Inalienable Rights And Things That Are Not

domer76 said:
This is your quote, hole:

"Prove that my inalienable rights do not come from who I say is my creator."

Then, who IS your creator?
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I don't have to prove that your inalienable rights DO NOT come from who you say they do commie, because that's exactly who they do come from. Your ignorance and stupidity confiscate your common sense and rational understanding, but that's normal for brainwashed neo-communist progressive morons!
 
Robo said:
I don't have to prove that your inalienable rights DO NOT come from who you say they do commie, because that's exactly who they do come from. Your ignorance and stupidity confiscate your common sense and rational understanding, but that's normal for brainwashed neo-communist progressive morons!
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"Commie"? Pretty fucking funny, asswipe.

Inalienable rights? Who gave you those, punk? Your "creator"? Do the refugees possess the same inalienable rights?
 
domer76 said:
Do the refugees possess the same inalienable rights?
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No.

The concept of un/inalienable rights is pointless unless a people are coming together to form a system of governance based on specific foundational premises.

a) all governmental power is derived from the people.
b) government possesses only the limited powers expressly conferred (surrendered) to it, by the people.
c) there exist certain powers over one's self that are too important to ever be surrendered to the care or control of another person (un/inalienable rights)
d) no legitimate government (one established to protect the rights of the people) would accept the surrender of those rights even if it was offered.
e) government only exercises those limited powers with the consent of the people.
f) if the government ever exceeds the power granted to it, the people retain the right to rescind that consent to be governed, reclaim the powers originally granted to government and unseat the usurpers (with violence if necessary).​

When one is arguing against the "existence" of inalienable rights you should remember that when the concept was introduced, it stood in opposition to the system of governance based on a King's unquestionable, "divine right" to rule over his subjects . . . And we won.

I find it amusing that those arguing today against the fundamental principles of the COTUS are usually adherents to communitarian / collectivist ideals, which wouldn't make their appearance for 200 or so more years.

IOW, Marx wasn't a founding father.
 
Abatis said:
No.

The concept of un/inalienable rights is pointless unless a people are coming together to form a system of governance based on specific foundational premises.

a) all governmental power is derived from the people.
b) government possesses only the limited powers expressly conferred (surrendered) to it, by the people.
c) there exist certain powers over one's self that are too important to ever be surrendered to the care or control of another person (un/inalienable rights)
d) no legitimate government (one established to protect the rights of the people) would accept the surrender of those rights even if it was offered.
e) government only exercises those limited powers with the consent of the people.
f) if the government ever exceeds the power granted to it, the people retain the right to rescind that consent to be governed, reclaim the powers originally granted to government and unseat the usurpers (with violence if necessary).​

When one is arguing against the "existence" of inalienable rights you should remember that when the concept was introduced, it stood in opposition to the system of governance based on a King's unquestionable, "divine right" to rule over his subjects . . . And we won.

I find it amusing that those arguing today against the fundamental principles of the COTUS are usually adherents to communitarian / collectivist ideals, which wouldn't make their appearance for 200 or so more years.

IOW, Marx wasn't a founding father.
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The most amazing thing about the progressive left is the fact that the majority of them don't even know their ideological agenda is no less than the (NEW) communism/neo-communism.
 
Making sure Americans have proper health care makes sense economically, and we are a nation based upon Judeo Christian values, so insuring all Americans have health care is in out best interests
 
jazz10 said:
Making sure Americans have proper health care makes sense economically, and we are a nation based upon Judeo Christian values, so insuring all Americans have health care is in out best interests
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Then feel free to provide it personally to anyone of your choosing and with your own money. That's what Judeo Christian values are based on. They aren't based on you getting the government to force others to fund it for them. Let them provide it to themselves or get a bleeding heart like you to provide it to them OR do without.
 
CFM said:
Then feel free to provide it personally to anyone of your choosing and with your own money. That's what Judeo Christian values are based on. They aren't based on you getting the government to force others to fund it for them. Let them provide it to themselves or get a bleeding heart like you to provide it to them OR do without.
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Stupid fuck. You are providing health care for others whether you want to or not. All those that use the ER as their primary health care because they are uninsured comes out of your pocket. At much higher rates than if they otherwise possessed insurance.

You're just too fucking stupid to recognize that.
 
Robo said:
The most amazing thing about the progressive left is the fact that the majority of them don't even know their ideological agenda is no less than the (NEW) communism/neo-communism.
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The entire agenda of social, cultural and economic "rights" that they advocate for, is a product of Marxist / Leninist thought. The problem is this embracing of 2nd generation rights and the position that they are obligations of the US government to provide under the Constitution, demands the abrogation of the Constitution and a perversion of the rights theory the Constitution is founded upon.

It is the reason they misrepresent and scheme against the Constitution or just act as if it has no impact on the operation of government.

jazz10 said:
Making sure Americans have proper health care makes sense economically, and we are a nation based upon Judeo Christian values, so insuring all Americans have health care is in out best interests
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Make that case and get a uniformly accepted bill passed . . . Just do not call it a "right".
 
jazz10 said:
Making sure Americans have proper health care makes sense economically, and we are a nation based upon Judeo Christian values, so insuring all Americans have health care is in out best interests
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All Americans and anybody and everybody on American soil do have healthcare. Nobody gets turned away from a hospital emergency room. The 10th amendment to our Constitution guarantees the power to provide healthcare at taxpayer's expense or not to the States and prohibits the federal government to be involved in it.
 
Robo said:
All Americans and anybody and everybody on American soil do have healthcare. Nobody gets turned away from a hospital emergency room. The 10th amendment to our Constitution guarantees the power to provide healthcare at taxpayer's expense or not to the States and prohibits the federal government to be involved in it.
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There it is folks. The admission that Robo IS paying for others' health care.
 
domer76 said:
There it is folks. The admission that Robo IS paying for others' health care.
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Much more than otherwise since the federal government started fucking around in it. Yesteryear in less socialist and more sane times, hospitals and doctors operated low pay and no pay charitable clinics also supported by other charities for the poor, destitute and those unable to pay through no fault of their own. The federal and State's takeover of healthcare has simply run up the cost for everybody and eliminated the free market charitable institutions. Just more evidence that BIG government doesn't solve problems, BIG government is the problem.
 
Robo said:
The most amazing thing about the progressive left is the fact that the majority of them don't even know their ideological agenda is no less than the (NEW) communism/neo-communism.
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They know it; most are just careful to never admit it.
 
domer76 said:
Stupid fuck. You are providing health care for others whether you want to or not. All those that use the ER as their primary health care because they are uninsured comes out of your pocket. At much higher rates than if they otherwise possessed insurance.

You're just too fucking stupid to recognize that.
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You mean the insurance that people now buy with subsidies funded by the same people that paid for their ER visits? That's why I said what I said. Stop the ER bullshit, let you pay for the insurance you think they deserve, and we both get what we want. I no longer help pay for someone else's healthcare, which isn't my responsibility to start with, and they get covered with it paid for by a bleeding heart like you that thinks they deserve it.

If you think one person should be forced to pay for another person's healthcare, you're the stupid fuck. I say that if they can't pay and you won't voluntary do it for them, let them go without.
 
domer76 said:
There it is folks. The admission that Robo IS paying for others' health care.
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And it should stop NOW unless you're willing to voluntarily do it on their behalf with your money.

There's a big difference in whether something is happening and whether it should continue to happen.
 
Here's my solution to the healthcare issue in America.

The left is hell bent on a Single Payer, socialist BIG government system to provide healthcare for everybody.

The right is hell bent on a free market system of healthcare.

SOLUTION: The States, (should they choose) set up a voluntary Single Payer system for the lefties whereby all of the lefties that want Single Payer can donate freely to a State fund to pay for healthcare for card carrying lefties. People who donate to the fund get a "Lefty Single Payer" card to present to hospitals and doctors when they need healthcare. People without those cards are otherwise subjected to participate freely in the private insurance market whereby they can buy healthcare coverage for themselves and their families from anywhere, any state and any insurance market they choose.

Of course it wouldn't ever work, because lefties wouldn't donate for their coverage unless they could mandate by the strong arm of forceful government that everybody MUST share their healthcare cost with them.
 
Robo said:
Here's my solution to the healthcare issue in America.

The left is hell bent on a Single Payer, socialist BIG government system to provide healthcare for everybody.

The right is hell bent on a free market system of healthcare.

SOLUTION: The States, (should they choose) set up a voluntary Single Payer system for the lefties whereby all of the lefties that want Single Payer can donate freely to a State fund to pay for healthcare for card carrying lefties. People who donate to the fund get a "Lefty Single Payer" card to present to hospitals and doctors when they need healthcare. People without those cards are otherwise subjected to participate freely in the private insurance market whereby they can buy healthcare coverage for themselves and their families from anywhere, any state and any insurance market they choose.

Of course it wouldn't ever work, because lefties wouldn't donate for their coverage unless they could mandate by the strong arm of forceful government that everybody MUST share their healthcare cost with them.
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If you know i won't work, why propose it?
 
healthcare is an inalienable right.

The notion of an inalienable right endowed by the Creator as expressed in the Declaration is, ultimately, a religious belief. As such it has no Constitutional standing and is not an axiom of liberal (much less Marxist!) ideology.

Healthcare, like clean water or public education, is an entitlement (not a right) established under law. The law giveth and the law can taketh away.

 
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