Are you a theist or an atheist?

Yakuda said:
Why would people be scared of atheists?
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I don't know. Just look at 'em though. You say you're an atheist and Cypress jumps all over you to mischaraterize you and paint you in the worst possible light (comparing us to Pol Pot and Stalin). Or they outright just call it all "bullshit" as another poster did.

And the funny thing is, none of them actually seem to understand what atheism actually is.

It's all fear based for them. Cypress, especially. He's afraid God will be offended if he says he's an atheist so he claims to be an agnostic (so secular folks will think he's super smart) but he's mainly an apologist for religion and belief in the supernatural.
 
Frank Apisa said:
You sound to me like someone scared of saying, "I do not know" when you do not know. You want to make blind guesses.

What frightens you so much about acknowledging the stuff you do not know?




You say I am wrong. So let me ask you: Do you believe that there are no gods...or that it is more likely that there are no gods than that there is one?

It is a YES or NO question.

So...what is your answer?
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I've already explained this on countless other threads. You wouldn't understand it. Cypress doesn't, you can ask him for his fucked up version of it. That should be funny to read.
 
Cypress said:
There is always substantial risk to human liberty when theocrats or atheists achieve control of national government.

The atheists proved to be as dogmatic and oppressive as the theocrats are in enforcing their belief system. The data is ubiquitous and conclusive: 18th century revolutionary France, Soviet Union, Maoist China, Khmer Rouge Cambodia, Stalinist North Korea.
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Absolutely!

Both theists and atheists are ruled by their "beliefs"...which is to say, they are ruled by their blind guesses. And both, as you noted, are destructive in so doing.
 
LiAlSi2O6 said:
That's the stuff. Fear!



Oh jeeez now we have to have a Thumper tell us of all the evils of atheism. Ignoring for the moment the VAST number of deaths laid at the feet of relgion:

Face it, humans are dicks to each other regardless of philosophy.

It's when one side demonizes the other side (like you do with atheists) that the problems begin. Honestly why can't you listen to actual atheists without mischaracterizing their positions? Is it because you fear atheism so much?

I know you want to play "agnostic" so no one will think you are dumb or something, but gimme a break, you don't even understand agnosticism, let alone atheism, yet here you are as usual painting atheists in the ABSOLUTE WORST LIGHT POSSIBLE.

Ironic because you always claim people paint religion in the worst possible light. Yet that is literally all you ever do to atheists.

It seems your hypocrisy knows absolutely no bottom.
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Bullshit!
 
Yakuda said:
What middle way is there? Either God exists or he doesnt.
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It is not about whether at least one god exists or not.

It is about whether a human KNOWS whether at least one god exists or not.

Some of us acknowledge that we do not KNOW...and refuse to make a blind guess.

Theists and atheist get their kicks mocking that.

Hey, no problem. Some of the greatest minds of humanity have been agnostics.
 
Frank Apisa said:
It is not about whether at least one god exists or not.

It is about whether a human KNOWS whether at least one god exists or not.

Some of us acknowledge that we do not KNOW...and refuse to make a blind guess.

Theists and atheist get their kicks mocking that.

Hey, no problem. Some of the greatest minds of humanity have been agnostics.
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blind guess blind guess blind guess
 
LiAlSi2O6 said:
I've already explained this on countless other threads. You wouldn't understand it. Cypress doesn't, you can ask him for his fucked up version of it. That should be funny to read.
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So...you are so frightened you cannot even answer a one word question.

Okay.

I appreciate the laugh.
 
Frank Apisa said:
You sound to me like someone scared of saying, "I do not know" when you do not know. You want to make blind guesses.

What frightens you so much about acknowledging the stuff you do not know?




You say I am wrong. So let me ask you: Do you believe that there are no gods...or that it is more likely that there are no gods than that there is one?

It is a YES or NO question.

So...what is your answer?
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Yawn. I'll explain it to you so you will be able to better mischaracterize my position because you don't understand it:

I, like any good scientist, start from the "null hypothesis" of "No God" and then I look around for evidence to reject that hypothesis. (This is how the drugs you take from the pharmacy are tested...they start with the null hypothesis of "no effect" and then test against that. In other words you use this reasoning all the time, every day).

I fail to see sufficient evidence to justify rejecting the null hypothesis. I could, of course, be wrong. There is error aplenty and I am imperfect. If I find new evidence I can always reassess.

So I simply fail to believe in God....just like you "fail to believe in invisible gnomes who live in your refrigerator".
 
LiAlSi2O6 said:
Yawn. I'll explain it to you so you will be able to better mischaracterize my position because you don't understand it:

I, like any good scientist, start from the "null hypothesis" of "No God" and then I look around for evidence to reject that hypothesis. (This is how the drugs you take from the pharmacy are tested...they start with the null hypothesis of "no effect" and then test against that. In other words you use this reasoning all the time, every day).

I fail to see sufficient evidence to justify rejecting the null hypothesis. I could, of course, be wrong. There is error aplenty and I am imperfect. If I find new evidence I can always reassess.

So I simply fail to believe in God....just like you "fail to believe in invisible gnomes who live in your refrigerator".
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The null hypothesis on this question resolves into a blind guess...motivated by the arbitrary of defining the null hypothesis as "there are no gods."

Why not, "There are no "no gods?" Why not, there is no chance that no gods exist...which essentially is the rationalization behind the theist's blind guess that at least one god has to exist.

Of course you can be wrong...but you want to use atheist as a self-descriptor, so "believe" (make the blind guess) that no gods exist...OR...that it is more likely that no gods exist.
 
Frank Apisa said:
The null hypothesis on this question resolves into a blind guess
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Honest question: there are invisible gnomes which live in your refrigerator. Do you believe in them? If not, why not? (Hopefully you see the point, but I'll make it more direct: YOU DON'T BELIEVE in invisible gnomes living in your refrigerator for the same reason I fail to believe in God...you see zero evidence of them and no need to think they exist.

...motivated by the arbitrary of defining the null hypothesis as "there are no gods."
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So you believe in all sorts of things without evidence just because someone once said they existed? Interesting approach to life.

Of course you can be wrong...but you want to use atheist as a self-descriptor, so "believe" (make the blind guess) that no gods exist...OR...that it is more likely that no gods exist.
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Like I said, you wouldn't understand it. (Except insofar as you do this literally every single day without even thinking about it...)
 
LiAlSi2O6 said:
Yawn. I'll explain it to you so you will be able to better mischaracterize my position because you don't understand it:

I, like any good scientist, start from the "null hypothesis" of "No God" and then I look around for evidence to reject that hypothesis. (This is how the drugs you take from the pharmacy are tested...they start with the null hypothesis of "no effect" and then test against that. In other words you use this reasoning all the time, every day).

I fail to see sufficient evidence to justify rejecting the null hypothesis. I could, of course, be wrong. There is error aplenty and I am imperfect. If I find new evidence I can always reassess.

So I simply fail to believe in God....just like you "fail to believe in invisible gnomes who live in your refrigerator".
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It is NOT the failure to "believe" that there is at least one god that is the predicate for iyour use of the descriptor atheist. The reason you use atheist is because you "believe" there are no gods...or "believe" it is more likely that there are no gods than that there is at least one.

There is no reason to use the descriptor atheist simply because you lack a belief (guess) that at least one god exists. Unless you do it because SOME reference books "define" it that way...and you feel that obligates you to accept that "definition."
 
Frank Apisa said:
It is NOT the failure to "believe" that there is at least one god that is the predicate for iyour use of the descriptor atheist. The reason you use atheist is because you "believe" there are no gods...or "believe" it is more likely that there are no gods than that there is at least one.

There is no reason to use the descriptor atheist simply because you lack a belief (guess) that at least one god exists. Unless you do it because SOME reference books "define" it that way...and you feel that obligates you to accept that "definition."
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Why on earth is it SO HARD to listen to someone else tell you about their position? Is it solely because you are unable to understand it or is there something about their position that threatens your beliefs? Either way you should really give it a go to actually LISTEN to what others say about their lives.
 
LiAlSi2O6 said:
Why on earth is it SO HARD to listen to someone else tell you about their position?
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It isn't. I am listening to every word you write.



Is it solely because you are unable to understand it or is there something about their position that threatens your beliefs?
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I do not do "believing." If I am making a guess...I acknowledge that I am making a guess...I do not call it a "belief."

If I am making an estimate...I acknowledge that I am making an estimate...I do not call it a "belief."

If I am hypothesizing on a topic...I acknowledge that I am hypothesizing...I do not call it a "belief."

You are not threatening any of my guesses, estimates, or hypotheses.


Either way you should really give it a go to actually LISTEN to what others say about their lives.
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I am listening. Tell me about your other blind guesses.
 
Frank Apisa said:
It isn't. I am listening to every word you write.





I do not do "believing." If I am making a guess...I acknowledge that I am making a guess...I do not call it a "belief."

If I am making an estimate...I acknowledge that I am making an estimate...I do not call it a "belief."

If I am hypothesizing on a topic...I acknowledge that I am hypothesizing...I do not call it a "belief."

You are not threatening any of my guesses, estimates, or hypotheses.




I am listening. Tell me about your other blind guesses.
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So you won't answer my question about the gnomes in your fridge. I guess, as per usual, you guys don't have to answer any questions but god help those of us who don't answer YOUR questions.

Got it. Usual.
 
LiAlSi2O6 said:
So you won't answer my question about the gnomes in your fridge. I guess, as per usual, you guys don't have to answer any questions but god help those of us who don't answer YOUR questions.

Got it. Usual.
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There are no invisible gnomes in my refrigerator that I know of. If they are invisible, I doubt I would be able to know. My guess would be that there are none.

I hope that answers your question, brave Mr. Si206.
 
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