Good debate between prominent atheists, Anglican bishops, and Jewish rabbis

[Kafka]

I don't get why she presented herself as female when posting as BidenPresident and male when posting as Hume. Regardless she's an odd one.

@Hume is a fractal mess. In many ways I actually sometimes feel bad when I push back after Hume attacks me (which they do even on those occasions when I agree with them), because I think it is somewhat irresponsible to play into someone's clearly mental issues. When BIdenPresident was posting (*caveat: I don't know if BP is the same H but they post a LOT alike) I once collected the MANY times they told someone to kill themselves just to get a feel for it and I stopped counting after about 24 of them. Many of them suggested the other poster should be "violently murdered".

I hold out hope that Hume is NOT BP.

Clearly something is not quite meshing, though for Hume.

 

[Kafka]

Dawkins obviously has a financial motivation to be so militant in his writing and public presentation.

MY GOD MAN, you are LITERALLY using the EXACT SAME ARGUMENTS CREATIONISTS AND CLIMATE DENIERS USE.

Wow.

 

[Kafka]

In my great erudition, anyone who believes differently than I do, or holds a belief I do not understand must surely be doing it for the money. No one could possibly think differently than I do unless they are doing it for venal reasons.

And I always think PERFECT thoughts because I rely on authorities and have no actual thoughts of my own.

I am the most intelligent man in the universe. I am so bright, my dad used to call me "sun"

FTFY

 

[Dutch Uncle]

I've seen philosophers use the rules of logic to deduce there is a 20 percent chance we are living in a computer simulation.

Dawkins obviously has a financial motivation to be so militant in his writing and public presentation. But when you get right down to it, he is glad he grew up in a country framed by the Anglican Christian tradition, rather than one having the Hindu, Buddhist, or Islamic tradition; he has openly confessed to being a cultural Anglican or secular Christian.

Those philosophers have no further proof than you, me or Perry. As human beings, we have logic and our "feelings". That's it.

Understood about comparing Dawkins' and his background. We're all examples of our upbringing. I believe in "free will". Even if we're 90% of our genetics and 9% of our upbringing, there's still the X factor of choice.

 

[Dutch Uncle]

MY GOD MAN, you are LITERALLY using the EXACT SAME ARGUMENTS CREATIONISTS AND CLIMATE DENIERS USE.

Wow.

You're an idiot, Perry. You always will be when compared to people who graduated college.

 

[Dutch Uncle]

I don't get why she presented herself as female when posting as BidenPresident and male when posting as Hume. Regardless she's an odd one.

It's common in American forums for women to hide their gender. Lots of fucking morons and assholes on the Internet.

 

[anonymoose]

@Hume is a fractal mess. In many ways I actually sometimes feel bad when I push back after Hume attacks me (which they do even on those occasions when I agree with them), because I think it is somewhat irresponsible to play into someone's clearly mental issues. When BIdenPresident was posting (*caveat: I don't know if BP is the same H but they post a LOT alike) I once collected the MANY times they told someone to kill themselves just to get a feel for it and I stopped counting after about 24 of them. Many of them suggested the other poster should be "violently murdered".

I hold out hope that Hume is NOT BP.

Clearly something is not quite meshing, though for Hume.

She came right out and told me she is BP. And made a point to say she's male. ???

 

[Dutch Uncle]

She came right out and told me she is BP. And made a point to say she's male. ???

....because everyone online always tells the truth.

A real dentist, meaning someone with almost 20 years of education, should be able to differentiate fact from fiction. Any competent person in the medical field should be able to "read" patients.

 

[Cypress]

For someone who claims to hate my threads, you are still constantly clicking on them, reading my posts, composing excessively verbose responses, and jumping up and down trying to get my attention.

 

[Cypress]

What is "moral truth"?

So, it's just your opinion what Hitler did was wrong, and there is no objective moral truth.

I believe what Hitler did was objectively wrong, and that liquidating gypsies, jews, and the mentally disabled is not subject to opinion, debate, or popular consensus.

 

[Litmus]

What is "moral truth"? Is there any way to independently VERIFY said moral truth?



Like your point about letting the Jewish scholars tell you what ancient jewish writing means, maybe you should let the scientists explain science to you.



Because sometimes quotes speak for themselves. Just because you don't like some of the CLEARLY bad stuff in the Bible doesn't mean it isn't in there.



A) It is the FIRST PLACE we are introduced to the concept of God.

B) It reads exactly like any other god myth with a fully human "God" who is often petulant and angry and vicious (along with some good qualities)

C) The OT is NOT to be placed aside in Christianity. The Marcionites were HERETICS. Ergo you can't really throw away the OT because it says some things that make you uncomfortable (See more below on Question #6)

D) FINALLY: It speaks authoritatively about GOD and what GOD WANTS. If God is eternal then there's a LOT of explaining necessary as to how a vicious partisan god who commanded genocides over and over again against "others" would suddenly about 2000 years ago change fundamentally and become the god of all people whom he loves without limitation.



Yes. I understand you are not that familar with Christianity outide the Orthodox church but in Christianity it is generally accepted that the OT lays the groundwork and FORETELLS the coming of the Messiah, Jesus. It is also the home of the 10 Commandments. It is clear you didn't spend much time in church but Psalms are read ALL THE TIME. The book of Job is taught quite commonly. The stories in the OT really DO form a basic cultural "touchstone" as you like to say for western civilization. I'm surprised you aren't more familiar with those stories.



I'm down with that. It certainly helps explain a lot of things. It doesn't really explain the non-stop genocides and murders commanded or facilitated by God clearly in the BIble, but it certainly helps explain some of the more difficult to understand passages.



Either God doesn't exist or God is somehow CONSTRAINED on the universe he created (a la Dr. Pangloss and Leibniz) OR God values pain and suffeirng.

I vote for Choice #1 because it is the least offensive and least theologically problematic.

we can throw away the old testament, and we should.


The whole of the law is the golden rule.

 

[Litmus]

So, it's just your opinion what Hitler did was wrong, and there is no objective moral truth.

I believe what Hitler did was objectively wrong, and that liquidating gypsies, jews, and the mentally disabled is not subject to opinion, debate, or popular consensus.

how about liquidating normal healthy majority people who just disagree with globalism?

 

[Litmus]

I don't think Dawkins ever really makes a compelling case either, but that's just my opinion. He is a superstar among 21st century atheists and one of their leading spokespersons.

I thought it was interesting that he said the bible shouldn't be any more privileged as a source of wisdom and morality than Greek fables or Tolstoy.

I have my own thoughts on that.

He also has a lot of complaints about the Old Testament, aka Hebrew bible, but the lady rabbi had an interesting response, which is that if you haven't read the Talmud and all the rabbinic literature you are not in a position to say what the old testament means.

good.

we can just leave it out of the christian Bible next time.

christianity should be severed from the racist tribalism of Judaism and merged with Buddhism.


ALan Watts.

 

[Dutch Uncle]

Interestingly that's probably as far as Cypress got....

For someone who claims to hate my threads, you are still constantly clicking on them, reading my posts, composing excessively verbose responses, and jumping up and down trying to get my attention.

Perry is fascinated by you and follows you around so you pay attention to him.

Notice he only follows you, not me or anyone else. That says something about him. Remember all of his homoerotic artwork he posted to you? Perry might be "gender confused", but his feelings for you are real.

 

[Cypress]

Perry is fascinated by you and follows you around so you pay attention to him.

Notice he only follows you, not me or anyone else. That says something about him. Remember all of his homoerotic artwork he posted to you? Perry might be "gender confused", but his feelings for you are real.

I don't need that kind of attention! What, that Thomas/Tim of Finland softcore gay porn stuff, or whatever it was called? That was very strange and unusual. Not the kinda thing you normally see on message boards!

 

[Dutch Uncle]

I don't need that kind of attention! What, that Thomas/Tim of Finland softcore gay porn stuff, or whatever it was called? That was very strange and unusual. Not the kinda thing you normally see on message boards!

Keep pointing out that you are happily married and not interested in an online courtship. Exactly: @Obtenebrator 's softcore gay porn. I tried to search it but it appears to have been lost with a lot of other messages from last year.

Agreed on strange and unusual, but it's indicative of Perry's feelings for you and explains why he is fascinated by you.

 

[Cypress]

Keep pointing out that you are happily married and not interested in an online courtship. Exactly: @Obtenebrator 's softcore gay porn. I tried to search it but it appears to have been lost with a lot of other messages from last year.

Agreed on strange and unusual, but it's indicative of Perry's feelings for you and explains why he is fascinated by you.

Most gay or bi-curious guys don't come on this strong. And I lived briefly in San Francisco! It seems like they can usually tell who is heterosexual, and just stick to playing their side of the field.
I don't know what Perry would do if I weren't here. Probably 70 percent of the threads he clicks on are mine, and 85 percent of the words he writes are posts to me. That is way off the edge of the map for standard message board etiquette!

 

[Dutch Uncle]

Most gay or bi-curious guys don't come on this strong. And I lived briefly in San Francisco! It seems like they can usually tell who is heterosexual, and just stick to playing their side of the field.
I don't know what Perry would do if I weren't here. Probably 70 percent of the threads he clicks on are mine, and 85 percent of the words he writes are posts to me. That is way off the edge of the map for standard message board etiquette!

Agreed. The issue here is that Perry both has homoerotic feelings and is also has mental issues. His wild claims of education and his obsession with being seen as the smartest person in the room are mental issues unrelated to his sexual desires.

If you weren't here, he'd go find someone similar. The fact he disappears from time to time is odd and indicative that he's either on other forums or loses his computer privileges from time to time. I have no doubt he's a "kept" person.

 

[Cypress]

Agreed. The issue here is that Perry both has homoerotic feelings and is also has mental issues. His wild claims of education and his obsession with being seen as the smartest person in the room are mental issues unrelated to his sexual desires.

If you weren't here, he'd go find someone similar. The fact he disappears from time to time is odd and indicative that he's either on other forums or loses his computer privileges from time to time. I have no doubt he's a "kept" person.

True, he probably would start complaining again that you supposedly dropped out of community college, and ranting about 'Gaugin in Tahiti"

I've never known anyone who claims to have a PhD who is so keen to prove how 'smart' he is to complete strangers who only have bachelors, masters, or high school degrees. The armchair psychologist might say there is a host of issues lurking in the background.

 

[Cypress]

good.

we can just leave it out of the christian Bible next time.

Jesus was a Jewish rabbi, and you need the OT just as reference material to understand how Jesus was an interpreter of Torah, and a teacher and interpreter of the message of social justice preached by the Hebrew prophets.