does trump deserve credit for one thing, the stock market up 18% his first 11 months?

Who or what do you believe deserves credit for the markets performance today?

First, credit isn't really the right word. Bubbles don't really deserve credit - it's like giving credit for the rise in housing prices before the 2008 crash.

Having said that, there's context.

Obviously the businesses, customers, shareholders, Wall Street, Fed, etc. are directly involved in the rising stock market. We're talking about the part of the issue involving elected official policy.

In terms of policy - Republicans generally deserve blame for taking money away from the American people, hurting the economy, increasing the debt; Obama deserves some credit for stabilizing after the 2008 crash; trump deserves credit only for supporting terrible policies to redistribute trillions more to the rich, which are profitable to the wealthy and the stock market in the short term but terrible for the country in the longer term. It's trump's economy starting now, let's talk after the crash.
 
First, credit isn't really the right word. Bubbles don't really deserve credit - it's like giving credit for the rise in housing prices before the 2008 crash.

Having said that, there's context.

Obviously the businesses, customers, shareholders, Wall Street, Fed, etc. are directly involved in the rising stock market. We're talking about the part of the issue involving elected official policy.

In terms of policy - Republicans generally deserve blame for taking money away from the American people, hurting the economy, increasing the debt; Obama deserves some credit for stabilizing after the 2008 crash; trump deserves credit only for supporting terrible policies to redistribute trillions more to the rich, which are profitable to the wealthy and the stock market in the short term but terrible for the country in the longer term. It's trump's economy starting now, let's talk after the crash.

I appreciate you acknowledge it's a bubble but that takes away from your trying to give democrats/republicans credit/blame. Who caused the bubble? Did Obama or Trump do something?
 
I appreciate you acknowledge it's a bubble but that takes away from your trying to give democrats/republicans credit/blame. Who caused the bubble? Did Obama or Trump do something?

I'll preface any comment on that with the statement that I'm not expert on the details of the bubbles and various factors, even if might seem so comparatively for here.

I'll say second that my point was that trump does deserve credit for the rise of the market. He has not done things, made choices, passed laws, that are the cause. That was my point, to his insane supporters.

Now you raise a difference topic about what presidents have done what to cause the market to rise.

Obama did do things that helped the economy recover after the crash, and that has helped the market rise, and the chart showing the steady rise since then the last 8 years shows the result.

Having said that, the fed continuing low interest money helps it also.

And our plutocratic policies that keep pushing money into the hands of the wealthiest, where stocks are mostly owned by them, and they like owning stocks, is a factor as well.

And finally another important factor is that again, our policies pushing money into the hands of corporations making them the wealthiest they've ever been, has resulted in a lot of stock buybacks that drive prices up.

Historically, a rising stock market has largely been a positive for the economy; in a time of plutocracy, it can show the problem of wealth amassing at the top. trump is almost as plutocratic a leader as you can get.

So my point is, is driving up the market a positive indicator about actions taken to increase the value of companies? For example, if a major new educational initiative was done that built long-term value in companies increasing their value, that would do it.

Or is an increase simply the result of taking money from the American people, increasing their poverty, and putting it into the hands of the wealthy who use it to drive up stock prices? That wouldn't seem to deserve 'credit'.

Another point - a lot of increases could be harmful. Imagine there's a company that is regulated to not allow it to pollute, and then trump removes the regulation and the company increases its profits billions by polluting the environment terribly - that would result in the stock price of the company going up, but it's hardly a good thing.

If worker protections are lowered, lowering company expenses for employees, that could make stock prices go up as well- again, hardly a good thing. Take away Americans' healthcare, give the money to companies - what we just did - hey, stock price boost. THAT part of the stock price increase I'll give to trump, but it just happened, and was a terrible action.
 
Quote Originally Posted by RB 60 View Post
My 401K has done far better in the last year than it did in the prior eight. I see an early retirement in the near future!


Why in the hell would you even think I would give you a "link" to my personal retirement information?
You really are an idiot, aren't you?
 
The stock market is booming because it is eating itself. Corporations buy back stocks with the profits and give it to execs as stock options or bonuses. Also give money to stockholders. The impact on business in negligible. It is not kickstarting hiring or expansion, since those are created by increasing demand. Giving tons more money to the top 1 percent is a very inefficient way to increase demand. The soaring market is a sign of an increasing wealth gap.
 
The stock market is booming because it is eating itself. Corporations buy back stocks with the profits and give it to execs as stock options or bonuses. Also give money to stockholders. The impact on business in negligible. It is not kickstarting hiring or expansion, since those are created by increasing demand. Giving tons more money to the top 1 percent is a very inefficient way to increase demand. The soaring market is a sign of an increasing wealth gap.

So it's a bubble
 
The stock market is booming because it is eating itself. Corporations buy back stocks with the profits and give it to execs as stock options or bonuses. Also give money to stockholders. The impact on business in negligible. It is not kickstarting hiring or expansion, since those are created by increasing demand. Giving tons more money to the top 1 percent is a very inefficient way to increase dem. The soaring market is a sign of an increasing wealth gap.
Exactly, giving the middle class a tax break or wage increases is what increases demand and grows business, not tax breaks for corporations.
 
The stock market is booming because it is eating itself. Corporations buy back stocks with the profits and give it to execs as stock options or bonuses. Also give money to stockholders. The impact on business in negligible. It is not kickstarting hiring or expansion, since those are created by increasing demand. Giving tons more money to the top 1 percent is a very inefficient way to increase demand. The soaring market is a sign of an increasing wealth gap.

I don't care.....most of my money is in real estate.......
 
The stock market is booming because it is eating itself. Corporations buy back stocks with the profits and give it to execs as stock options or bonuses. Also give money to stockholders. The impact on business in negligible. It is not kickstarting hiring or expansion, since those are created by increasing demand. Giving tons more money to the top 1 percent is a very inefficient way to increase demand. The soaring market is a sign of an increasing wealth gap.

It's beyond an inefficient way to create demand. It reduces demand when you consider opportunity cost - how much more demand would be increased by that same money going into the hands of the public.

A society that is a plutocracy is simply less productive than one that isn't in the long term in modern society. Maybe it's different in a slave agrarian society, but either way, the costs to the masses are very high and wrong.
 
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yep a righty. Don't care about anyone else if you profit. Nothing to be proud of. But it explains your being a Trumplestilskin.
 
You mean because of Obama. remember what bush left him. Trump will do the same. It took Trump a year to get his first bill in place and it was terrible. The tax bill is a mess of giveaways to the wealthy . Repubs fuck up the economy and Dems have to fix it. TRhat is the pattern Repubs are unable to discern.
 
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You mean because of Obama. remember what bush left him. Trump will do the same. It took Trump a year to get his first bill in place and uit was terrible. The tax bill is a mess of giveaways to the wealthy . Repubs fuck up the economy and Dems have to fix it. TRhat is the pattern Repubs are unable to discern.

Will the bubble pop when the Feds raise rates?

Are you on the Yellen is a hero bandwagon?
 
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