Bush and the US economy

Darla said:
Clinton is DLC, which you never get, but I do.

You think the government has a choice now? You see the house of cards falling down don’t you? They have to bail it out. The only thing keeping our service economy going has been consumer spending, financed in large part by home values. You know it, I know it, and the government knows it. You are talking avoiding recession, but the fact is, we’d get off easy if a recession is the only price we pay. Take a look at the income inequality gap, and you start to understand it’s not the only price we’re going to pay, and very little of this happened by chance.
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The problem is can we afford to bail ourselves out this time ?

In a few years "borrowed" SS money will have to be repaid from general funds.
9+ trillion in debt.
Personal debt pretty much at record levels.
The war cost...
Dollar dropping and inflatation expected to jump up rapidly.


GRIM :blowup:
 
Cypress said:
For years, who has been saying that we need to reign in and regulate predatory lending practices? Liberals? Or conservatives?
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Both, I posted a link with an article talking about the R and D Senators who were attempting to do just that. The article was written in April of 2001.

Many of these people saw the writing on the wall, it doesn't take special "liberal" powers to know that housing is too important to mess with.

The problem was that both sides got TONS of cash from the lenders, and it seems more can be bought than will do the right thing.
 
Damocles said:
Both, I posted a link with an article talking about the R and D Senators who were attempting to do just that. The article was written in April of 2001.
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So, your position is that the republicans haven't been pro-"free market", and about protecting the interests of banks and financial institutions? That they've been as aggresive as liberal Dems on predatory lending practices?
 
Damocles said:
Both, I posted a link with an article talking about the R and D Senators who were attempting to do just that. The article was written in April of 2001.

Many of these people saw the writing on the wall, it doesn't take special "liberal" powers to know that housing is too important to mess with.
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And which party controlled Congress in 2001 ?
 
Cypress said:
So, your position is that the republicans haven't been pro-"free market", and about protecting the interests of banks and financial institutions? That they've been as aggresive as liberal Dems on predatory lending practices?
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A number of them have. So your position is that Clinton didn't push to strengthen the CRA and thus create an environment where these loans became more than just possible, but promoted by the Government?

You are attempting a strawman here.
 
Damo, if you want to think that conservative republicans, in general, are as diligent about consumer protection as liberals generally are, that's fine with me.

I disagree. But, its not worth arguing about. This board is replete with examples of republicans mocking regulation, and crowing about turning the free markets loose.
 
Cypress said:
Damo, if you want to think that conservative republicans, in general, are as diligent about consumer protection as liberals generally are, that's fine with me.

I disagree. But, its not worth arguing about. This board is replete with examples of republicans mocking regulation, and crowing about turning the free markets loose.
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They don't have to be "as aggressive" in every single thing. They certainly saw this bubble about to burst and began trying to do something about it. Too late, IMO. They had already sold their souls to the "more Americans own homes than ever before" demon that began in "wonderful" Clinton years. The idea that bubbles can't be created in such "wonderful" times denies the very definition of bubbles.
 
Superfreak said:
Yes, I understand that Bill Clinton was a moderate/centrist dem. But I will ask you the same question I asked Desh.... Did the "progressive" Dems or any dems for that matter do anything to stop these practices?
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DLC is not centrist Dem…that’s poopaganda. DLC is a subsidiary of big business.

Sounds like such an easy question doesn’t it SF? But in order to answer it I’d have to do a lot of research, because the fact is I don’t know and neither do you buddy. While your party had full control of our government, in case you didn’t hear? They brought shit to the floor, killed more bills in committee than they voted on, and kept everything in the dark.

Maybe not, but I don’t know, and more to the point, neither do you. It’s something I’d be interested in checking into though, and if think of it outside of work, I will.
 
The statute of limitations on blaming clinton has expired. Bush has been in office for seven years.

Former presidents always leave problems and issues that the next president has to deal with. BushCo. and the GOP congress had years of warnings of what was coming down the pike. They twiddled their thumbs.

Clinton inherited many problems from Reagan and Poppy. And he fixed, or put us back on the right track, with regard to those problems. I don't ever recall democrats in clinton's second term, pointing the finger backward in history to blame the state of the economy or national policy on Reagan. Cause Clinton went about fixing the worst of the damage.
 
Victory for Darla!

I've closed down another thread filled with yammering men. Two posts!

They're afraid of me! I am almost an RJS level poster!
 
Cypress said:
The statute of limitations on blaming clinton has expired. Bush has been in office for seven years.

Former presidents always leave problems and issues that the next president has to deal with. BushCo. and the GOP congress had years of warnings of what was coming down the pike. They twiddled their thumbs.

Clinton inherited many problems from Reagan and Poppy. And he fixed, or put us back on the right track, with regard to those problems. I don't ever recall democrats in clinton's second term, pointing the finger backward in history to blame the state of the economy or national policy on Reagan. Cause Clinton went about fixing the worst of the damage.
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This is ridiculous. In my link I post a story of people trying to fix this problem practices that began because of changes to the CRA law that Clinton pushed for in 1995, in April of 2001. Whose problem was it at that time?

That it continued, definitely is the fault of those in office, of both parties. Not one law was attempted, or voted on that would change this practice, or even run on when the Ds took control of both houses. Pretending, as I said before, that it was good magic when "more people were in houses" when Clinton was in office, but magically became bad magic performed by an evil wizard when a new President continued the same practice is plain political blinders. This is one of the weakest arguments I have ever seen when presented with the story I gave earlier. Attempting to make everything that Clinton ever did perfect is pretense of as high an order as I have seen from those who attempt to make us believe that WMD really were in Iraq but were moved to Syria.
 
Desh said:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Community_Reinvestment_Act


Hmmm it looks like it was changed in 2005 to free things up.
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Only after 2004 when the FDIC proposed rules to weaken enforcement. In 2005 it was returned to the same rules as in 1995. It is simply the truth that this particular thing helped people get into these loans and was promoted by both parties for a long time. While some of both side saw through it to the future problems and tried to change it, the rest let it all go. It felt and looked to good to say things like, "More people own houses than ever before!"

Again I note that not one law was proposed, rejected, or run on, to change these practices.
 
Damocles said:
Only after 2004 when the FDIC proposed rules to weaken enforcement. In 2005 it was returned to the same rules as in 1995. It is simply the truth that this particular thing helped people get into these loans and was promoted by both parties for a long time. While some of both side saw through it to the future problems and tried to change it, the rest let it all go. It felt and looked to good to say things like, "More people own houses than ever before!"

Again I note that not one law was proposed, rejected, or run on, to change these practices.
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Gee I wonder why the Dem led house hasn't done anything?

I also wonder why they continue to allow the credit card industry to charge consumers 20%+ ? Why not protect the consumer and simply impose tighter credit standards here as well so that people do not get tempted to live beyond their means and end up burying themselves in debt?
 
Gee I wonder why the Dem led house hasn't done anything?
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ROFLMAO

all the parts for this problem were in place long before the dems took control.
 
uscitizen said:
Gee I wonder why the Dem led house hasn't done anything?
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ROFLMAO

all the parts for this problem were in place long before the dems took control.
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And before Bush did. However, the magic of "You have all the control" is gone. Why have they not addressed the issue if they were working so "aggressively" toward a fix? Why did the changes to the CRA that began the issue in the first place begin with the urging of the previous President? Why do people not recognize that if it is just reaching a head now that doesn't mean that the zit wasn't growing for long before?

This is a zit on the economy, yes. But it certainly isn't "All Bush's Fault!" nor was it dealt with "aggressively" as has been previously asserted by any of the Current Ds, nor even during their campaigns. Seriously....


This problem was about 2 decades in the making. It's time to pop this zit.
 
uscitizen said:
Gee I wonder why the Dem led house hasn't done anything?
//

ROFLMAO

all the parts for this problem were in place long before the dems took control.
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That wasn't the point old man.... because many are bitching that the Reps did nothing about this problem (which is accurate) but neither have the dems. If you will take note: all the parts for this problem to continue are STILL in place.
 
Superfreak said:
That wasn't the point old man.... because many are bitching that the Reps did nothing about this problem (which is accurate) but neither have the dems. If you will take note: all the parts for this problem to continue are STILL in place.
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Definitely. All while they are simply lowering the interest rates to cover it up. It's like a cat and his poop....

It's still there people. And so far the only thing those in power, R or D, have suggested is making sure people don't lose their houses. Not correcting the fricking root cause.
 
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