/following... then you are again assuming he was 'trying to take the law into his own hands'.



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[Cancel 2018. 3]

Well, was it reasonable for Zimmerman to think he was suspicious? I don't think so.

and what observation did you make of martin that led you to this conclusion?

 

[Cancel 2016.2]

You made was one faintly damning comment toward Zimmerman, but you haven't offered any ideas, suggestions, etc. that might show Martin was in the right. And before you go off on some verbal tangent about speculation, not being there, etc. none of us were there. We're all just trying to piece it together from the info that's available.

If Martin had no idea (which is likely) that Zimmerman was 'neighborhood watch' then from his perspective he was being followed by an older man (whose appearance from the police video may have been intimidating). The obvious problem is that only two people know what happened and one is dead. So we obviously are only going to have Zimmerman's account and then witnesses who saw/heard parts of what occurred. If Martin was edgy because he was being followed and didn't know why, he would have been perfectly within his rights to question Zimmerman about it. In my opinion, he also would have been within his rights to defend himself from what would appear to be a stalker/potential thief etc... If someone was following me like that I would have done the same. Running puts the advantage with the stalker. (which is kind of the reason the 'stand your ground' law came into place)

 

[Bonestorm]

and what observation did you make of martin that led you to this conclusion?

None. But we do have George Zimmerman's observations of Martin on the 911 call. According to George Zimmerman, Martin was simply walking down the street while being black and wearing a hoodie. That's what led to Zimmerman's suspicions about him and prompted the 911 call and that isn't a reasonable basis to be suspicious of anyone.

 

[Onceler]

If Martin had no idea (which is likely) that Zimmerman was 'neighborhood watch' then from his perspective he was being followed by an older man (whose appearance from the police video may have been intimidating). The obvious problem is that only two people know what happened and one is dead. So we obviously are only going to have Zimmerman's account and then witnesses who saw/heard parts of what occurred. If Martin was edgy because he was being followed and didn't know why, he would have been perfectly within his rights to question Zimmerman about it. In my opinion, he also would have been within his rights to defend himself from what would appear to be a stalker/potential thief etc... If someone was following me like that I would have done the same. Running puts the advantage with the stalker. (which is kind of the reason the 'stand your ground' law came into place)

It's hard to understate the impact of the audio on the phone call. When I 1st heard it, I thought it was pretty chilling - my very 1st reaction was "why isn't this guy in jail for murder right now?" I'm guessing a few million others had the same reaction, which is why this case is as big as it is.

Without that audio, I'm not sure it's more than a blurb on the news that just lasts for a cycle...

 

[Cancel 2018. 3]

None. But we do have George Zimmerman's observations of Martin on the 911 call. According to George Zimmerman, Martin was simply walking down the street while being black and wearing a hoodie. That's what led to Zimmerman's suspicions about him and prompted the 911 call and that isn't a reasonable basis to be suspicious of anyone.

that is completely false. he stated he thought the kid was on drugs, among other suspicious activity. he didn't mention he was black, unless the purported mumbling of "fucking coon" is true.

but now, i will be accused of defending zimmerman for once again straightening out the far left wingers who are quick to rush to judgement and spouse completely specious claims as facts.

 

[Cancel 2016.2]

You must really love thugs like Martin; but I never said that he was there illegally.
Care to show me where I said that; unless you're just full of shit.

The 911 call says he took off running and it was probably to hide his stash.

And we all know that all pundits on CNN are always truthful.

Martin was a wanna-be thug, acted like one, and paid the price for assaulting someone.

The bolded is just plain bullshit. Skittles and Ice Tea does not = thug. Wearing a hoodie while black does not equal thug. If you are using Martins suspensions as justification, in no way could Zimmerman have known about them. From everything we have seen/heard thus far, while I may alter my opinion from murder one as it first appeared, Zimmerman should still be charged with manslaughter at the least (again in my opinion).

 

[Mott the Hoople]

dune is incapable of anything but far left partisan hack views. of course he can't understand that i'm not biased on the issue and am solely trying to understand the issue.

i haven't given deference to either person.

That was pretty much my impression. I'm with holding judgement until I've seen a report of a much more comprehensive ivestigation. My main concern is that I'd hate to see Zimmerman walk if he did indeed commit a crime and secondly, if Zimmerman did commit manslaughter, by most State standards, but walks due to a flawed "Stand Your Ground" law, then I want to see action taken in regards to ammending or repealing that law. Thirdly, if the facts of the investigation show there was any racial profiling involved by any officials involved with this investigation I want to see heads roll.

 

[Bonestorm]

that is completely false. he stated he thought the kid was on drugs, among other suspicious activity. he didn't mention he was black, unless the purported mumbling of "fucking coon" is true.

No, it's completely accurate. It's completely false to claim he did not say Martin was black. He most certainly did. On what basis did Zimmerman think he was on drugs? It's completely unreasonable to suspect someone is on drugs based on Zimmerman's description of what Martin was doing -- walking down the street and looking around. There is nothing it the 911 call that gives rise to any reason to suspect Martin of anything. Presumably, Zimmerman gave the 911 operator the reasons why he wanted the police to come out so I think it safe to assume that Zimmerman included all information that gave rise to his suspicion.

By the way, what was the "other suspicious activity?"

but now, i will be accused of defending zimmerman for once again straightening out the far left wingers who are quick to rush to judgement and spouse completely specious claims as facts.

You're such a martyr, Yurt.