A historic disaster is coming for the US from the tax bill

ThatOwlWoman said:
Another reason why I'd like to see our public education system promote tradecraft and construction careers with hands-on training. One thing I like about the University and community colleges up here is they offer degree programs in the trades. Where we used to live (STL), that type of education was available mainly at very-overpriced private schools like ITT and Sanford Brown. Yeah, the person might get training but they also left with a huge load of debt, almost equivalent to a four-year degree at a state university!

$50K/year isn't bad, if your area has a lower cost-of-living.
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I didn't agree with Sanders' position on 'free college for all'. I would rather see an equal amount of money for trade schools, which offers a much better outcome for future employment.
 
Thumper said:
Meh. Kinda.

For every one manual manufacturing job created three support jobs are needed. For every piece of automation that is created 7 support jobs are created.

Typical yearly wage of the manual support job is 25 to 30k typical hourly wage of the support jobs for automation is 50 to 55 k

Problem is we are way behind on people that can fill these support and construction jobs. 95 percent of the machinery we use was produced in the UK. So those support jobs are paying into their economy not ours.

As for a premium wage.

Your typical forklift operator here makes 12 to 15 an hour. With this company you start out at 18. Mechanics actually make a little less. But they are maintainer operators. So the job is easier. A typical operator would make 15 to 18 and a machine repair mechanic would make 28 to 30. Our mechanics make 24.

I would make about the same as I would anywhere else here as a millwright. But because we are not union I was able to bargain with the company individually.
Once you figure in my OT the only two people that make more than me in the plant is the plant manager and the superintendant. But unlike other places I act as a millwright electrician and machinist. Hell last night I filled in for a spray operator who called in.
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read up... http://www.worldstopexports.com/top-industrial-robots-exporters/
 
Covfefe said:
Seriously, do you talk like this around your mother? I am asking you honestly, because if my children had, they would have gone to a therapist. What normal person thinks in these terms?
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You had fuck all to say when Billy Barfly and Grind were saying the same shit about my mother, fucking hypocrite!!
 
Althea said:
Wow...you Limeys really are behind the rest of the world. Next time, read more than the title of your articles. Start here, and continue:
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I read that you stupid prat, I also read the whole article which you obviously never did!! You have a habit of just cherry picking something from a long article, you have form!

The repeal of Glass-Steagall may not have caused the crisis — but its repeal was a factor that made it much worse. And it was a continuum of the radical deregulation movement. This philosophy incorrectly held that banks could regulate themselves, that government had no place in overseeing finance and that the free market works best when left alone. This belief system manifested itself in damaging ways, including eliminating regulation and oversight on derivatives, allowing exemptions for excess leverage rules for a handful of players and creating dangerous legislation. As the events of 2007 to 2009 have revealed, this erroneous belief system was a major factor leading to the credit boom and bust, as well as the financial collapse.
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After the repeal, banks merged into more complex and more leveraged institutions. ● These banks, which were customers of nonbank firms such as AIG, Bear Stearns and Lehman Brothers, in turn contributed to these firms bulking up their subprime holdings as well. This turned out to be speculative and dangerous. So we can say that Glass-Steagall’s repeal allowed the credit bubble to inflate much larger. It allowed banks to be more complex and difficult to manage. When it all came down, the crisis was broader, deeper and more dangerous than it would have been otherwise. Glass-Steagall’s repeal, after 25 years and $300 million worth of lobbying efforts, culminated decades of deregulation.

Newfangled derivatives? No oversight, reporting or reserves necessary, courtesy of the Commodities Futures Modernization Act of 2000. Subprime-lend-to-sell-to-securitizers business model? Those are the financial innovators! At least, that is what Greenspan called them, and why he refused to oversee them as Fed chairman. Rules on SEC leverage? Let’s create a special exemption from the law for just five investment banks. Of course “reputational risk” would serve as a deterrent to poor decision making! No bank would ever behave so recklessly as to put their own hard-won status on the line — or its very existence.

How’d that idea work out?

With Glass-Steagall, there would not, could not, have been a Citi/Travelers merger, and competitors would not, could not have bulked up the way they did. Major money center banks most likely would have been smaller, more manageable, more easily wound down. Arguably, too big to fail might not have been the rule, and bailouts might not have been necessary. This is, of course, mere supposition. What we should be discussing is the corrupting influence of crony capitalism and radical deregulation. Instead, we find ourselves forced to defend capitalism and free markets. We should be finding ways to definancialize the U.S. economy and reduce bankers’ influence.
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Shape Shifter said:
I read that you stupid prat, I also read the whole article which you obviously never did!! You have a habit of just cherry picking something from a long article, you have form!
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Sorry...that article doesn't make your case. Saying that GLB started a trend toward deregulation, means that GLB caused the crash is nonsense. Of course, you ignore what I posted about private lending that was not affected by GLB
 
katzgar said:
you russian bots are getting more and more desperate
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yea, that ole Russian collusion thing is coming any day now huh? :rofl2:
12 months of non-stop Russian collusion theory and so far....NOTHING

great use of resources there ya loon

Tax reform is here, and THE WALL is next,
deal with it
 
ThatOwlWoman said:
View attachment 5266
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20h110.jpg
 
ThatOwlWoman said:
Another reason why I'd like to see our public education system promote tradecraft and construction careers with hands-on training. One thing I like about the University and community colleges up here is they offer degree programs in the trades. Where we used to live (STL), that type of education was available mainly at very-overpriced private schools like ITT and Sanford Brown. Yeah, the person might get training but they also left with a huge load of debt, almost equivalent to a four-year degree at a state university!

$50K/year isn't bad, if your area has a lower cost-of-living.
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I am not a fan of the public education system period. Trade schools I like less than universities.

I've never worked with a college educated tradesmen that was worth the paper his diploma was written on.

Maybe they are good things to have in urban centers. But honestly my younger daughter was a better fitter when she was 9 (she's 18 now) than the guys I ran into rig welding who were straight out of school.

Anyway. One of our biggest problems is our inability to retrain. And it's perpetuated by the public education system. And the idea that others need to do for us instead of doing for ourselves.
 
katzgar said:
read up... http://www.worldstopexports.com/top-industrial-robots-exporters/
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People think automation and they think welding robots and what not. It also should be noted that countries with a third of our population are exporting ten times the robotics. The link doesn't talk about conveyance or the million and one other things relating to automation.

My plant has several miles of conveyer belt and air beds. Every inch of it (other than the six nine foot magnetic transfer dropouts that I built) was produced in western Europe.

Five hundred million dollars worth of automation make up my plant. Not one piece (other than some small components) was made here even though many meet the technical definition of robot.
 
Thumper said:
People think automation and they think welding robots and what not. It also should be noted that countries with a third of our population are exporting ten times the robotics. The link doesn't talk about conveyance or the million and one other things relating to automation.

My plant has several miles of conveyer belt and air beds. Every inch of it (other than the six nine foot magnetic transfer dropouts that I built) was produced in western Europe.

Fifty million dollars worth of automation make up my plant. Not one piece (other than some small components) was made here even though many meet the technical definition of robot.
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See the edit. Brain was moving slower than my fingers.
 
Getin the ring said:
yea, that ole Russian collusion thing is coming any day now huh? :rofl2:
12 months of non-stop Russian collusion theory and so far....NOTHING

great use of resources there ya loon

Tax reform is here, and THE WALL is next,
deal with it
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nothing? you bots are idiots, time to reprogram
 
anatta said:
lets see. you put everyone on ignore that isn't a progressive Bernie-bot,and you argue with mods.

Like I was told one time: if you can't get along with everyone else,chances are it's you -not them
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No, actually, that's not why I put people on ignore; and yes, if a mod behaves badly, they aren't exempt from crtiticism.

You're an idiot. If you can't get along with everyone else, it's you.
 
Thumper said:
If you don't see it then you don't understand anything about quality control and shipping costs.
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Hah!!! Really? So why is everything being manufactured overseas...with materials shipped there first...and shipped back? It isn't about saving on taxes. It's cheap labor, no healthcare for employees, and no environmental concerns.

If you don't see that, then you don't understand basic math.

So how is a tax reduction going to make up for all of those savings overseas?
 
Thumper said:
I am not a fan of the public education system period. Trade schools I like less than universities.

I've never worked with a college educated tradesmen that was worth the paper his diploma was written on.

Maybe they are good things to have in urban centers. But honestly my younger daughter was a better fitter when she was 9 (she's 18 now) than the guys I ran into rig welding who were straight out of school.

Anyway. One of our biggest problems is our inability to retrain. And it's perpetuated by the public education system. And the idea that others need to do for us instead of doing for ourselves.
Click to expand...
She was born with the gift?
 
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