75 yr old man shoved to ground by NY cops, bleeding from head & ear

Nordberg said:
He was fucking wrong. The guy had blood pouring out of his ear. The police at no point were appropriate. The old man walked up to them. The cop should have walked by. He pushed an old man. Do you think the cop was afraid? Was he threatened? No he was being a prick. He was there to strike out at the protesters. he got his chance and did not pass it up. It was a shameful power play against an old man. If he did not strike out, what dangerous act would the old man have done?
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The whole point is you dont know what a danger the old man could have been until it happened and then it's too late. Let him by? They are clearing the street. What might he do from behind? Old people can still kill you. Had this guy been a trump supporter you guys would be pointing out all the wrong he was doing. I saw him approach police. I saw him reach or poke toward one officer. He was push and fell. I fault the old dummy 100 percent. Having taken basic criminal justice only a fool would allow an angry human behind them. Just like only those ignorant of the dangers police face seem to have a problem with this.

Stop justifying the provocative and lawless actions of the old dummy.
 
Bigdog said:
There was nothing the cops could do but call the EMTs, which is what they did.
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Isn't that what the Russians did to their wounded in WWII? Let them lie?

I'm not against law enforcement, there are mostly good cops. But an old man is no threat to a cop in riot gear.
 
RB 60 said:
Isn't that what the Russians did to their wounded in WWII? Let them lie?

I'm not against law enforcement, there are mostly good cops. But an old man is no threat to a cop in riot gear.
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I don't know why you are still trying to justify the big man's attempt to forcefully plow thru the policeman who was a foot shorter than him?

Not touching him was the correct thing to do until the EMTs got there. Do you disagree?

I think the charges should be dropped against the cops in this specific incident.
 
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Bigdog said:
I don't know why you are still trying to justify the big man's attempt to forcefully plow thru the policeman who was a foot shorter than him?

Not touching him was the correct thing to do until the EMTs got there. Do you disagree?

I think the charges should be dropped against the cops in this specific incident.
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It will all come out at trial. The video will work against the police officer who shoved the old man hard enough that he fell backwards.
 
Geeko Sportivo said:
Oh, there is a lot more to it than just that one sided view of policing!

You can dance around the obvious with conjecture all you want, but ABUSE OF AUTHORITY- is simply that- ABUSE OF AUTHORITY!

Give the wrong person authority, a LOADED sidearm, a big stick, helmet, and body armor, and then walk a few steps- SEE IF YOU DON'T ALSO FEEL LIKE THE AUTHORITY GIVEN COULD BE USED TO CRACK SOME FUCKING HEADS, IF YOU WANTED TO!

The most important thing is the authority and who can be trusted with it.

It requires using discretion, restraint, a cool temper, controlling your emotions, putting your politics aside, and most certainly
your racial biases.

Because if that is not the case, everything in your post, DOESN'T MEAN DIDDLY DICK!

An authoritative trusted public servant is not out there to carry out his temper tantrums, or his emotional breakdowns or personal frustrations, or his racist biases, or feed his over-inflated ego, get even, or carry out his personal political interests.

And when that does become the case, then that is why people are going to take it to the streets.
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You got all that from the video? I saw the old man approach and then reach for (cant tell if there was contact) the officer. The officer pushed him. How is that abuse of power or authority? Because the guy was old? Because he lose his balance and fell?

Question if the old man didnt fall would you guys still feel it was abuse of power? As in was the shove abusive?
 
RB 60 said:
Isn't that what the Russians did to their wounded in WWII? Let them lie?

I'm not against law enforcement, there are mostly good cops. But an old man is no threat to a cop in riot gear.
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Until he gets behind you and produces a knife or gun. Sad that those who have zero clue to the evils and cunning of man, the world most dangerous animal, are the most vocal in condemnation of those who do.
 
Dutch Uncle said:
It will all come out at trial. The video will work against the police officer who shoved the old man hard enough that he fell backwards.
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The shove was not that hard. The 6ft 6 inch old fart lost his balance. The concrete did ALL the damage.
 
Dutch Uncle said:
It will all come out at trial. The video will work against the police officer who shoved the old man hard enough that he fell backwards.
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what should the cop have done? Stopped and talked? walked around him?
THEY WERE IN FORMATION -that's what they are TRAINED TO DO _CLEAR
 
Daddyo said:
You got all that from the video? I saw the old man approach and then reach for (cant tell if there was contact) the officer. The officer pushed him. How is that abuse of power or authority? Because the guy was old? Because he lose his balance and fell?

Question if the old man didnt fall would you guys still feel it was abuse of power? As in was the shove abusive?
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The man was trying to show the officer his parking ticket, reason why he was there, to pay it.

He was not even a part of the protest, he was just there at city hall to pay his fine.
 
Daddyo said:
You got all that from the video? I saw the old man approach and then reach for (cant tell if there was contact) the officer. The officer pushed him. How is that abuse of power or authority? Because the guy was old? Because he lose his balance and fell?

Question if the old man didnt fall would you guys still feel it was abuse of power? As in was the shove abusive?
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It wouldn't have been an issue if the old man didn't fall. The cop thought he was "tuff" by pushing the old man off his feet.
Which brings up the questions, how far should police be allowed to go when a citizen poses no threat? Do you want the
police to force their way against you when you're exercising a constitutional right? Would this cop have fired his weapon
on a store owner protecting his business because he saw him with a firearm outside his establishment?
This isn't the first time a cop has overreacted to a situation. Do you recall the cop shooting the "good guy with a gun"
who stopped the shootings in an Alabama mall a few years back?
Like I've said, I think protests are silly and violent protesters should be met with extreme prejudice. But seriously, how
much of a threat does an (obviously unarmed) old man alone pose to a line of police in riot gear? Myself, I would have
walked around him, it would have embarrassed him more by not engaging him. I don't know about you, but I sure as hell
don't want to live under a "police state," especially when exercising my constitutional rights. Sometimes makes me question
whether I would keep my weapon holstered (yep, I have a CCP) and hide like a petrified liberal, or pull it to protect myself
and fellow American citizens for fear of being shot by an over zealous cop.
 
Geeko Sportivo said:
The man was trying to show the officer his parking ticket, reason why he was there, to pay it.

He was not even a part of the protest, he was just there at city hall to pay his fine.
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Bullshit!

"75-year-old man who was shoved to the ground by police was an 'agitator trying to spark up crowd of protesters'"

"He said he was informed Martin Gugino was an 'agitator' who was asked to leave the area 'numerous times' "

https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/ar...ar-old-man-shoved-ground-police-agitator.html
 
Geeko Sportivo said:
The man was trying to show the officer his parking ticket, reason why he was there, to pay it.

He was not even a part of the protest, he was just there at city hall to pay his fine.
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Paying a ticket and just happened to be a professional agitator lol. Sell that bridge elsewhere.
 
RB 60 said:
It wouldn't have been an issue if the old man didn't fall. The cop thought he was "tuff" by pushing the old man off his feet.
Which brings up the questions, how far should police be allowed to go when a citizen poses no threat? Do you want the
police to force their way against you when you're exercising a constitutional right? Would this cop have fired his weapon
on a store owner protecting his business because he saw him with a firearm outside his establishment?
This isn't the first time a cop has overreacted to a situation. Do you recall the cop shooting the "good guy with a gun"
who stopped the shootings in an Alabama mall a few years back?
Like I've said, I think protests are silly and violent protesters should be met with extreme prejudice. But seriously, how
much of a threat does an (obviously unarmed) old man alone pose to a line of police in riot gear? Myself, I would have
walked around him, it would have embarrassed him more by not engaging him. I don't know about you, but I sure as hell
don't want to live under a "police state," especially when exercising my constitutional rights. Sometimes makes me question
whether I would keep my weapon holstered (yep, I have a CCP) and hide like a petrified liberal, or pull it to protect myself
and fellow American citizens for fear of being shot by an over zealous cop.
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He didnt push him hard. The old man just wasn't expecting it or he let himself go backward for the drama shot and lost his balance. It was not a hard shot.

Police dont know what's on your mind. So they dont know that he is just there to annoy them. "Obviously unarmed "? Was he naked? He could have had a knife and gun. How do they know he didnt have one? So don't say he wasn't a threat. That's only knowable today using hindsight AND while under zero stress of situation.

Cop firing on store owners by mistaken identity is a threat. I have had to sleep in my business twice now. Once for a hurricane and now this riot bullcrap. Dealt with dozens of different officers. All but one have been great. The one was a dick who had the balls to ask me rudely why I was carrying a sidearm. Like liberal stupid lol. I asked him if he realized that we just had a hurricane go by and I was preventing looting while they were unable to be dispatched (cops stop service when sustained winds hit 40mph). I told him about the attempt we phoned in earlier. His partner changed the subject asking me about the attempt we had and the partner was professional and polite. I was angered by this but I was armed and not dressed like security (actually looked like a thug with a vest and gun lol) so I understood why. I have added a security patch to the front and back of my vest since lol.

Gotta be careful for sure.
 
Daddyo said:
The shove was not that hard. The 6ft 6 inch old fart lost his balance. The concrete did ALL the damage.
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How many times do I have to say "It will all come out at trial" before people understand?
 
Daddyo said:
He didnt push him hard. The old man just wasn't expecting it or he let himself go backward for the drama shot and lost his balance. It was not a hard shot.

Police dont know what's on your mind. So they dont know that he is just there to annoy them. "Obviously unarmed "? Was he naked? He could have had a knife and gun. How do they know he didnt have one? So don't say he wasn't a threat. That's only knowable today using hindsight AND while under zero stress of situation.

Cop firing on store owners by mistaken identity is a threat. I have had to sleep in my business twice now. Once for a hurricane and now this riot bullcrap. Dealt with dozens of different officers. All but one have been great. The one was a dick who had the balls to ask me rudely why I was carrying a sidearm. Like liberal stupid lol. I asked him if he realized that we just had a hurricane go by and I was preventing looting while they were unable to be dispatched (cops stop service when sustained winds hit 40mph). I told him about the attempt we phoned in earlier. His partner changed the subject asking me about the attempt we had and the partner was professional and polite. I was angered by this but I was armed and not dressed like security (actually looked like a thug with a vest and gun lol) so I understood why. I have added a security patch to the front and back of my vest since lol.

Gotta be careful for sure.
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Drama shot? Seriously? Like he knew he was being videoed?

Get real! The old guy was not armed, obviously outnumbered and posed no threat to a line of cops in riot gear.

I'd say you just sank your argument defending this "tuff guy" cop.
 
Matt Dillon said:
It turns out that 75 year old man is a professional agitator affiliated with ANTIFA.

https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/ar...ar-old-man-shoved-ground-police-agitator.html
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The article doesn't mention "ANTIFA". Are you lying? High on meth and seeing things that aren't there?

Thanks for the link. Obviously Buffalo never heard of the Nuremberg Trials: "'Fifty-seven resigned in disgust because of the treatment of two of their members, who were simply executing orders,' PBA president John Evans said."

BTW, Mayor Brown has had to backpedal before on his statements: https://buffalonews.com/2020/06/05/...ogizes-for-saying-protester-tripped-and-fell/
The spokesman for Mayor Byron W. Brown, the Buffalo Police Department and other city agencies apologized Friday for a statement he emailed to media saying that a protester who was pushed to the ground as police were clearing the front of City Hall after curfew "tripped and fell" during a "skirmish involving protesters."

Additionally, the old man, Martin Gugino, wasn't a "professional agitator affiliated with ANTIFA". "Professional means "getting paid". He's retired and peace activist which is both legal and supportive of the community.

https://buffalonews.com/2020/06/05/...lice-is-longtime-peace-activist-from-amherst/
The protester who was pushed to the ground by Buffalo police Thursday night in front of City Hall, in a video seen by more than 58 million people, is a longtime peace activist from Amherst.

Martin Gugino, 75, was in serious but stable condition at Erie County Medical Center as of Thursday night, according to police.

"He’s a gentle person who really believes that he must stand up for what he thinks is right," said his friend Terrence Bisson, who has worked with Gugino on Latin American issues through the Western New York Peace Center.

"That’s why he went to the demonstration. He would never resist physically any kind of orders," Bisson said. "He’s a bit frail, not because of his age. He has some health problems."
 
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