Gretatest Sports figures of Alltime

Bullshit! Ryan was plagued by poor run support throughout his career. In 72 he had a 2.28 era and was 19-16! In 81 he had a 1.69 era and almost half of his games were a loss or no decision! A pitcher cannot be judged objectively on his win-loss record alone because games are one by teams.

Ryan was a fucking specimen and his mechanics were perfection. Anyone who wants to know how to pitch should watch him and possibly no one else.
 
If anyone was going to add Justin Gatlin, the 100m world record holder, i wouldn't bother anymore.
 
RStringfield said:
Bullshit! Ryan was plagued by poor run support throughout his career. In 72 he had a 2.28 era and was 19-16! In 81 he had a 1.69 era and almost half of his games were a loss or no decision! A pitcher cannot be judged objectively on his win-loss record alone because games are one by teams.

Ryan was a fucking specimen and his mechanics were perfection. Anyone who wants to know how to pitch should watch him and possibly no one else.
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I think you should go back and I read what I said ... I agree that he was a great Hall of Fame Pitcher, no doubt about it! I just wouldnt list him amongst the top 10 or 15 greatest Pitchers. The year you cited was a good example where he did pitch great and was a victim of poor run support. But if you look at the 70's which was a low run scoring era, a Pitcher with an ERA in the high 3's is probably equal to a Pitcher in the high 4's today.. Nolan was in that range quite a bit.
Look at Fergie Jenkins, in 1974 he went 25-12 with 6 shutouts, 22 complete games and 2.8 ERA. His team won a total of 79 games.
In 1972 Steve Carlton went 27-10, 8 shutouts and a 1.92 ERA! His team won a total of 62 games! Now that may be one of the greatest years ever.
Wins dont mean everything but they do mean something.
 
Look at Ryan's win percentage compared against his teams win percentage then do the same for Carlton. They're almost identical. Ryan had a lower winning percentage than his team did 9 out of 25 years, Carlton 9 out of 20 years (in seasons where both apperared at least 20 times).

Wins are very important but you cannot judge a pitcher on them alone. The team behind you makes too much of a difference.
 
Cypress said:
Russel and Chamberlin were surrounded by talent.

Jordan was a one-man show. He carried the Bulls to six championships. The bulls supporting talent was way over rated.

Look at how well the allegedly "awesome" scottie pippen fared, without jordon in the mix.
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Ahahahaha, this really shows me you know nothing. Wilt WAS the team, he didn't have the great supporting cast that Russell did with the Celtics.
That changed way later on when Wilt was teamed with Jerry West in the Lakers, but for most of his career, he was the only decent player on his team.


And Jordan could not win it either until Scottie Pippen arrived. He also had the best rebounding help from Dennis Rodman, the best 3-point shooter in Steve Kerr, not to mention possibly the greatest coach in Phil Jackson.
PLENTY of talent on the bulls championship teams.
 
No list could ever be complete without the presence of the living legends of the darts world -

Phil 'The Power' Taylor
&
'The Crafty Cockney' Eric Bristow

Two more finely honed athletes you could not hope to meet.
 
charver said:
No list could ever be complete without the presence of the living legends of the darts world -

Phil 'The Power' Taylor
&
'The Crafty Cockney' Eric Bristow

Two more finely honed athletes you could not hope to meet.
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And ..still searching for Bobby Fisher ....
 
RStringfield said:
Look at Ryan's win percentage compared against his teams win percentage then do the same for Carlton. They're almost identical. Ryan had a lower winning percentage than his team did 9 out of 25 years, Carlton 9 out of 20 years (in seasons where both apperared at least 20 times).

Wins are very important but you cannot judge a pitcher on them alone. The team behind you makes too much of a difference.
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Lets look at it this way ....

If I were to rate the Pitchers of Nolan Ryans era ... he may not even break my top 5 ... seriously ...

The Pitchers I have already listed ...
Tom Seaver
Steve carlton
Fergie Jenkins
Catfish Hunter
Jim Palmer
Would all rate ahead... thats in my book .....

Now what about after Nolans era ...?

Roger Clemens
Randy Johnson
Pedro Martinez
Greg Maddox

imho ... Rate ahead ......


Before Nolan?

Bob Gibson
Sandy Koufax
Juan Marichal
Warren Spahn
Walter Johnson
Grover Alexander


Just to name a few ..... so that gives me 15 Pitchers that logically I could rate over Ryan.
 
Johnson and Martinez? No way! Maddux and Clemens, you could maybe make an argument. Johnson is easily rattled and has always been inconsistent. Of his era I would let Fergie and Seaver slide but none of the others.

I believe you mentioned Koufax in your original list and many make the comparison between the two, as Ryan broke many of his records and both were power pitchers.

Back on his win-loss record, in 87 Ryan lead the league with an ERA of 2.76 and strikeouts 270 at the age of 40. His record, 8-16. There is absolutely no doubt that he was plagued with crappy run support. His postseason performances were all solid but again he got screwed by his offense.

His last pitch, thrown with a torn ligament, was clocked at 98 miles an hour.

Nolan Ryan was the man. Tell me one guy that was more amazing to watch.

Some of Ryan's records

Most strikeouts, lifetime: 5714
Longest service: 27 years
Most no-hitters, career: 7
Most strikeouts, season: 383 (AL, 1973)
Most seasons, 200+ strikeouts: 15
Most seasons, 300+ strikeouts: 6
Most consecutive strikeouts, game: 8
Most low-hit (0/1 hit) games, career: 16
Most low-hit (0/1 hit) games, season: 3 (1973)
Most seasons leading majors, walks: 8
Most strikouts per 9 innings, season: 11.48
Most strikouts per 9 innings, career: 9.57 (as of 1990)
Fewest hits allowed per 9 innings, season: 5.26 (1972)
Fewest hits allowed per 9 innings, career: 6.41 (as of 1990)
Oldest to pitch a no-hitter: 44 (5/1/91)
Fastest pitch (as listed in the Guiness Book Of World Records): 101.9 MPH
 
Interesting about the 101.9 mph ... The Yankees Kyle Farnsworth was measured at 101 just yesterday ....

Johnson is easily rattled and has always been inconsistent? Maybe now at the ripe old age of 42 .. and early in his career just as Ryan was ... but come on .. the guy is a 5 time CY Young award winner! And was phenominal in the 2001 World Series against the Yankees. In 3 WS games he posted a 1.04 ERA! How many CY Youngs has Ryan won? (I know the answer)
Johnson also has a lifetime winning pct of .659 and an ERA of 3.11.
Ryan? .526 and 3.19
Again .. I think Ryan was great..and I really dont like shooting him down.. I just think there were quite a few who were greater.


As far as Koufax... he had a very short career ... his greatness was over a 6 year span ... his last 4 years he posted 25, 19, 26 and 27 wins with ERA's of 1.8,1.7, 2.0 and 1.7. He retired because he wanted to.. Imagine that..retiring after winning 27 games a 1.7 ERA and a World Series! lol!
 
No, he never won the CY. But look at his stats http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nolan_Ryan#Legacy. There are several CY worthy years except for the win-loss records. 72-74, 77 and 87 were all solid, CY worthy years. However, all of those teams were sub .500 and Ryan did not get support. 81 was another solid year but short.

Yes, Johnson is easily rattled. He throws fits on the mound and has breakdowns all the time.

Again Ryan's postseason starts were all solid, but he got poor support.

Wins are accomplished by teams, not by pitchers alone. And Ryan's best years were spent with lousy teams.

Now I am not saying he was better than Koufax. But Koufax had some great teams around him too. Koufax pitched 12 years but, like Ryan he struggled early in his career.
 
Randy Johnson?

LMAO....really, and especially if you include him while leaving a pitcher like Cy Young or even Nolan Ryan off the list.
 
dlescook said:
Randy Johnson?

LMAO....really, and especially if you include him while leaving a pitcher like Cy Young or even Nolan Ryan off the list.
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Well tell me why ... Why do you think its funny and why a 5 time winner of the CY Young Award does not belong on the list ....? And ...one who has never won the award ....(Best Pitcher) does belong ....

Har Har Har Har !!!!!
 
RStringfield said:
No, he never won the CY. But look at his stats http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nolan_Ryan#Legacy. Yes, Johnson is easily rattled. He throws fits on the mound and has breakdowns all the time.

Again Ryan's postseason starts were all solid, but he got poor support.

.
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perceptions ... I gave you the reasons and statistics demonstrating that this is not true. In the 2001 World Series against the Yankees, In 3 WS games he posted a 1.04 ERA
 
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