How Disgusting Are Big Corporations?

Flash said:
Agreed, my point being that pollution levels, for example, are not a factor of capitalism or socialism but level of industrialization and political system.

Nations with highest pollution levels:

China
United States
European Union (28 nations)
India
Russia
Japan
Germany
South Korea
Iran
Saudi Arabia
Canada
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Germany is part of the EU. We'd have a lot less pollution if the righties wouldn't keep rolling back the regulations.

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rjhenn said:
Germany is part of the EU. We'd have a lot less pollution if the righties wouldn't keep rolling back the regulations.
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Right. The list included each EU nation separately and as a group. Some of the regulations are helpful and some accomplish nothing. There have still been tremendous improvements since 100 years ago.

My response to the original post is that having a capitalist or socialist economic system does not determine things like pollution level, worker health and safety, worker participation, quality of products, cost, etc. So, having socialist rather than capitalist industries does not improve anything because of the profit incentive which also applies to socialist institutions.
 
rjhenn said:
"Qualified" didn't matter. She had all that dirt, whether real or imagined, that she was dragging behind her. Plus there was that army of Russian bots spreading disinformation about her, and touting Trump.

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No dirt at all. The method used is they attack her and investigate her nonstop until people slowly start to think, "if there is smoke there must be a fire'. She has never been guilty of anything and has not been charged. She is innocent. But the people are suspicious. As Mccarthy said "we are investigating to hurt her polling and it works". Some rightys are nuts enough to believe she killed 50 people. There are some scary rightys running around getting stupider every day as they read right-wing crap.
 
rjhenn said:
"Qualified" didn't matter. She had all that dirt, whether real or imagined, that she was dragging behind her. Plus there was that army of Russian bots spreading disinformation about her, and touting Trump.

Sent from my SM-G950U using Tapatalk
Click to expand...

No dirt at all. The method used is they attack her and investigate her nonstop until people slowly start to think, "if there is smoke there must be a fire'. She has never been guilty of anything and has not been charged. She is innocent. But the people are suspicious. As Mccarthy said "we are investigating to hurt her polling and it works". Some rightys are nuts enough to believe she killed 50 people. There are some scary rightys running around getting stupider every day as they read right-wing crap.
 
Gonzomin said:
No dirt at all. The method used is they attack her and investigate her nonstop until people slowly start to think, "if there is smoke there must be a fire'. She has never been guilty of anything and has not been charged. She is innocent. But the people are suspicious. As Mccarthy said "we are investigating to hurt her polling and it works". Some rightys are nuts enough to believe she killed 50 people. There are some scary rightys running around getting stupider every day as they read right-wing crap.
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no. that's the globalist deep state clintonista m.o. against trump. you're projecting again.
 
AssHatZombie said:
apparently you don't get out much.
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Back to your bunker. I get out plenty. You are a conspiracy nut and believe every word uttered by the biggest liar ever in office and whatever his people say. You should wonder about that because it is about you in the end.
The investigation has had many people interviewed and they are nearly as one about Trump's lying and weaseling in Ukraine. This is no normal presidency. We expected much more from previous presidents. Will our wanting someone with dignity and class who does not lie ever come back.or has the presidency been cheapened and debased forever?

The English have been contacted by Trumpies wanting them to do as the Ukraine was asked. They were shocked to find Trump wanted a way to savage the American intelligence. I suppose you like that too.
 
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PoliTalker said:
Hello Trumpet,



Yes, the GOP is the political arm of big money corporate greed.
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Of course that's why Wall Street supported Hillary Clinton with far greater donations of loot than they did Trump, huh? "Loving eyes never see!"
 
PoliTalker said:
Let us take a moment to recap what big corporations have done for us, shall we?

I can think of a few examples. I'm sure you can add more.

Basically, the decision-making is all about increasing profits; all else takes on far less priority. And how is that working out for us?

PG&E, the same company that gave us drinking water laced with Hexavalent Chromium:

"From 1952 to 1966, Pacific Gas and Electric Company (PG&E) dumped about 370 million gallons of chromium-tainted wastewater into unlined wastewater spreading ponds around the town of Hinkley, California, located in the Mojave Desert (about 120 miles north-northeast of Los Angeles).[1][2]

PG&E used chromium 6, or hexavalent chromium (a cheap and efficient rust suppressor), in its compressor station for natural-gas transmission pipelines.[1]:[3] Hexavalent-chromium compounds are genotoxic carcinogens.

In 1993, legal clerk Erin Brockovich began an investigation into the health impacts of the contamination. A class-action lawsuit about the contamination was settled in 1996 for $333 million, the largest settlement of a direct-action lawsuit in U.S. history. In 2008, PG&E settled the last of the cases involved with the Hinkley claims. Since then, the town's population has dwindled to the point that in 2016 The New York Times described Hinkley as having slowly become a ghost town.[4][5] " (wiki)

That same company is now in big trouble for PG&E wild fires being caused by it's equipment, which is not made to resist the normal winds of the dry season in the tinder-box of California.

Boeing made decisions which resulted in two 737MAX airliner crashes which killed 300 people. This is the same company which narrowly averted loss of life due to 787 battery fires. The rush to profits prevented safe measures.

Volkswagon decided emissions regulations were just too onerous to allow enough profits, so they cheated the entire world out of cleaner air for more money.

Dupont killed more people than 911 in India with a gas leak from a pesticide plant. Safety regulations were bypassed to save money.

Bayer-Monsanto decided to sell the same chemicals used in Agent Orange for domestic weed control. Who could possibly have predicted that would not end well? They just settled a huge lawsuit after a worker using their product got cancer. That was only one case, with others sure to follow. btw, they also use the same thing on our food crops. Yummy!

Amazon placed ambulances outside it's warehouse because there was no air conditioning, and the inside temperatures soared as high as 115 degrees, but workers there were not allowed to slow down or take a break. Also, if any dropped and had to be stretchered off, more workers were on call and waiting to take their place. Anyone who refused lost their job. The owner of Amazon is the third richest man in the world.

The Koch Brothers corporation knew there was lots of money to be made in the fossil fuel industry if only the public sentiment did not embrace a mass movement toward the green movement. So they embarked on a very effective mass PR effort to cloud the debate over climate change.

Perdue Pharma decided to become a 'legal' drug pusher. They heavily marketed oxycontin and other pain medications, which resulted in getting a lot of people addicted, leading to destroyed lives, families and fortunes. But the Sackler family got incredibly rich.

ENRON corporation, along with Arthur Anderson Accounting, pulled off a mass deception which made it's stock appear to be a really good deal. Many Americans bought in. They got ripped off, the books were cooked and most investors lost nearly everything.

The Tobacco Industry marketed cigarettes to children. Get 'em hooked while they are young and you have a customer for life. Well, as long as that life lasts.

The Auto Industry resisted installing seat belts and other safety related measures. Ralph Nader had to shame them into it. Safety improved.

The White Star Line rushed the completion of the Titanic in a bid to have the fastest most luxurious 'unsinkable' ships on the seas. We know how that ended. Speaking of a mighty ship sinking,

The Trump Organization defrauded 'students' of Trump University, promising them the secrets of wealth. The lesson they got instead was that the wealthy get that way by extracting wealth from the non-wealthy, any way they can. Lying is just as good a method as any. Trump settled for $25 Million to avoid the bad PR of a scandalous well publicized court trial. This was no one-time slip up. Instead, this was indicative of business as usual for that organization, with MANY such digressions having come to light since Trump took such a high-profile position as President of the USA.

I could go on and on. I'm sure you can add more to this brief list. The bottom line is we cannot trust big corporations to have our better interest in mind as they pursue more profits. We must have a powerful government with strong regulations to protect ourselves and the planet from this institutionalized greed.

Anybody who thinks government should just 'get out of the way' and let capitalism deliver for us? We should be asking them exactly WHAT they expect capitalism to deliver!

Capitalism is a way for people with capital to get rich. That's it. Capitalism does not provide for our needs and does not have our backs. Instead, we have to WATCH our backs with capitalism around.

Now, I am not saying we should get rid of capitalism. Conservatives should be sure to ignore my words here. We do not have to choose between capitalism and socialism. We need capitalism for all the good things it produces. Products, services, reasonable profits - these are good things! But capitalism has no reason to take care of people in need. That's why we have socialism. So we can 'Promote the General Welfare,' and 'Promote Domestic Tranquility.'

Our challenge is not to choose between capitalism and socialism. It is to strike the correct balance between the two. (Conservatives should completely ignore that and continue to argue as if it is a choice and we can only have one system.) Admitting reality is not conservative's strong suit.
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Of course what you reveal is "crony capitalism" not true capitalism. Crony capitalism is when the corporations write the regulatory laws and have their crony politicians pass them into law with donations to the politician's campaign coffers and offers of lucrative jobs as lobbyist should they ever get voted out of office or retire on the taxpayer's dime. You need to take note that the DEMOCRAT PARTY is the most notorious passer of regulation laws and allowing their un-elected bureaucrats add to them to butter up their corporate crony pals.
 
Robo said:
Of course what you reveal is "crony capitalism" not true capitalism. Crony capitalism is when the corporations write the regulatory laws and have their crony politicians pass them into law with donations to the politician's campaign coffers and offers of lucrative jobs as lobbyist should they ever get voted out of office or retire on the taxpayer's dime. You need to take note that the DEMOCRAT PARTY is the most notorious passer of regulation laws and allowing their un-elected bureaucrats add to them to butter up their corporate crony pals.
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yes. this is referred to also as state capture. itsa problem.

the truth is only small ventures are not "crony".

I would posit that "free markets" are just as delusory any marxist utopia. take that internationalist fascists.

left / right is an invented false dichotomy psyop. there are the rich and powerful, and the not rich and powerful. and actually people can accept that. but we need to come together and push back when we have concrete proof that the rich and powerful want to kill the rest of us.

that proof is un agenda 21, and the insane classification of co2 as a pollutant, literally robbing us of our right to breathe.
 
Hello cawacko,

cawacko said:
An acquaintance wrote this article for our local PBS channel. He's a small businesses owner in San Francisco and a political liberal. Folks here are against big corporations but do people support small businesses? Here's a real life example of what excessive regulation can do.


Fees. Taxes. Red Tape.

Small business has always been a vital part of urban economies, but bar-owner Ben Bleiman says San Francisco is doing its best to bury it in fees, taxes and regulation.

Joni Mitchell once sang, “Don’t it always seem to go…that you don’t know what you got, til it’s gone.”

Imagine your favorite San Francisco neighborhood without small business. No bakery. No taqueria. No pizza parlor. No book store. Just dead storefront after dead storefront lining your community like tombstones.

I’ve owned ten bars and restaurants in SF for more than a decade, and I need you all to hear me: We are dying. North Beach has 36% storefront vacancies. In the Castro entire blocks are nearly empty. Three major restaurants closed their doors in South Beach last month. Walk down once bustling Union Street on a Thursday night at 8 pm and it’s as creepy as a zombie movie.

How’d things get so bad? It’s a boomtime, right? People blame greedy landlords and Millennial buying habits, but I don’t. I blame City Hall.

For the past decade city leaders have skyrocketed our expenses. Higher fees. Higher taxes. More legislation targeting us. And more red tape, adding to a permitting process and planning code that rival the Soviet Union in complexity and irrationality. Restaurant payrolls alone have gone up 52% in the last five years on average. You don’t need a degree in economics to know what effect that has on a mom-and-pop business.

Meanwhile, the City doesn’t live up to even its most basic responsibilities to us. The streets are filthy and dangerous. Permitting departments routinely lose our applications and refuse to return our calls. Our once-lean planning code subjects our businesses to months of public hearings and thousands of dollars of expenses.

What can small business do? We just raise our prices and pray. No wonder online retailers and blood sucking gig economy companies are eating us alive. After taxes, fees and tip, a burger and a beer at my dive bar costs $27. We have Norwegian prices without any of their social services!

It’s time City Hall started offering solutions for small business instead of more problems. No more fees or taxes that force our prices endlessly up. Streamline our permitting process and planning code. And pass legislation that boosts small business instead of destroying it.

Otherwise, the next string of vacancies may be in your neighborhood.

With a Perspective, I’m Ben Bleiman.

Ben Bleiman is a bar owner and small business advocate in San Francisco.

https://www.kqed.org/perspectives/201601139229/fees-taxes-red-tape
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That sounds like a credible complaint. Gentrification kills communities. I am not fully informed on why that city has done the things it has done, but to listen to this perspective, it sounds like they are on a bad trajectory.

This is right out of the big corporation playbook. Massive corporations can absorb fees and regulatory processes that kill small business. It has happened time and time again. Many regulations are actually written by the lobbyists of big corporations.
 
Hi Flash,

Flash said:
A communist nation has a socialist economic system.
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Not exclusively true. Cuba and China both have free market systems in place alongside their socialism.

Flash said:
When was the government ever subservient to the people?

Based on corporate campaign contributions the Democrats and Republicans seem equally friendly with the corporations.
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Most Americans do not identify as Democrats or Republicans. Most Americans say they are members of neither party. We are roughly 30% Dem, 30% Rep, and 40% Independent.
 
Hi Flash,

Flash said:
Right. The list included each EU nation separately and as a group. Some of the regulations are helpful and some accomplish nothing. There have still been tremendous improvements since 100 years ago.

My response to the original post is that having a capitalist or socialist economic system does not determine things like pollution level, worker health and safety, worker participation, quality of products, cost, etc. So, having socialist rather than capitalist industries does not improve anything because of the profit incentive which also applies to socialist institutions.
Click to expand...

The thing that most people get wrong is believing we have to choose between capitalism and socialism.

Where is it written or commanded that such a choice must be made?

Virtually every nation on Earth has a combination of the two.

The trick is to get the balance correct.

We will forever be hopeless to solve a problem if we can't even properly identify it.
 
PoliTalker said:
Hello cawacko,



That sounds like a credible complaint. Gentrification kills communities. I am not fully informed on why that city has done the things it has done, but to listen to this perspective, it sounds like they are on a bad trajectory.

This is right out of the big corporation playbook. Massive corporations can absorb fees and regulatory processes that kill small business. It has happened time and time again. Many regulations are actually written by the lobbyists of big corporations.
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I want you to stop buying anything produced by corporations. Also stop purchasing any services corporations provide. That'll show them!!! ;)
 
Greedy Corporation Trick number 4733:

Have you noticed changes in fast food?

It used to be that you could get a burger for one price, and then add cheese if you like, for an extra upcharge. Fair enough. Seems reasonable, right?

Well, get ready for greed based fast food.

Now the cheese is included and the price is already higher. And if you want the item without cheese, no discount. You pay for it whether you want it or not.

Not all restaurants are doing this, but this is the new greedy corporation trick, and it is catching on.

If we don't care, they will all be doing it soon enough.

All we can do is identify the restaurants which do this and stop shopping there. That is the only thing they care about.
 
I also wonder if that is really cheese or not.

When you buy real cheese at a grocery store and put it on a burger it tastes different than the 'cheese' at a fast food restaurant.

One time, I was on a business trip. I had what I thought was a cool idea. I went to a mid grade sit-down restaurant for dinner and got a salad bar to go deal. That's where they give you a styrofoam clam shell and you can load it up at the salad bar and pay a set price. OK, fine. I did that and made a meal of it. I was also thinking ahead and got some extra 'cheese.' It was the shredded cheese you can sprinkle on your salad. I wanted some cheese so I could use it the next morning at the hotel 'free' breakfast that you pay for in the price of the hotel. It's a trick I have often used, much to the envy of other hotel patrons at the breakfast tables as they look over and see my 'scrambled eggs' with bits of steak, salza, peppers and things I have saved from a meal the night before in the hotel room fridge.

OK, so I took some of this 'cheese' and tried to use it on the 'scrambled eggs' the next morning.

It was disgusting. It didn't taste like cheese at all, and it hardly melted in the micro-nuke.

Greedy Corporation Trick number 4734:

Not everything that looks like cheese is really cheese.

What a cheesy trick!

They are selling something that looks like food but it probably has no nutritional value at all.
 
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