Jesus
- Thread starter Brent
- Start date
AnyOldIron
Atheist Missionary
Revolutionary itinerant philosopher who was diefied after his death by his followers.
AnyOldIron
Atheist Missionary
What do you think Brent? lol
FUCK THE POLICE
911 EVERY DAY
You're using bad grammar again, Brent. You don't capitalize "son" in "son of God". "Son" isn't part of his name. "God" may be capitlalized, because that is a reference to a person.
AnyOldIron
Atheist Missionary
"God" may be capitlalized, because that is a reference to a person.
That's disputable....
That's disputable....
charver
You lookin' at my pint?
Don't be silly.
Everyone knows Jesus was the Greek bloke who sailed off to find the Golden Fleece, in far-off Kolchis, with a bunch of his mates in an old ship, the Argo, having many adventures and japes in the process, i might add.
But now you can make Jesus into anyone you want to, here.
http://www.jesusdressup.com/#
Everyone knows Jesus was the Greek bloke who sailed off to find the Golden Fleece, in far-off Kolchis, with a bunch of his mates in an old ship, the Argo, having many adventures and japes in the process, i might add.
But now you can make Jesus into anyone you want to, here.
http://www.jesusdressup.com/#
uscitizen
Villified User
Abolutely, Even among the believers is god a person ?
He wants you to call him Father... I guess that would mean he wants to be spoken to as a person.
Let's ask an expert! Um... Who is an expert on what God wants? Roger Waters?
Well, as a Total Believer 
in this entire one God thingy...to me,
Jesus was a human, that tried to show us, what it would be like for us to be Perfect.
This was the difference in my very humble opinion between the Old Testament and the Gospel of Jesus Christ....setting aside that Christ died for all of our Salvation...which falls more in to the Spiritual side of the Gospel...,
is... that the Old Testament was a relationship between God and corrupt 'man'...A Great Deal of it involved instructions on how to handle their constant evilness...if there is such a word...
It was about dealing with the actions of man at the time...kinda like a history book...well, man kept f-ing up....wars, murders, rapes, incest, thievery etc...and alot of the old testament is God correcting and repremanding these people that just turn their back constanly on what is right and just....
Then these people even continued to mess up by taking some of God's instruction on what was right and wrong, like the 10 commandments and started overly issuing laws that OVER PUNISHED the guilty of breaking the Law and even became vindictive with their punishments...
So then they were corrected again for it with NEW LAWS of fairness...basically "An eye for an eye"... you all may think, because you do not know the Bible, that an eye for an eye, a tooth for a tooth, a life for a life is God teaching the Jews to be vindictive or something, but it was the COMPLETE OPPOSITE....those rules were to STOP the jews from punishing people UNFAIRLY, which they were doing.
An eye for an eye, a tooth for a tooth...was to LIMIT THE JEWS IN THEIR EXCESSIVE punishments that they were putting upon the people that broke the 10 commandments...and God taught them, TRUE JUSTICE AND FAIRNESS.
-------------------------------------------------------------
What Jesus taught us on Earth... is how to be perfect in our behavior, thus needing NO LAW on how to repremand us...
For example: When Jesus said that instead on an eye for an eye, a tooth for a tooth, we should turn the other cheek when struck by someone, and go ahead and walk an extra mile with the adversary that forced you to walk the first mile with him...He also said that we were to love thy enemy...He said to do these things to be perfect, as God would love to see us act, and He also said that this kindness and submission in turn... would be like burning coals on the adversary's or enemy's head...thus changing the adversary's mean spiritedness, through kindness and not through war or vindictiveness or punishment.
Then someone challenges Jesus on this, and paraphrased said...wait, wait, wait...what about God's "An eye for an eye, a tooth for a tooth ....yahdeedah"...are you telling us that this goes away?" And Jesus basically said, an eye for an eye laws will not go away, (basically because he knew that man was NOT PERFECT and would not be able to turn the cheek and evil would continue) but He was telling them what being perfect would bring us...peace.
I can give a thousand other examples where Jesus shows these people another way...other than the LAW that they were following....following basically in the WRONG MANNER, not truely understanding the meaning of the Law...
The Good Samaritan Parable, the Priest and the Levite religious heads passed the hurt man by, and it is presumed this is because they had laws that ruled the religious heads as the levite and the priest...against touching an UNCLEAN man...
But Jesus taught...rules, schmools crap is for the Birds, that they were NOT interpreting the Word of God in the manner that the Word was intended...ESPECIALLY IF THEY COULD PASS A DYING MAN ON THE SIDE OF THE ROAD AND NOT HELP HIM...then they were clueless to understanding the Law and why it was in place....and he said the Samaritan man, (thought of as the scum of the Earth by the Jews at the time), was the one that did God's will and acted perfect, (even though the Samaritan WAS NOT ONE of the CHOSEN PEOPLE'S tribe), by loving his enemy and neighbor as himself.
And then there is the example of the Adulteress being stoned to death in the public square....and Jesus's lesson there where these men were follow the Law so they thought, by stoning her to death....but Jesus did not tell them not to stone her to death, He did not tell them DON'T FOLLOW THE LAW....he said, paraphrased, go ahead and cast the first Stone against her, as you are suppose to according to the Law you follow, but I tell you do such, if you are free from sin or maybe even implied "this sin" yourself....
So Jesus was teaching that the Law should be followed, but on a completely fair basis...don't go and point fingers at others and punishing others for wrongs, unless you are squeeky clean as a whistle yourself....He taught fairness in this....
He also taught "forgiveness" in this....He sent the woman off and told her that He forgave her, before he told her to sin no more....so He gave forgiveness before repenting, before she changed her life....
There is a ton of this kind of stuff in there by Jesus...so final answer, Jesus is "perfect man".....He was sent here to show us the true meaning of God's fairness teachings for man and He was also sent to teach us what it would be like to be perfect. (setting aside salvation aspect of it)
care
in this entire one God thingy...to me,Jesus was a human, that tried to show us, what it would be like for us to be Perfect.
This was the difference in my very humble opinion between the Old Testament and the Gospel of Jesus Christ....setting aside that Christ died for all of our Salvation...which falls more in to the Spiritual side of the Gospel...,
is... that the Old Testament was a relationship between God and corrupt 'man'...A Great Deal of it involved instructions on how to handle their constant evilness...if there is such a word...
It was about dealing with the actions of man at the time...kinda like a history book...well, man kept f-ing up....wars, murders, rapes, incest, thievery etc...and alot of the old testament is God correcting and repremanding these people that just turn their back constanly on what is right and just....
Then these people even continued to mess up by taking some of God's instruction on what was right and wrong, like the 10 commandments and started overly issuing laws that OVER PUNISHED the guilty of breaking the Law and even became vindictive with their punishments...
So then they were corrected again for it with NEW LAWS of fairness...basically "An eye for an eye"... you all may think, because you do not know the Bible, that an eye for an eye, a tooth for a tooth, a life for a life is God teaching the Jews to be vindictive or something, but it was the COMPLETE OPPOSITE....those rules were to STOP the jews from punishing people UNFAIRLY, which they were doing.
An eye for an eye, a tooth for a tooth...was to LIMIT THE JEWS IN THEIR EXCESSIVE punishments that they were putting upon the people that broke the 10 commandments...and God taught them, TRUE JUSTICE AND FAIRNESS.
-------------------------------------------------------------
What Jesus taught us on Earth... is how to be perfect in our behavior, thus needing NO LAW on how to repremand us...
For example: When Jesus said that instead on an eye for an eye, a tooth for a tooth, we should turn the other cheek when struck by someone, and go ahead and walk an extra mile with the adversary that forced you to walk the first mile with him...He also said that we were to love thy enemy...He said to do these things to be perfect, as God would love to see us act, and He also said that this kindness and submission in turn... would be like burning coals on the adversary's or enemy's head...thus changing the adversary's mean spiritedness, through kindness and not through war or vindictiveness or punishment.
Then someone challenges Jesus on this, and paraphrased said...wait, wait, wait...what about God's "An eye for an eye, a tooth for a tooth ....yahdeedah"...are you telling us that this goes away?" And Jesus basically said, an eye for an eye laws will not go away, (basically because he knew that man was NOT PERFECT and would not be able to turn the cheek and evil would continue) but He was telling them what being perfect would bring us...peace.
I can give a thousand other examples where Jesus shows these people another way...other than the LAW that they were following....following basically in the WRONG MANNER, not truely understanding the meaning of the Law...
The Good Samaritan Parable, the Priest and the Levite religious heads passed the hurt man by, and it is presumed this is because they had laws that ruled the religious heads as the levite and the priest...against touching an UNCLEAN man...
But Jesus taught...rules, schmools crap is for the Birds, that they were NOT interpreting the Word of God in the manner that the Word was intended...ESPECIALLY IF THEY COULD PASS A DYING MAN ON THE SIDE OF THE ROAD AND NOT HELP HIM...then they were clueless to understanding the Law and why it was in place....and he said the Samaritan man, (thought of as the scum of the Earth by the Jews at the time), was the one that did God's will and acted perfect, (even though the Samaritan WAS NOT ONE of the CHOSEN PEOPLE'S tribe), by loving his enemy and neighbor as himself.
And then there is the example of the Adulteress being stoned to death in the public square....and Jesus's lesson there where these men were follow the Law so they thought, by stoning her to death....but Jesus did not tell them not to stone her to death, He did not tell them DON'T FOLLOW THE LAW....he said, paraphrased, go ahead and cast the first Stone against her, as you are suppose to according to the Law you follow, but I tell you do such, if you are free from sin or maybe even implied "this sin" yourself....
So Jesus was teaching that the Law should be followed, but on a completely fair basis...don't go and point fingers at others and punishing others for wrongs, unless you are squeeky clean as a whistle yourself....He taught fairness in this....
He also taught "forgiveness" in this....He sent the woman off and told her that He forgave her, before he told her to sin no more....so He gave forgiveness before repenting, before she changed her life....
There is a ton of this kind of stuff in there by Jesus...so final answer, Jesus is "perfect man".....He was sent here to show us the true meaning of God's fairness teachings for man and He was also sent to teach us what it would be like to be perfect. (setting aside salvation aspect of it)
care
uscitizen
Villified User
Good post Care, My only disagreement wis the concept that jesus was perfect. He suffered temptations and such. for isnstnce he asked God if this cup could not pass him by. But he faced up to his duty as he saw it. He was a very good, kind and gentle man, but he was a man so I respectfully disagree on the perfect aspect. But then perfection is in the eyes of the beholder. what I would view as perfection some others would find fault with and visa versa.
He was also very socially conservative, and not entirely peaceful. Whipping people in a church is not "peaceful"... This idea that Christ fit in with a modern political ideology is such total rubbish... He taught you about your personal responsibility to yourself and others, not to your nation or the body politic.
but this is why i say he was man, but perfect....he had temptations...all the temptations of man, but still stayed true to his father's will...to goodness and forgiveness... instead of fighting those that came to kill him, he was submissive, in the court systems that he was brought before, he was submisive....giving each entity a chance to show mercy on him to where pilot was feeling those burning coals on his head.... he forgave the other thief on the cross...he died following God's will for perfect man...obeidient, submissive, forgiving of others...''Father, they know not what they do....''.
an example to us on how God would really like us to behave...imho.
where did Jesus whip people in a church damocles? i have NEVER READ THAT IN THE BIBLE....!!!!?????
klaatu
Fusionist
Yes ..Jesus was apolitical .. but he also advised people to pay their taxes and follow the law .. "Render unto Ceasar that which is Ceaser's"
Jesus had a bone to pick with the Jewish hierarchy .... and money changing in Gods Temple was out of bounds ... just as Im sure he would have major problems with the activities that go on in that little city within the big city of Rome.
Jesus had a bone to pick with the Jewish hierarchy .... and money changing in Gods Temple was out of bounds ... just as Im sure he would have major problems with the activities that go on in that little city within the big city of Rome.
klaatu
Fusionist
Palm Sunday Care.. when he entered Temple in Jerusalem during the events of Holy Week .. he chased out the money changers ...
uscitizen
Villified User
Wise move, we beat up on this pretty heavy a few times ion the other board
yes. outside of the TEMPLE he flipped the tables of the money changers BECAUSE they were abusing God's laws by ''selling'' at a high price...the jews their reqiured ''baths'' to enter the temple area....and the Religious Hierarchy were making a pretty penny off of the bathing requirement....by charging them for it.... the money changers were collecting and exchanging money in the temple area for this purpose....for the Religious Leaders...to become overtly wealthy with.
he was NOT in a church, NOR did he WHIP anyone, is what i am saying about the money changer incident... unless damo is speaking about another issue