Does evil exist?

[Kafka]

I didn't bring up child rape or cancer-ridden little girls, militant atheists did that.

And the defenders of the faith have so far been unable to argue effectively against it. Look at your own points. When asked if it makes theological sense for an all-loving God to create such suffering your usual response is something akin to "Atheism is depressing". Which isn't really a rejoinder per se.

You all have gotten a lot of mileage and chuckles over using children to make ideological points. But you obviously never thought about having the tables turned on you.

Actually I think about it daily. You seem to think atheists are some sort of unfeeling robots. You could not misunderstand people more.

The basic assumption of the atheist is that a full and meaningful life will be spent going to art museums, going on vacations, donating $$ to the spotted owl fund, and then peacefully passing away when you are 75 or 85.

Where did you get that cartoon? I mean it sounds great, but I don't know why you think that is a meaningful statement of any real merit.

8-year-old girls with terminal cancer do not have access to that kind of privilege and fulfillment.

But the question still remians: why does an all-loving God allow it to happen. Not only allow it to happen but let it happen literally every single day of every week of every year of every century since time began.

THAT'S the question. If the answer is "God does not love everyone" then that's fine! It doesn't comport with most people's view of what God is, or at least the personal God of most western religions. So we are left with the question.

Telling us how sad you think atheism is is NOT a response to the question.

Your atheism requires you to look in that 8 year old girl's eyes and tell her she is just going to blink completely out of existence.

You seem really invested in the most emotional appeals on this point. Whether it's suggesting we are somehow "OK" with Stalin dying peacefully or it's this new cannard of "you gotta tell a dying child the most depressing stuff you know becuz yer a atheeeeeeeist."

This emotional appeal is misplaced and is just another dodge.

Stick to the question, not these side jabs you like to make because you hate atheists.

 

[Kafka]

Too much word salad.

What words did you not know? I can help.

 

[Kafka]

we all have agreed rape is evil.

I don't think the "rape" gambit is a solid debate point in this particular argument. We usually tend to assume that humans have "free will" (another debate for another day) so one can always say that with free will comes the ability to countervene God's desires for our actions. That we can act against God (ie "evilly").

Rape would be a case of a person choosing to act against God's wishes. The best that can come out of that point for the purposes of THIS discussion is "Did God create the ability for people to act in sinful ways and thereby create sin?" but that's a bit derivative even for me.

I think the more robust debate points are naturally-occuring instances where great suffering is endured by innocent parties through no fault of anyone's. That's the point at which one can ask "Would an all-loving God create such a situation and then make it a daily occurence across the globe for millennia?"

@Cypress's response seems to be that atheism depresses him so it must not be correct. OR that the atheist will have to treat the dying child in the most careless and cruel fashion because they are atheists which means atheism is bad and the argument against God's benevolence falls.

 

[PostmodernProphet]

Actually no. You replied to my post and introduced an unrelated topic.

sorry......I can read and I answered what I read.....

 

[PostmodernProphet]

I'd say millions of children dying of aggressive and horrible cancers every single day is depressing.

it certainly is.....its also a grotesque exaggeration......10M people died of cancer world wide in 2021
https://www.webmd.com/cancer/how-many-cancer-deaths-per-year

70% of those died in low or middle income nations where treatment is not available.......

most were not children......

 

[Litmus]

Not really, I can actually explain what I mean by my posts if you need that.



First off: I'm not going to tell a dying child what I think about the afterlife. So let's just dispense with that cannard.

But I don't think that merely WISHING INTENTLY for something that makes me feel better is sufficient evidence that that something must exist.

Sometimes it is what it is. Sometimes there isn't a prize at the end.




I would probably lie, to be quite honest. What good would it do to tell a child that? But that isn't the debate, now is it. We aren't talking about "what would you tell a dying child", we are talking about if evil per se exists.

It doesn't matter how sad atheism makes you, it has NOTHING to do with the debate. It IS, however, an excellent dodge for someone who is unable to defend a given position. Jumping over to some hypothetical that is engineered to make the opposition look like monsters is what one does when one is unable to defend their own position.

Let's return to the actual QUESTION: Why would an all-loving God allow a creation that has built into it thousands upon thousands of innocent children dying of horrific cancers every day across the globe?

anything to avoid talking about morality.....

evil is human on human predation.

 

[Cypress]

And the defenders of the faith have so far been unable to argue effectively against it. Look at your own points. When asked if it makes theological sense for an all-loving God to create such suffering your usual response is something akin to "Atheism is depressing". Which isn't really a rejoinder per se.



Actually I think about it daily. You seem to think atheists are some sort of unfeeling robots. You could not misunderstand people more.



Where did you get that cartoon? I mean it sounds great, but I don't know why you think that is a meaningful statement of any real merit.



But the question still remians: why does an all-loving God allow it to happen. Not only allow it to happen but let it happen literally every single day of every week of every year of every century since time began.

THAT'S the question. If the answer is "God does not love everyone" then that's fine! It doesn't comport with most people's view of what God is, or at least the personal God of most western religions. So we are left with the question.

Telling us how sad you think atheism is is NOT a response to the question.



You seem really invested in the most emotional appeals on this point. Whether it's suggesting we are somehow "OK" with Stalin dying peacefully or it's this new cannard of "you gotta tell a dying child the most depressing stuff you know becuz yer a atheeeeeeeist."

This emotional appeal is misplaced and is just another dodge.

Stick to the question, not these side jabs you like to make because you hate atheists.

If you ever have a daughter, a niece, a grandson drying with terminal cancer and they ask you what's going to happen to them, your atheism compels you to look them in the eye and say they are going to completely blink out of existence forever

 

[Cypress]

What words did you not know? I can help.

None. You follow me around, seek my attention, and write long verbose tomes to me. I'm not interested in that kind of investment of time

 

[Kafka]

If you ever have a daughter, a niece, a grandson drying with terminal cancer and they ask you what's going to happen to them, your atheism compels you to look them in the eye and say they are going to completely blink out of existence forever

So a blatant, juvenile appeal to emotion is the only thing you have? You can do better.

 

[Kafka]

None. You follow me around, seek my attention, and write long verbose tomes to me. I'm not interested in that kind of investment of time

No, what you really mean is you are unable to face someone who sees through your facade and can take out your points relatively easily while you struggle to formulate them in your own words.

You can do better.