Historical military Leaders you admire!

Mott the Hoople said:
Sub par commander? You just simply don't know what the fuck you're talking about. Washington was witout a doubt one of the greatest, if not the greatest, leaders of the age of enlightenment. Not even the Duke of Marlboro can compare with Washington in terms of military accomplishment and his military and political legacy.

To say Washington "was a subpar commander" marks as a neophyte in the study of history, military and otherwise.

I mean that's a pull out of ass stupid kinda thing 3D used to say.
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When did I call Washington a sub-par commander?
 
Pelican said:
I approve of Charlemagne, Gaius Marius, Julius Caesar - but not Ghengis Khan. Sure, he might have been a brilliant strategist and warrior, but I wouldn't have liked to have met him or been anywhere near him during his time. I could almost say the same of Mao Zedong, but he would have been genuinely fascinating to talk to at least.
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Ghengis was supremely loyal and is reported to have been a great friend and very generous and kind. I'd honestly love to meet him.
 
Twerk Master Miley said:
Ghengis was supremely loyal and is reported to have been a great friend and very generous and kind. I'd honestly love to meet him.
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What sources suggest so?

Perhaps he was, but he was still capable of committing crimes judged horrific by Medieval Europe (whilst doing his damnedest to personally father the future population of Eurasia). I think I'd prefer to meet him in a straightjacket, in a room devoid of sharp objects.
 
Pelican said:
What sources suggest so?

Perhaps he was, but he was still capable of committing crimes judged horrific by Medieval Europe (whilst doing his damnedest to personally father the future population of Eurasia). I think I'd prefer to meet him in a straightjacket, in a room devoid of sharp objects.
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Well, several primary sources such as the Secret History of the Mongols (before mentioning bias, it's also highly critical of him in several areas and is overall impartial), and more modern ones such as the biography by Paul Ratchnevsky.

As for the judging of Europe, is this the same Europe that was at the same time launching the Crusades? Because if so (and it is, just so we're clear) their criticisms are moot. Ghengis was a great man in many ways, and personally very brilliant.
 
For me it's sort of a toss up between Dwight Eisnehower and Robert E Lee. Eisenhower presided over the entire US military system in a world war, and his military brilliance led us to a victory that we still enjoy today. In Lee's case, he was an excellent stratigist and leader, yet what I admire is that he was the most beloved general by his men in US history, before or after. That says a great deal about the calliber of man he was.
 
IWI Tavor said:
Well, several primary sources such as the Secret History of the Mongols (before mentioning bias, it's also highly critical of him in several areas and is overall impartial), and more modern ones such as the biography by Paul Ratchnevsky.
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Interesting, thanks.

IWI Tavor said:
As for the judging of Europe, is this the same Europe that was at the same time launching the Crusades? Because if so (and it is, just so we're clear) their criticisms are moot. Ghengis was a great man in many ways, and personally very brilliant.
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Brutal though the Crusades could be, their genocidal binges were not as devastating as the Mongolian campaigns. I'm not saying they had moral authority to judge.
 
Pelican said:
Interesting, thanks.


Brutal though the Crusades could be, their genocidal binges were not as devastating as the Mongolian campaigns. I'm not saying they had moral authority to judge.
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They were only less brutal because they were militarily inferior.
 
IWI Tavor said:
Well, several primary sources such as the Secret History of the Mongols (before mentioning bias, it's also highly critical of him in several areas and is overall impartial), and more modern ones such as the biography by Paul Ratchnevsky.

As for the judging of Europe, is this the same Europe that was at the same time launching the Crusades? Because if so (and it is, just so we're clear) their criticisms are moot. Ghengis was a great man in many ways, and personally very brilliant.
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Recommend any good reads on Timichin?
 
jet57 said:
For me it's sort of a toss up between Dwight Eisnehower and Robert E Lee. Eisenhower presided over the entire US military system in a world war, and his military brilliance led us to a victory that we still enjoy today. In Lee's case, he was an excellent stratigist and leader, yet what I admire is that he was the most beloved general by his men in US history, before or after. That says a great deal about the calliber of man he was.
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I don't see how anyone can think Lee was a great strategist? After all, he lost the war. I think the US military's greatest strategist were Winfield Scott and George Marshall.
 
Yes, Scott was the best of the 19th Century. He was respected in his time by those who read him in the same manner that Richard Henry Lee was in the 18th Century.
 
IWI Tavor said:
No he didn't...
That'd be Zhukov...
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Ah, yes: I should have the European operations. And Eisenhower's brilliance with D-Day did win the war for US. The Russians won Stalingrad, through shere numbers and were allowed by Eisenhower to take Berlin.
 
jet57 said:
Ah, yes: I should have the European operations. And Eisenhower's brilliance with D-Day did win the war for US. The Russians won Stalingrad, through shere numbers and were allowed by Eisenhower to take Berlin.
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Yeah, they won way more than Stalingrad. 7/8 Germans killed were killed by the Red Army. It's pretty much accepted fact that the Red Army broke Germany. D-Day PALES in comparison to Kursk, or Stalingrad, or Operation Bagration.
 
IWI Tavor said:
Yeah, they won way more than Stalingrad. 7/8 Germans killed were killed by the Red Army. It's pretty much accepted fact that the Red Army broke Germany. D-Day PALES in comparison to Kursk, or Stalingrad, or Operation Bagration.
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I am very well versed in WWII and have never heard that before. Perhaps you can cite some sources.
 
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