Average tax refund down 17 percent, IRS reports

Callinectes Ocasio-Cortez said:
Stop the semantics idiot. When do you report your income to the fucking IRS, and when do you get your precious refund?
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Your "income" is reported to the IRS year round, and is taxes year round.

April is the deadline to file your return on the previous calendar year's income.

You are trying to shift that window because that 12-month window shows less revenue collected than the previous 12 month window, and thus, ruining the central fundamental belief of yours that tax cuts pay for themselves.
 
Callinectes Ocasio-Cortez said:
You want empirical evidence that I won’t lose any sleep over your mouth diarrhea? Sorry, no can do
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Here's where we are at:

You made wild claims/predictions/promises/whatever the fuck you want to call them of your tax policy. None of which actually came to fruition. Then the central premise of your fundamental economic belief system, that cutting taxes generates increased economic activity that results in more revenues, was disproved by 2018 revenues being 2% off 2017 revenues. That is the first time since the Great Recession that revenues didn't exceed the prior year's, and the sixth time it has happened this century (all under Conservative Presidents, BTW). So since your fundamental economic belief is wrong, that casts doubt on the rest of your belief system. It's like pulling at a thread and watching the whole sweater unravel.

Since you were wrong about increased economic activity, what other core fundamental beliefs of yours are wrong? Probably all of them.

Your persona is losing steam here...it might be time for you to switch IDs.
 
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Callinectes Ocasio-Cortez said:
When do you file your tax return? December or April?
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Depends on a number of factors, including when I get data from my brokers and whether I expect a refund or not. But the point is that the taxes I owe are based on my calendar-year earnings. If I win $100 million on January 1, 2019, it doesn't make a damned bit of difference when it comes to what I owe on my 2018 taxes. So, when analyzing the impact of a tax change on revenues, you want to look not at government fiscal years, but on the relevant time period for the effective date of the tax change.... which, in the case of this change to individual taxes, was the calendar year.

Either way I win the point.
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Clearly not. Your argument was based on an obviously incorrect assertion and I corrected you. Now you know better. You're welcome.
 
LV426 said:
You are taxed year round.
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I think this may be the only thing we agree on
The deadline to file your previous calendar year's return is in April, but that's a return on the previous calendar year's taxes.
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Whatever, it makes no difference to me
Also, the government's fiscal year starts October 1st, not April 1st.
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Excellent point! I recall when I was in the military, the joint chiefs of staff would sit down together with H&R Block to do their 1040's for each branch...oh, wait a second, that never happened, BECAUSE THE GOVERNMENT DOESN'T PAY TAXES, IT CONSUMES THEM! Which reinforces a point I made before, the fiscal year is arbitrary in the private sector, but the overwhelming majority use April because of royal decree. The government uses October so congress can see how much loot they took in April, and develop budgets so they can split up the booty in October

Face it...your Russia Tax Cut was just bad policy.
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It worked for me(still don't know what it did for russia though)You say it didn't work for you. That sounds anecdotal to me, do you have any empirical evidence?
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Oneuli said:
Depends on a number of factors, including when I get data from my brokers and whether I expect a refund or not. But the point is that the taxes I owe are based on my calendar-year earnings. If I win $100 million on January 1, 2019, it doesn't make a damned bit of difference when it comes to what I owe on my 2018 taxes. So, when analyzing the impact of a tax change on revenues, you want to look not at government fiscal years, but on the relevant time period for the effective date of the tax change.... which, in the case of this change to individual taxes, was the calendar year.
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:palm:Are you or are you not reporting your income on April 15th? It's not a big deal, most people do. Many corporations and even small companies file quarterly, the IRS has dozens of ways to take your money that they will be glad to share with you. YOU deal with the calendar year, THEY use the fiscal year, it's not that difficult a concept

Clearly not. Your argument was based on an obviously incorrect assertion and I corrected you. Now you know better. You're welcome.
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No, my argument was that if you use the calendar year to determine revenue, revenue decreases, you weep for the future of the government, I laugh my ass off and throw a party. The government determines revenue based on the fiscal year, and reports record breaking revenue each year, you don't even acknowledge that such a thing could be possible, and I rage against the machine. Now you know better. You're welcome.
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Callinectes Ocasio-Cortez said:
:palm:Are you or are you not reporting your income on April 15th?
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No, I'm not. What made you imagine I was? If I'm expecting a refund, it would be silly for me to wait so long to file my 2018 taxes, since the time-value of money rewards me the sooner I get my tax form in and the sooner the refund arrives. If I expected a refund and had all my tax forms January 1, that's when I should file. The longer I wait, the worse for me. It's like giving the government an interest-free loan.

Well, now you know. I'm sorry you were so ignorant of how taxes work, but I'm pleased to have relieved you of some small part of that ignorance.
 
Callinectes Ocasio-Cortez said:
Excellent point! I recall when I was in the military, the joint chiefs of staff would sit down together with H&R Block to do their 1040's for each branch...oh, wait a second, that never happened, BECAUSE THE GOVERNMENT DOESN'T PAY TAXES, IT CONSUMES THEM! Which reinforces a point I made before, the fiscal year is arbitrary in the private sector, but the overwhelming majority use April because of royal decree. The government uses October so congress can see how much loot they took in April, and develop budgets so they can split up the booty in October
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So before, your argument was that it was unfair to total up and compare 2018 revenues vs. 2017 because when you do it according to the calendar year, which is when the Russia Tax Cut started, it shows less revenue collected over the same 12 month period as the year before, and that undermines your chief fundamental belief that cutting taxes leads to increased revenues from increased "economic activity".

Bringing up that the federal government's FY begins in October just shows how stupid your point is, and you can't stand that.
 
Wolverine said:
I defeated this line of B.S in my first response, you need a new hobby!
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You didn't defeat shit. You just want to move the bar because when you compare the 2018 Russia Tax Cut revenues to the 2017 pre-Russia Tax Cut revenues, you find 2018 revenues are 2% less than 2017.
 
Callinectes Ocasio-Cortez said:
No, my argument was that if you use the calendar year to determine revenue, revenue decreases, you weep for the future of the government, I laugh my ass off and throw a party.
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Your Russia Tax Cut started January 1st, 2018.

So it had a full calendar year to produce more revenues than the year before.

It didn't.
 
Callinectes Ocasio-Cortez said:
The government determines revenue based on the fiscal year, and reports record breaking revenue each year, you don't even acknowledge that such a thing could be possible, and I rage against the machine. Now you know better. You're welcome.
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You pay taxes based on the calendar year. Your tax cut started the calendar year, not the FY. So it's appropriate to compare 12 months of the Russia Tax Cut to the immediately preceding 12 months. When we do that, we see revenue down 2%.

Now what's happening is that you keep moving the bar on your defense of the Russia Tax Cut, but you can't even do that effectively because your Russia Tax Cut started on Jan 1, not April 1 or October 1.
 
LV426 said:
You didn't defeat shit. You just want to move the bar because when you compare the 2018 Russia Tax Cut revenues to the 2017 pre-Russia Tax Cut revenues, you find 2018 revenues are 2% less than 2017.
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You are repeating the same wrong things every time because you got conned by Hillbot!
 
LV426 said:
You pay taxes based on the calendar year. Your tax cut started the calendar year, not the FY. So it's appropriate to compare 12 months of the Russia Tax Cut to the immediately preceding 12 months. When we do that, we see revenue down 2%.

Now what's happening is that you keep moving the bar on your defense of the Russia Tax Cut, but you can't even do that effectively because your Russia Tax Cut started on Jan 1, not April 1 or October 1.
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MAKES NO FUCKING DIFFERENCE!!! MY FUCKING TAX BRACKET WAS LOWER. MY PERSONAL EXEMPTION WAS DOUBLED!!! I PAID LESS TAXES FOR 2017 AND I’M LOOKING FORWARD TO AN EVEN BETTER 2018!!! THE FUCKING CHERRY ON TOP IS THAT ACCORDING TO YOUR METHOD, THE FUCKING GOVERNMENT TOOK IN 2% LESS AND THAT MAKES ME HAPPY!! DID YOU WANT TO MAKE ME HAPPY?? OH, ALMOST FORGOT THE BONUS! YOUR REFUND WAS LOWER!!(BTW, where do you think that 2% went? Russia?)
 
Callinectes Ocasio-Cortez said:
MAKES NO FUCKING DIFFERENCE!!! MY FUCKING TAX BRACKET WAS LOWER. MY PERSONAL EXEMPTION WAS DOUBLED!!! I PAID LESS TAXES FOR 2017 AND I’M LOOKING FORWARD TO AN EVEN BETTER 2018!!! THE FUCKING CHERRY ON TOP IS THAT ACCORDING TO YOUR METHOD, THE FUCKING GOVERNMENT TOOK IN 2% LESS AND THAT MAKES ME HAPPY!! DID YOU WANT TO MAKE ME HAPPY?? OH, ALMOST FORGOT THE BONUS! YOUR REFUND WAS LOWER!!(BTW, where do you think that 2% went? Russia?)
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Makes a huge difference when comparing revenue year-over-year.

The Russia Tax Cut started January 1st, 2018.

So it's wholly appropriate to compare 2017 and 2018 Jan-Dec revenues, and you haven't built a compelling case for why it isn't.

The government taking in 2% less revenue disproves your argument that cutting taxes generates "economic activity" that results in more revenues.
 
LV426 said:
Your Russia Tax Cut started January 1st, 2018.

So it had a full calendar year to produce more revenues than the year before.

It didn't.
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Lol, the last thing on my agenda is to produce more revenue for the fucking government!!!!
 
Callinectes Ocasio-Cortez said:
Lol, the last thing on my agenda is to produce more revenue for the fucking government!!!!
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Producing less revenues undermines your argument that cutting taxes leads to increased "economic activity" that would generate more revenues.

So the fundamental lynchpin of your fiscal and economic belief system is a load of horseshit.

And you know it.
 
Oneuli said:
No, I'm not. What made you imagine I was? If I'm expecting a refund, it would be silly for me to wait so long to file my 2018 taxes, since the time-value of money rewards me the sooner I get my tax form in and the sooner the refund arrives. If I expected a refund and had all my tax forms January 1, that's when I should file. The longer I wait, the worse for me. It's like giving the government an interest-free loan.

Well, now you know. I'm sorry you were so ignorant of how taxes work, but I'm pleased to have relieved you of some small part of that ignorance.
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Oh come on, everyone knows you can file when you have all your paper work together, I'm sitting on mine right now. I just like to wait until 11:59PM on April 15th to hit the send button
 
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