God has passed His judgement

Watermark said:
Special pleading. The disappointing thing about religion is not how above human logic God's thinking is, but how VERY HUMAN God's thinking is.



The Christian God is specifically omnibenevolent. I don't believe in God, so it would be silly for me to state one way or the other my beliefs on his nature.



Like saving a four-year old child in a church from getting shot? Yep. This sounds like an benevolent God.

atheists.jpg




God should find other ways to "save people's eternal souls" that murdering four year old children.

Anyway, you're argument is essentially just another worn out special pleading. You can counter anything I say by simply stating that it's beyond my understanding. What is really going on here is that it's beyond YOUR understanding, it's certainly not beyond MINE.

It's not worth confronting, because the one thing I am sure of is that NOTHING GOOD FROM A HUMAN PERSPECTIVE CAME OUT OF THIS MURDER. From a universal perspective, well, the universe doesn't care one way or the other, it's just some matter being converted into some other form of matter.




Yep. I'm sorry for thinking in oh-so-human logic, like not preventing the murder of four year olds. Just be honest and say he doesn't intervene or doesn't care (in which case you might as well be an atheist). Saying there's an interventionist God in this world that's omnibenevolent is retarded.
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If God took this action, how do you know he wasn't being benevolent?

What if inaction set in motion events which would kill millions?

Your limited understanding could not possibly have the amount of information necessary to actually judge the action. Our minimal understanding may make such an action appear to be inimical, however we have far less information than an "omniscient" being. Who says that God is omnipotent or even omniscient? You are making an argument against the Abrahamic God only, it is illogical to assume that is the only possible "god"...

Your argument is very Amerocentric, as well as solely against one specific branch of religion. It assumes ultimate knowledge from the humans rather than the supposed "omniscient" being and through that illogical assumption flows forth as a fallacious argument.
 
Maybe the kid was going to be the next Hitler. In which case God would have been acting quite malevolently towards Mankind.

That's not my issue here though. My issue is WM using a kids death as a piece of "see! I told you so!" evidence, which on the same level as people praying for a terrorist attack now because Obama is in office.
 
CaptBillyTheKid said:
Maybe the kid was going to be the next Hitler. In which case God would have been acting quite malevolently towards Mankind.

That's not my issue here though. My issue is WM using a kids death as a piece of "see! I told you so!" evidence, which on the same level as people praying for a terrorist attack now because Obama is in office.
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didn't a gun fire the bullet?
 
Topspin said:
didn't a gun fire the bullet?
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All by itself apparently. Guns are sneaky bastards like that. I caught one of mine leaving the toilet seat up last night. I'd have given it a stern talking to if I wasn't so afraid it might shoot me.
 
Topspin said:
I'm from the planet Fireworks not NRA celebration style gun blasting at everything
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Yeah, most people aren't from that planet either. More than likely my good friend booze was involved as well. And if it had involved fireworks and booze, someone could have died too, but you'd have been silent then wouldn't you? Or if the guy was high and wanted to go shooting, you would just lay it all on the gun, not the guy holding it.
 
God could have given more than one brain cell to a probably drunken idiot who thought it would be fun to fire a deadly weapon into the air as a celebration.

Hope God finds the suspect and sends that idiot to burn in hell alongside every other idiot who has such casual disregard for human life, and doesn't consider the consequences before pulling the trigger.
 
Damocles said:
If God took this action, how do you know he wasn't being benevolent?

What if inaction set in motion events which would kill millions?

Your limited understanding could not possibly have the amount of information necessary to actually judge the action. Our minimal understanding may make such an action appear to be inimical, however we have far less information than an "omniscient" being. Who says that God is omnipotent or even omniscient? You are making an argument against the Abrahamic God only, it is illogical to assume that is the only possible "god"...

Your argument is very Amerocentric, as well as solely against one specific branch of religion. It assumes ultimate knowledge from the humans rather than the supposed "omniscient" being and through that illogical assumption flows forth as a fallacious argument.
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The Abrahamic God is a personal God that is supposed to be omnibenevolent. God obviously is not omnibenevolent. In my arguments against an omnibenevolent God, "How are you sure he's an omnivenevolent God?!" is a useless proposition.

Also, since God doesn't exist, it doesn't matter what nature you think he has, because he could have as many as possible, just like any other imaginary construct.
 
PostmodernProphet said:
it's difficult to comprehend the impact that the death of a four year old will have on other people's lives.....for instance, WM has used the occasion to sink himself further into depravity.....another might have brought himself to amend his celebratory actions.....what is clear, however, is that human conduct has consequences to humans.....some would suppose a world where it made no matter what we do, but that God should bear the responsibility for keeping us safe.....I think such a world would raise a humanity of uncaring, unthoughtful people......drive a car a hundred miles an hour the wrong way on a one way road?.....why not?....God will lift the other vehicles out of the way for us.......
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1. I have used the occasion to fight for good, true, but the universe doesn't care.

2. Yes, if I do have the ability to save a 4-year old from someone elses actions, I have the RESPONSIBILITY.
 
Dixie said:
Again, you presume God must "think" like humans. God doesn't need to "think" about anything, God is not human! Why would an omnipotent being need to think? Thinking is contemplation of thought, a human attribute, something WE do, not something a God would have any use for.



Why would God need to be benevolent? Does it make God feel better about Himself? Is he trying to get into God Heaven? I mean, I am really trying to understand why you think this, and it doesn't make a lick of sense. Of course, nothing you ever have to say makes a lick of sense, so that is normal!

God doesn't have needs, therefore, He would have no need to be benevolent.



God didn't murder anyone. And I am sure God is kicking Himself for not taking YOUR advice on how to run the universe! If only God would listen to YOUR reasoning, maybe that 4-year-old would still be alive today!



If you can understand the universe doesn't care, why can't you comprehend God doesn't care? God doesn't have a human perspective, God doesn't require a perspective or have need to think! God isn't concerned with what you personally think of him, or how His actions are interpreted by you.



God certainly CAN intervene, and often does. What makes you think He wasn't the cause of the bullet killing the child? Perhaps that WAS His intervention? You just presume that God must think, and think like a human! God must need to rationalize things, like humans! God must have compassion and feelings, like humans! It's like I said, no wonder so many of you don't believe in God, if that's the only way I could envision God, I wouldn't believe either! But fortunately, I see God as something very different, without human characteristics, because that would make him mortal.
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You are arguing about God as if he were real. That's almost certainly not the case, so clearly your delusional, which means you're not worth arguing with.
 
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Watermark said:
The Abrahamic God is a personal God that is supposed to be omnibenevolent. God obviously is not omnibenevolent. In my arguments against an omnibenevolent God, "How are you sure he's an omnivenevolent God?!" is a useless proposition.

Also, since God doesn't exist, it doesn't matter what nature you think he has, because he could have as many as possible, just like any other imaginary construct.
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Hence I did not ask that question.

I asked, "Who said god is omniscient anyway?"

And pointed out, "Your arguments are simply against one religion set (those religions that came from Abraham), not against god as an idea."

I also pointed out that it was fallacious to assume things about the magic man then fight that, that is called a straw man.
 
Damocles said:
Hence I did not ask that question.

I asked, "Who said god is omniscient anyway?"

And pointed out, "Your arguments are simply against one religion set (those religions that came from Abraham), not against god as an idea."

I also pointed out that it was fallacious to assume things about the magic man then fight that, that is called a straw man.
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I always wanted a magic straw man, like in the Wizard of Oz
 
Damocles said:
Hence I did not ask that question.

I asked, "Who said god is omniscient anyway?"

And pointed out, "Your arguments are simply against one religion set (those religions that came from Abraham), not against god as an idea."

I also pointed out that it was fallacious to assume things about the magic man then fight that, that is called a straw man.
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I am not fighting against any God but the Abrahamic God right now. Why would I? If you want to talk about some other set of fairy tales, start a new thread.
 
Watermark said:
You are arguing about God as if he were real. That's no the case, so clearly your delusional, which means you're not worth arguing with.
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Well let's see your evidence God is not real! What? You have no evidence? So, essentially, it is your FAITH that God is not real, that is what you believe in? Thanks for the clarification you have FAITH, like 95% of ALL humans!

I am at a distinct advantage over you in these debates, because I don't "believe" God is real, I know it. Just like I know gravity is real, although I can't see it. You have not evolved to the point of being able to understand your God, and that is a shame, because if you ever get there, you will find the peace and happiness you've searched for your whole life.... damn, I am sounding like Roy Masters now, I hate when that happens!

...Stop making me wax religious, you incompetent moron!
 
Dixie said:
Well let's see your evidence God is not real! What? You have no evidence? So, essentially, it is your FAITH that God is not real, that is what you believe in? Thanks for the clarification you have FAITH, like 95% of ALL humans!

I am at a distinct advantage over you in these debates, because I don't "believe" God is real, I know it. Just like I know gravity is real, although I can't see it. You have not evolved to the point of being able to understand your God, and that is a shame, because if you ever get there, you will find the peace and happiness you've searched for your whole life.... damn, I am sounding like Roy Masters now, I hate when that happens!

...Stop making me wax religious, you incompetent moron!
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I never said I believed there is no God. I said I don't believe in God.
 
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