Europeans see what America cannot

There was no fraud in Afghanistan. Just your complete lack of understanding at what the pipelines were designed for.

Side note.... just how does the above enlighten anyone to your position? Rattling off names and pointing fingers is your idea of evidence?

Don't get it twisted.

I'm not trying to rally anyone to my side.

This truth is as obvious as the nose on your face .. but if you can't see the nose on your own face .. nothing I can say will help you.

Educate yourself.
 
It would make no sense to pipe Caspian oil all the way through Afghanistan when there is already oil pipelines on a less circuitous route.

yes, I know. Which is why the Afghan pipeline is for nat gas to be shipped from Turkmenistan to Pakistan.

The Caspian oil is best transported through Turkey via Azerbaijan and Georgia which is also part of the pipeline plan.
 
Don't get it twisted.

I'm not trying to rally anyone to my side.

This truth is as obvious as the nose on your face .. but if you can't see the nose on your own face .. nothing I can say will help you.

Educate yourself.

LMAO.... if it was so obvious.... why is it you cannot articulate it????
 
Through Russia.

Educate yourelf on this my brother.

If what you say is tru .. why did they build the pipeline through Afghanistan?

Educate yourself my brother.... it is for NAT GAS from Turkmenistan to Pakistan via Afghanistan. They also plan to pipe the oil through Turkey via Azerbaijan and Georgia. That is also part of the plan. But one many seem to ignore. The pipeline through Georgia is already there. The pipeline would simply be built through Azerbaijan to connect to it. From Georgia it would go to their Black Sea ports. Turkey would need to expand its pipeline up to the Black sea. Currently it only goes as far north as Ankara. They expand that and they can ship it without going through Russia or Iran.

Side note.... you do realize that the pipeline that goes through Afghanistan does not connect to the Caspian sea... right?
 
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Through Russia.

Educate yourelf on this my brother.

If what you say is tru .. why did they build the pipeline through Afghanistan?
Because it was for natural gas, the plains for the natural gas are on the correct side of the Caspian Sea and do not require such a circuitous route. There is a more direct route already made for the oil pipelines that has been used for decades.

As for Russian Maps. I have a high degree of knowledge on that subject.
 
Because it was for natural gas, the plains for the natural gas are on the correct side of the Caspian Sea and do not require such a circuitous route. There is a more direct route already made for the oil pipelines that has been used for decades.

As for Russian Maps. I have a high degree of knowledge on that subject.

I bet you may even be able to read the maps in Russian. Just a guess.

:cool:
 
Educate yourself my brother.... it is for NAT GAS from Turkmenistan to Pakistan via Afghanistan. They also plan to pipe the oil through Turkey via Azerbaijan and Georgia. That is also part of the plan. But one many seem to ignore. The pipeline through Georgia is already there. The pipeline would simply be built through Azerbaijan to connect to it. From Georgia it would go to their Black Sea ports. Turkey would need to expand its pipeline up to the Black sea. Currently it only goes as far north as Ankara. They expand that and they can ship it without going through Russia or Iran.

Side note.... you do realize that the pipeline that goes through Afghanistan does not connect to the Caspian sea... right?

bump for bac
 
I'm still waiting on one of you to tell me why, if the pipeline wasn't needed and there were other routes .. why did it get built NOT using other routes?

I question if you even know the history.

From the 1998 Congressional Record.

STATEMENT OF JOHN J. MARESCA, VICE PRESIDENT OF INTERNATIONAL RELATIONS, UNOCAL CORPORATION

I would like to focus today on three issues. First, the need for multiple pipeline routes for Central Asian oil and gas resources. Second, the need for U.S. support for international and regional efforts to achieve balanced and lasting political settlements to the conflicts in the region, including Afghanistan. Third, the need for structured assistance to encourage economic reforms and the development of appropriate investment climates in the region. In this regard, we specifically support repeal or removal of section 907 of the Freedom Support Act.

One major problem has yet to be resolved: how to get the region's vast energy resources to the markets where they are needed. Central Asia is isolated. Their natural resources are land locked, both geographically and politically. Each of the countries in the Caucasus and Central Asia faces difficult political challenges. Some have unsettled wars or latent conflicts. Others have evolving systems where the laws and even the courts are dynamic and changing. In addition, a chief technical obstacle which we in the industry face in transporting oil is the region's existing pipeline infrastructure.

One obvious route south would cross Iran, but this is foreclosed for American companies because of U.S. sanctions legislation. The only other possible route is across Afghanistan, which has of course its own unique challenges. The country has been involved in bitter warfare for almost two decades, and is still divided by civil war. From the outset, we have made it clear that construction of the pipeline we have proposed across Afghanistan could not begin until a recognized government is in place that has the confidence of governments, lenders, and our company.

As with the proposed Central Asia oil pipeline, CentGas can not begin construction until an internationally recognized Afghanistan Government is in place.

Project for a New American Century Letter to President Clinton

On January 26, 1998, the PNAC, sent a letter to President William Clinton urging the military overthrow of Saddam Hussein in Iraq. The dictator, the letter alleged, was a destabilizing force in the Middle East, and posed a mortal threat to "...the safety of American troops in the region, of our friends and allies like Israel and the moderate Arab states, and a significant portion of the world's oil supply..." The subjugation of Iraq would be the first application of "pre-emptive war."

President Clinton did not honor the PNAC's request.
Letter to President Clinton on Iraq

According to PNAC, what was needed to build the pipeline and invade Iraq was “some catastrophic and catalysing event – like a new Pearl Harbor"
Why Another Defense Review

Hell to Pay
Sentient Times June/July 2002 issue

On a frigid, rainy January day in 2001, Unocal was given reason to rejoice. George W. Bush had just taken the oath of office, and was now President of the United States. The power of the American government was immediately brought to bear in the situation. Enter Afghan-American Zalmay Khalilzad, who in the early 1990s served Unocal as an advisor on the nascent pipeline project. In 1997, Khalilzad was present with Unocal representatives when they hosted a delegation of Taliban officials in Houston.

NOTE: This meeting was hosted by Ken Lay who gave millions to the the Taliban.

Khalilzad was part of a full-court press by the Bush administration to see the pipeline deal through to completion. Their main objective was to bring the Taliban, who had become decidedly disinterested in then project, back on board. The American pitch to the Taliban, which was still hosting Osama bin Laden, became so intense that the Taliban hired an American public relations expert named Laila Helms to broker negotiations. High-level meetings between the Bush administration and the Taliban continued through August of 2001, with little gain. The Taliban simply was not interested in becoming part of the deal.

It was at this point, according to Brisard and Dasique, that the story takes a darker and more dangerous turn.

Pakistani news agencies reported in the weeks before September 11th that America had threatened war against the Taliban if they did not agree to the pipeline deal. “Accept our carpet of gold,” the Bush administration is reported to have said, “or be buried under a carpet of bombs.”

At the same time, John O’Neill was quitting his job in protest. A Deputy Director of the FBI, O’Neill was America’s chief bin Laden hunter. He had been in charge of the investigations into the bin Laden-connected bombings of the World Trade Center in 1993, the destruction of an American troop barracks in Saudi Arabia in 1996, the African embassy bombings in 1998, and the attack upon the U.S.S. Cole in 2000. Simply put, no one person in America’s counter-terrorism apparatus knew more about Osama bin Laden than John O’Neill.

Two weeks before September 11th, John O’Neill left the FBI in anger and disgust. He believed his government was actively hindering his ability to pursue dangerous Islamic terrorists because such investigations were discomforting Mideast regimes like the Taliban that were being courted by American petroleum interests. Brisard and Dasique quote O’Neill as saying, “The main obstacles to investigating Islamic terrorism were U.S. oil corporate interests, and the role played by Saudi Arabia in it.” Connections between the Taliban and Saudi Arabia, a nation bin Laden and a dozen of the 9/11 hijackers once called home, are too glaring to ignore.

US Invasion of Afghanistan was announced months before 9/11
The US Invasion of Afghanistan was Announced Months Before the 9/11 Attacks

QUESTION: At this point, before 9/11 .. WHAT REASON DO THEY HAVE TO ATTACK AFGHANISTAN?

Bush given Afghanistan invasion plans two days before 9/11
US PREPARING FOR A WAR WITH AFGHANISTAN BEFORE 9/11, INCREASING CONTROL OF ASIA BEFORE AND SINCE

Sandy Berger, Clinton's National Security Advisor, has stated, "You show me one reporter, one commentator, one member of Congress who thought we should invade Afghanistan before September 11 and I'll buy you dinner in the best restaurant in New York City." [The Cell, John Miller, Michael Stone and Chris Mitchell, 8/02, p. 219] In July 2002, British Prime Minister Tony Blair will state: "To be truthful about it, there was no way we could have got the public consent to have suddenly launched a campaign on Afghanistan but for what happened on September 11." [London Times, 7/17/02] How did Bush expect to get public support for his plan to invade and conquer Afghanistan if 9/11 didn't happen

October 7, 2001, Bush announces opening of attacks against Afghanistan
CNN.com - Bush announces opening of attacks - October 7, 2001

Former Unocal Consultant Karzai elected new Afghan leader
BBC NEWS * World * South Asia * Karzai elected Afghan leader

John J. Maresca, the Vice President of the Unocal Corporation who had implored Congress to have the Taliban overthrown is installed as the first US Envoy to Afghanistan

September 20, 2001: PNAC Think Tank Pushes for Iraq War
The Project for the New American Century (PNAC), publishes a letter addressed to President Bush, insisting that the war on terrorism include as one of its objectives the removal of Saddam Hussein from power— “even if evidence does not link Iraq directly to the attack.”
Letter to President Bush on the War on Terrorism

December 27, 2002, Afghanistan pipeline deal signed
BBC NEWS * South Asia * Central Asia pipeline deal signed
 
wow bac has to be desh's husban no human on earth could be as stupid as thinking 911 was an inside job and not be married to her. LOFL thanks for the comedy
 
wow bac has to be desh's husban no human on earth could be as stupid as thinking 911 was an inside job and not be married to her. LOFL thanks for the comedy

Your ignorance speaks for itself.

MILLIONS of Americans of every walk of life believe 9/11 was an inside job.

Being ignorant, you wouldn't know that.

Demonstrate if you have a brain and intellectually dissect what I posted .. or just continue play the fool.

Doesn't matter.
 
wow give me another laugh and post the shit college you went too.
Millions of americans, no you desh and a few loser leftwingnuts. maybe a dozen you uneducated moron.
 
Again, the Caspian oil continues to be piped out through Iran and Russia. The proposal for new pipelines for the Caspian oil were directed through Azerbaijan, Georgia and into Turkey.

The Afghan pipelines DO NOT RUN to the Caspian Sea. They run from the Turkmenistan Natural Gas fields down through Afghanistan to Pakistan.

Look the shit up. None of your conspiracy theories seem to cover the very fact that oil has nothing to do with these pipelines. None of them cover the fact that it is natural gas that Pakistan wants.

They just see an American corporation attempting to build the pipeline and so they cry conspiracy. This pipeline would have been built with or without an American company being involved. Turkmenistan wanted it and so did Pakistan. Up until Clowntoon dropped bombs in Afghanistan (which I am sure somehow fits into the conspiracy) the Taliban was on board with the pipeline.
 
Your ignorance speaks for itself.

MILLIONS of Americans of every walk of life believe 9/11 was an inside job.

Being ignorant, you wouldn't know that.

Demonstrate if you have a brain and intellectually dissect what I posted .. or just continue play the fool.

Doesn't matter.

Yet none have shown any proof of that. Just a bunch of half-assed theories. You say it is plain to see.... then provide the evidence. Show us the proof that you have that this occured.
 
I'm still waiting on one of you to tell me why, if the pipeline wasn't needed and there were other routes .. why did it get built NOT using other routes?

I question if you even know the history.

From the 1998 Congressional Record.

STATEMENT OF JOHN J. MARESCA, VICE PRESIDENT OF INTERNATIONAL RELATIONS, UNOCAL CORPORATION



Project for a New American Century Letter to President Clinton


Letter to President Clinton on Iraq

According to PNAC, what was needed to build the pipeline and invade Iraq was “some catastrophic and catalysing event – like a new Pearl Harbor"
Why Another Defense Review

Hell to Pay
Sentient Times June/July 2002 issue



US Invasion of Afghanistan was announced months before 9/11
The US Invasion of Afghanistan was Announced Months Before the 9/11 Attacks

QUESTION: At this point, before 9/11 .. WHAT REASON DO THEY HAVE TO ATTACK AFGHANISTAN?

Bush given Afghanistan invasion plans two days before 9/11
US PREPARING FOR A WAR WITH AFGHANISTAN BEFORE 9/11, INCREASING CONTROL OF ASIA BEFORE AND SINCE



October 7, 2001, Bush announces opening of attacks against Afghanistan
CNN.com - Bush announces opening of attacks - October 7, 2001

Former Unocal Consultant Karzai elected new Afghan leader
BBC NEWS * World * South Asia * Karzai elected Afghan leader

John J. Maresca, the Vice President of the Unocal Corporation who had implored Congress to have the Taliban overthrown is installed as the first US Envoy to Afghanistan

September 20, 2001: PNAC Think Tank Pushes for Iraq War

Letter to President Bush on the War on Terrorism

December 27, 2002, Afghanistan pipeline deal signed
BBC NEWS * South Asia * Central Asia pipeline deal signed


As for the conspiracy theory regarding the "plans to go to war with Afghanistan"... I would be willing to bet we have a plan for damn near every country. I would also be willing to bet that due to the threats received, Afghanistan was updated many times during Clintons terms and also after Bush took office.
 
Again, the Caspian oil continues to be piped out through Iran and Russia. The proposal for new pipelines for the Caspian oil were directed through Azerbaijan, Georgia and into Turkey.

The Afghan pipelines DO NOT RUN to the Caspian Sea. They run from the Turkmenistan Natural Gas fields down through Afghanistan to Pakistan.

Look the shit up. None of your conspiracy theories seem to cover the very fact that oil has nothing to do with these pipelines. None of them cover the fact that it is natural gas that Pakistan wants.

They just see an American corporation attempting to build the pipeline and so they cry conspiracy. This pipeline would have been built with or without an American company being involved. Turkmenistan wanted it and so did Pakistan. Up until Clowntoon dropped bombs in Afghanistan (which I am sure somehow fits into the conspiracy) the Taliban was on board with the pipeline.


My above post detailing the chronolgy of events leading up to the building of the pipeline await your investigation.

The Taliban, OUR INVENTION, refused to go along with the pipeline deal which obviously you now agree with .. but I guess "Clinton did it" makes the rest of the story false in your mind.

Regardless of if "the pipeline would have been built", building it with American control is the point and why the Bush Adminsitration followed the marching orders of PNAC.
 
Yet none have shown any proof of that. Just a bunch of half-assed theories. You say it is plain to see.... then provide the evidence. Show us the proof that you have that this occured.

Again, I'm not the least bit interested in converting you to the truth. If you can't see your own nose, that's not my problem.

I'm posting what I percieve as truth and whether you agree doeasn't make a damn bit of difference .. as it didn't make a damn bit of difference listening to those who championed the disaster of Iraq and were too incerdibly dumb to see the all too obvious there as well.

If I remember correctly, they called the opposition "conspiracy theorists" as well. It appears that anyone who reaches for that bullshit lacks intellect themselves.
 
My above post detailing the chronolgy of events leading up to the building of the pipeline await your investigation.

The Taliban, OUR INVENTION, refused to go along with the pipeline deal which obviously you now agree with .. but I guess "Clinton did it" makes the rest of the story false in your mind.

Regardless of if "the pipeline would have been built", building it with American control is the point and why the Bush Adminsitration followed the marching orders of PNAC.

1) Americans do not "control" the pipeline proceeds. Turkemenistan does.

2) They are Nat Gas pipelines to Pakistan... not some mysterious oil pipelines

3) Your chronology is a bunch of bullshit. It is a jumbled mass of conspiracy desperately linked together.
 
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