Newtown - the case for seeing the photos

[Bfgrn]

Yes.

You fucking liar. You KNOW that is not the case. And if you don't, you're a retard. No one is calling for confiscating all guns. The assault weapons ban Feinstein proposed would outlaw specific guns. And confiscation was not part of the bill, firearms already in private hands would not be subject to the new restrictions.

 

[Howey]

Registries have NEVER been effective in solving crimes.

Really?

From today:

OTTAWA—Canada’s gun registry is a cost-effective crime-fighting tool but misunderstood by many Canadians, the RCMP says in a long-awaited report.
The RCMP evaluation of the Canadian Firearms Program was released late Monday after accusations that the federal Conservative government had been deliberately sitting on a report it knew it would give ammunition to advocates of the registry.

With Parliament set to vote on the fate of the long gun registry next month, the RCMP report argues that the “full registry” be maintained, calling it a valuable tool that has helped reduce gun deaths nationwide.

“A high level of compliance of the long gun registry is necessary to provide the enhanced value to investigators utilizing the firearms registry. It is important for officer and public safety and is a legislated requirement for all firearm owners,” the report notes.

Meanwhile, NDP Leader Jack Layton is proposing a last-minute compromise he hopes will save the registry while addressing some of the concerns that gun owners and native groups have, but the NDP’s proposed bill appears to stand little chance of going anywhere given the division in Parliament.

The Toronto MP told reporters he will vote next month against a Conservative private member’s bill to end the controversial long-gun registry but acknowledged that others in his caucus, who are going to support it, could well tip the balance for the Conservatives.

The Conservatives have been steadfast in their pledge to eliminate the long gun registry, painting it as a waste of money that only ensnares law-abiding gun owners, like hunters, in government red tape.

But some police officers have fought that move, arguing that the registry is a vital tool for officer safety.

And the RCMP report notes that the majority of firearms are long guns and the “majority of firearm deaths in Canada are caused by long guns.” It also notes that over the last decade, long guns were used to kill ten out of thirteen police officers.

“Without registration there is a failure of accountability on behalf of the owner, and it is registration that drives accountability. Without registration, anyone can buy and sell firearms privately and there would be no record,” the report notes.

Among its key recommendations:

•Firearms registration is a critical component of the entire firearms program. The program, as a whole, is an important tool for law enforcement. It also serves to increase the accountability of firearms owners for their firearms.

•Canadians are receiving value for their tax dollars from the Canadian Firearms Program. Overall, the Canadian Firearms Program is cost-effective in reducing firearms-related crime and promoting public safety.

•That the existing full registry be maintained.

The Canadian Firearms Program administers the registry but also oversees a variety of other programs aimed at boosting firearms safety across the country. The 168-page report makes recommendations on other aspects of the program’s mandate, such as training.

But it will be its findings around the registry that prove most explosive in the days ahead as critics and advocates argue the conclusions.

The report also concedes that the political talk has hampered the message from the firearms program.

“The on-going political debate around the value of Canadian Firearms Program has posed challenges for effective communication,” the report says
“There is a further need to communicate that firearms are an important public safety issue,” it says.

The report urges the RCMP to “provide clear and consistent communications to Canadians on firearms and related public safety issues.”

The report says that a searchable database of gun owners and firearms makes officers responding to a call aware of potential risks and helps investigators probing gun crimes.
It says that registration helps reduce the proliferation of firearms. And it cites emergency room physicians who say there has been a “significant” reduction in firearm-related suicides and partner homicides since the registry was created in 1995.

Just weeks ago, RCMP Chief Superintendent Marty Cheliak was removed from his position as director general of the national firearms program. Critics and observers have accused the Conservatives of political interference because Cheliak was a strong supporter of the long-gun registry.

 

[Howey]

Yes, as there is no evidence of any registry being used to as a basis for solving a crime. Secondly, you're claiming registries don't exist already. There are ton's of registries through the nation.

Get some salve for your butthurt, Billy.

 

[Topspin]

France has 12,000,000 guns
So if we cut ours to about 50 million guns we'd cut the murder rate 75 percent.

 

[Billy the Great Khan]

You fucking liar. You KNOW that is not the case. And if you don't, you're a retard. No one is calling for confiscating all guns. The assault weapons ban Feinstein proposed would outlaw specific guns. And confiscation was not part of the bill, firearms already in private hands would not be subject to the new restrictions.

 

[Topspin]

People on Mississippi are dumber than alabubba.

 

[Rune]

You fucking liar. You KNOW that is not the case. And if you don't, you're a retard. No one is calling for confiscating all guns. The assault weapons ban Feinstein proposed would outlaw specific guns. And confiscation was not part of the bill, firearms already in private hands would not be subject to the new restrictions.

!. No, Billy is not lying.
2. It is you who is ignorant, you have the wool pulled over your eyes, you are a sheep, and a fearful one at that.

There is no doubt whatsoever (except in the minds of simpletons) that all gun control measures have an ultimate goal, the elimination of privately owned guns.

When that finally happens we will be completely enmeshed in a totalitarian government where no rights whatsoever will exist and there will be no escape. Think Joseph Stalin if Hitler does not work for you.

 

[Bfgrn]

Well now we know you're not only a fucking lair, you're fucking stupid too. What Feinstein was talking about was assault weapons, not ALL weapons.

Discussing why the 1994 act only prohibited the manufacture or import of assault weapons, instead of the possession and sale of them, Feinstein said on CBS-TV's 60 Minutes, February 5, 1995, "If I could have gotten 51 votes in the Senate of the United States for an outright ban, picking up every one of them . . . Mr. and Mrs. America, turn 'em all in, I would have done it. I could not do that. The votes weren't here." wiki

It's 2013...

Bill Summary & Status
113th Congress (2013 - 2014)
S.150
CRS Summary

SUMMARY AS OF:
3/14/2013--Reported to Senate amended.

Assault Weapons Ban of 2013 - (Sec. 3) Amends the federal criminal code to ban the import, sale, manufacture, transfer, or possession of a semiautomatic assault weapon, including:

• a semiautomatic rifle that can accept a detachable magazine and has any one of the following characteristics: (1) a pistol grip; (2) a forward grip; (3) a folding, telescoping, or detachable stock; (4) a grenade or rocket launcher; (5) a barrel shroud; or (6) a threaded barrel;

• a semiautomatic rifle or pistol with a fixed magazine that can accept more than 10 rounds;

• a semiautomatic pistol that can accept a detachable magazine and has any one of the following characteristics: (1) a threaded barrel, (2) a second pistol grip, (3) a barrel shroud, (4) the capacity to accept a detachable magazine at some location outside of the pistol grip, or (5) a semiautomatic version of an automatic firearm;

• a semiautomatic shotgun that has any one of the following characteristics: (1) a folding, telescoping, or detachable stock; (2) a pistol grip; (3) a fixed magazine that can accept more than five rounds; (4) the ability to accept a detachable magazine; (5) a forward grip; or (6) a grenade or rocket launcher;

• a shotgun with a revolving cylinder;

• firearms that are specifically listed as prohibited by this Act and copies, duplicates, variants, or altered facsimiles with the capability of any such weapon;

• all belt-fed semiautomatic firearms;

• any combination of parts from which any such prohibited firearm can be assembled; and
• the frame or receiver of a prohibited rifle or shotgun.

Excludes from such ban any semiautomatic assault weapon that: (1) is lawfully possessed on the date of enactment of this Act (grandfathered weapon); (2) is manually operated by bolt, pump, lever, or slide action; (3) has been rendered permanently inoperable; (4) is an antique firearm; or (5) is used for law enforcement or security purposes or for testing or experimentation authorized by the Attorney General.

 

[Billy the Great Khan]

Well now we know you're not only a fucking lair, you're fucking stupid too. What Feinstein was talking about was assault weapons, not ALL weapons.

Discussing why the 1994 act only prohibited the manufacture or import of assault weapons, instead of the possession and sale of them, Feinstein said on CBS-TV's 60 Minutes, February 5, 1995, "If I could have gotten 51 votes in the Senate of the United States for an outright ban, picking up every one of them . . . Mr. and Mrs. America, turn 'em all in, I would have done it. I could not do that. The votes weren't here." wiki

It's 2013...

Bill Summary & Status
113th Congress (2013 - 2014)
S.150
CRS Summary

SUMMARY AS OF:
3/14/2013--Reported to Senate amended.

Assault Weapons Ban of 2013 - (Sec. 3) Amends the federal criminal code to ban the import, sale, manufacture, transfer, or possession of a semiautomatic assault weapon, including:

• a semiautomatic rifle that can accept a detachable magazine and has any one of the following characteristics: (1) a pistol grip; (2) a forward grip; (3) a folding, telescoping, or detachable stock; (4) a grenade or rocket launcher; (5) a barrel shroud; or (6) a threaded barrel;

• a semiautomatic rifle or pistol with a fixed magazine that can accept more than 10 rounds;

• a semiautomatic pistol that can accept a detachable magazine and has any one of the following characteristics: (1) a threaded barrel, (2) a second pistol grip, (3) a barrel shroud, (4) the capacity to accept a detachable magazine at some location outside of the pistol grip, or (5) a semiautomatic version of an automatic firearm;

• a semiautomatic shotgun that has any one of the following characteristics: (1) a folding, telescoping, or detachable stock; (2) a pistol grip; (3) a fixed magazine that can accept more than five rounds; (4) the ability to accept a detachable magazine; (5) a forward grip; or (6) a grenade or rocket launcher;

• a shotgun with a revolving cylinder;

• firearms that are specifically listed as prohibited by this Act and copies, duplicates, variants, or altered facsimiles with the capability of any such weapon;

• all belt-fed semiautomatic firearms;

• any combination of parts from which any such prohibited firearm can be assembled; and
• the frame or receiver of a prohibited rifle or shotgun.

Excludes from such ban any semiautomatic assault weapon that: (1) is lawfully possessed on the date of enactment of this Act (grandfathered weapon); (2) is manually operated by bolt, pump, lever, or slide action; (3) has been rendered permanently inoperable; (4) is an antique firearm; or (5) is used for law enforcement or security purposes or for testing or experimentation authorized by the Attorney General.

Well for starters I wasn't just talking nationally you fucking retard. There are various state level bill proposed that called for various levels of confiscation. But no, Feinstein said ALL therefore I can only assume she meant ALL. Unless the word all means some now. You do have varying definitions for words it seems. Like where it says rights of the people. Sometimes you think it means the people and sometimes you think it measn not the people. I think you should publish a leftist dictionary to avoid confusion.

 

[Bfgrn]

!. No, Billy is not lying.
2. It is you who is ignorant, you have the wool pulled over your eyes, you are a sheep, and a fearful one at that.

There is no doubt whatsoever (except in the minds of simpletons) that all gun control measures have an ultimate goal, the elimination of privately owned guns.

When that finally happens we will be completely enmeshed in a totalitarian government where no rights whatsoever will exist and there will be no escape. Think Joseph Stalin if Hitler does not work for you.

OK. It's on record that I tried to have a civil conversation with you. Post 105

You are not a liberal. You have a right wing brain. A right wing brain is infested with FEAR, paranoia, conspiracies, slippery slopes and massive ignorance. There is biological proof.

A study at University College London found that the right wing brain infested with FEAR, paranoia, conspiracies, slippery slopes and massive ignorance had a larger amygdala than liberals. The amygdala is an almond-shaped structure deep in the brain that is active during states of fear and anxiety. Liberals had more gray matter at least in the anterior cingulate cortex, a region of the brain that helps people cope with complexity.

Specifically, the research shows that people with conservative tendencies have a larger amygdala and a smaller anterior cingulate than other people. The amygdala — typically thought of as the “primitive brain” — is responsible for reflexive impulses, like fear. The anterior cingulate is thought to be responsible for courage and optimism. This one-two punch could be responsible for many of the anecdotal claims that conservatives “think differently” from others.

You are OFFICIALLY a PEA brain...

 

[Bfgrn]

Well for starters I wasn't just talking nationally you fucking retard. There are various state level bill proposed that called for various levels of confiscation. But no, Feinstein said ALL therefore I can only assume she meant ALL. Unless the word all means some now. You do have varying definitions for words it seems. Like where it says rights of the people. Sometimes you think it means the people and sometimes you think it measn not the people. I think you should publish a leftist dictionary to avoid confusion.

Ah, pea brain, when you are talking Feinstein you ARE talking nationally. Feinstein is a US Senator. But as far as 'all', you right wing turds need it to mean all guns, because then it would match YOUR absolutism and extremism. You right wing fear infested cretins are incapable of reasonable debate on firearms, common sense laws or anything other than your absolutism and extremism.

 

[Billy the Great Khan]

Ah, pea brain, when you are talking Feinstein you ARE talking nationally. Feinstein is a US Senator. But as far as 'all', you right wing turds need it to mean all guns, because then it would match YOUR absolutism and extremism. You right wing fear infested cretins are incapable of reasonable debate on firearms, common sense laws or anything other than your absolutism and extremism.

And what 'reasonable' laws have been proposed? I must have missed them.

 

[tekkychick]

In one way, the conservatives are correct - California is confiscating guns. They are going through lists of people who shouldn't own guns -felons, spousal abusers, etc - and comparing them to the list of people with guns to see if they got one before the offense that got them on the "no buy" list. They are then going out and getting the guns back from these people.

But these people would not pass the background check if they tried to buy a gun today. They are not supposed to be in possession of firearms anymore. I don't know how anyone can object to this.

 

[SmarterthanYou]

And yet I managed somewhat better than that.

As far as the previous reply and a gun registry... It is true that a gun registry that does not exist will have no evidence of solving a crime.

But, knowing what gun was used and who it belonged to has helped convict murderers.
Do you claim otherwise?

Canada had a long gun registry for over a decade. not a single crime was solved and over 2 BILLION was spent on it. Massachussetts has a ballistics registry/database and not a single crime has been solved with it. over 50 million spent on it.

 

[SmarterthanYou]

You fucking liar. You KNOW that is not the case. And if you don't, you're a retard. No one is calling for confiscating all guns. The assault weapons ban Feinstein proposed would outlaw specific guns. And confiscation was not part of the bill, firearms already in private hands would not be subject to the new restrictions.

but in some of the bills, transfers to direct relatives was not possible, so explain how that is not confiscation at the end of your life????

 

[SmarterthanYou]

OK. It's on record that I tried to have a civil conversation with you. Post 105

You are not a liberal. You have a right wing brain. A right wing brain is infested with FEAR, paranoia, conspiracies, slippery slopes and massive ignorance. There is biological proof.

A study at University College London found that the right wing brain infested with FEAR, paranoia, conspiracies, slippery slopes and massive ignorance had a larger amygdala than liberals. The amygdala is an almond-shaped structure deep in the brain that is active during states of fear and anxiety. Liberals had more gray matter at least in the anterior cingulate cortex, a region of the brain that helps people cope with complexity.

Specifically, the research shows that people with conservative tendencies have a larger amygdala and a smaller anterior cingulate than other people. The amygdala — typically thought of as the “primitive brain” — is responsible for reflexive impulses, like fear. The anterior cingulate is thought to be responsible for courage and optimism. This one-two punch could be responsible for many of the anecdotal claims that conservatives “think differently” from others.

You are OFFICIALLY a PEA brain...

ROFL, rune has a right wing brain????? and studies?????? really????

 

[SmarterthanYou]

Ah, pea brain, when you are talking Feinstein you ARE talking nationally. Feinstein is a US Senator. But as far as 'all', you right wing turds need it to mean all guns, because then it would match YOUR absolutism and extremism. You right wing fear infested cretins are incapable of reasonable debate on firearms, common sense laws or anything other than your absolutism and extremism.

there is no common sense in restricting the types of guns when the 2nd Amendment is adhered to.

 

[Rune]

ROFL, rune has a right wing brain????? and studies?????? really????

Thanks, His position is so wacked that it is hard to take seriously.

 

[SmarterthanYou]

In one way, the conservatives are correct - California is confiscating guns. They are going through lists of people who shouldn't own guns -felons, spousal abusers, etc - and comparing them to the list of people with guns to see if they got one before the offense that got them on the "no buy" list. They are then going out and getting the guns back from these people.

But these people would not pass the background check if they tried to buy a gun today. They are not supposed to be in possession of firearms anymore. I don't know how anyone can object to this.

congress has no power to disarm anyone, according to the founders. now, cali apparently has not right to bear arms amendment, but mcdonald v. chicago applied the 2nd to the states, so yes we can certainly object to this.

 

[tekkychick]

congress has no power to disarm anyone, according to the founders. now, cali apparently has not right to bear arms amendment, but mcdonald v. chicago applied the 2nd to the states, so yes we can certainly object to this.

So you're ok with felons, spouse abusers, etc owning guns? Wow. No idea where to go with that. Except to feel sorry for your lack of ethics.